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*Unofficial* New Zealand Black Caps Thread

thundaboult

International Debutant
Is there still the Champions Trophy?
In the bin. Permanently replaced by the t20 wc. Good move imo. Each format has a world cup now. Test cricket makes much more sense now with qualification points on the line rather a silly little urn that only two countries "care" about. And the ODI format doesn't need 2 tournaments anymore anyways.
 

Immenso

International Vice-Captain
So only 2 ICC tournaments every 4 years now, instead of 4 we had a few years ago.

That will hurt the non big-3s in the pocket big time.

Bugger.

Even more reliant on getting incoming Big 3 tours.
 

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Sears needs to take some wickets for Wellington first. He’s looked pretty average this season and bowled some awful garbage in his comeback T20 last week.
 

Kippax

Cricketer Of The Year
Yeah, I suppose you've just got to be mindful of the fact NZ domestic T20 success isn't looked to as a trusty omen of too much anymore. There are these players like Nick Kelly/Mark Chapman/Josh Clarkson who often do exceptionally well despite everyone knowing that there are horribly weak aspects of their batting that the Super Smash just isn't really a stern enough examination to expose. Not quite varied enough in what it asks of players either tbh, the diligent NZ groundsmen just laying on at minimum a 6/10 pitch for T20 batting, more often it'll be a 9/10. Very rarely you might get one that's slightly lower than a 6, like ND's tactical ploy at Seddon Park last Monday.

I've always had Allen smack-bang in the sweet spot to do well in a NZ domestic T20 environment. I've started making quite a bit on him now, just by plugging away inside my winning zone...



Only two men outside the circle, no bowler-friendly Dookaburra new ball to worry about in this format, lots of dimestore hoods trying to bowl into his pull shot where he's never really been weak. He's also never had too many difficulties imparting some power into a spinning/holding ball like these Clarksons (even Conways) have trouble with.
 
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SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year

Look, I'm not a fan of the guy particularly - I don't think he's that good, and he was obviously well at fault in the night in question.

But can we move on? You don't have to like the guy, but even the Women's Refuge CEO is saying he should have a chance to make good. And he should. He made a mistake, a poor judgement, an abhorrent act whatever when drunk. Once. (once is all we can say, we have no evidence otherwise). Let the guy get on with his life and learn from it.
 

GoodAreasShane

Cricketer Of The Year
Just so you know, he'd hardly be the Lone Ranger in professional sport. Not even close.
I know. Was just calling for Nikita Mazepin to be given his marching orders on a completely different corner of the internet.


Whataboutism of the highest order
 

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Wonder if the victim has been able to move on with her life just like that.
I hope she's been able to. Under this premise, do you think he should have to suffer those sorts of headlines, the placards at games, have a national news agency seemingly question the legitimacy of him playing in a Women's Refuge game for the rest of his life or until the woman has been able to move on? Is that a fair sort of eye for an eye response? Honest question.

Interesting that the Women's Refuge game would have received little or no publicity had Kuggeleijn not been playing in it. So they're more interested in the clickbait and the headline than they would be promoting a very worthy cause.
 

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
I know. Was just calling for Nikita Mazepin to be given his marching orders on a completely different corner of the internet.


Whataboutism of the highest order
But even then, you want to condemn a 21 year old drunk on the fumes of money and fame for the rest of his life based on one incident, however putrid it was? Jeepers, a lot of us never made a mistake did we. I'm all for losing sponsors, being suspended, fined all that stuff... but **** me, to err is human. We're all fallible. Some more than others.
 

The Hutt Rec

International Vice-Captain
I hope she's been able to. Under this premise, do you think he should have to suffer those sorts of headlines, the placards at games, have a national news agency seemingly question the legitimacy of him playing in a Women's Refuge game for the rest of his life or until the woman has been able to move on? Is that a fair sort of eye for an eye response? Honest question.

Interesting that the Women's Refuge game would have received little or no publicity had Kuggeleijn not been playing in it. So they're more interested in the clickbait and the headline than they would be promoting a very worthy cause.
Well it's up to people whether they want to keep asking these questions, I would say you'll see people boycotting games and bringing it up for a while to come yet. And I get that there's not much he can do, but the brush it under the carpet stance from NZC has probably made things worse.

I have to say I saw a heap of promotion around the Women's Refuge charity for this match ... maybe it was through following Wellington Cricket social media? They raised money for 500 refuge nights as the game today, which at $20 each comes to $10,000 donations from the crowd, definitely something to be proud of!
 

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Well it's up to people whether they want to keep asking these questions, I would say you'll see people boycotting games and bringing it up for a while to come yet. And I get that there's not much he can do, but the brush it under the carpet stance from NZC has probably made things worse.

I have to say I saw a heap of promotion around the Women's Refuge charity for this match ... maybe it was through following Wellington Cricket social media? They raised money for 500 refuge nights as the game today, which at $20 each comes to $10,000 donations from the crowd, definitely something to be proud of!
Of course it's up to people, I just wondered whether anyone felt like me.

One thing I know, the promo wasn't through Stuff. Virtue signalling, woke bloody pissant media outlet it is (nothing to do with Kuggeleijn)
 

Flem274*

123/5
But even then, you want to condemn a 21 year old drunk on the fumes of money and fame for the rest of his life based on one incident, however putrid it was? Jeepers, a lot of us never made a mistake did we. I'm all for losing sponsors, being suspended, fined all that stuff... but **** me, to err is human. We're all fallible. Some more than others.
it's the lack of remorse i think that gets people. he was not guilty in the eyes of the law, but he certainly wasn't innocent and sports stars get different treatment to the layman (you or i would be posting this from a small cell in his place). i want the justice system to be rehabilitative where possible so im not one for holding things over people forever but there's no doubt kuggeleijn needs to regain a lot of credit with nz. a simple "i was a terrible bloke" would be a start, but we haven't got one.

i suspect nzc firmly control everything he says to media and probably told him any line deviating from the "im just looking to enjoy my cricket" that he says all the time gets him fired forever.
 

nzfan

International Vice-Captain
IMO the court has ruled him not guilty and if you respect the law of the land then you have to accept the verdict and move on. What's he supposed to do? Stop playing cricket? That's his primary occupation. Say if he was an electrician and was ruled not guilty. Even after the verdict should he stop practicing his primary occupation? I don't know what's he supposed to do here.

If he said anything in public he'll be crucified nevertheless. If he said I was a terrible bloke like you mentioned above then all hell will break lose and they will start saying he's guilty while the court says he's not. I know the technicalities mean despite him being an idiot/commit a felony he may have been ruled not guilty. All he could do was hire a lawyer and present his case.

Best for him and NZC to say nothing about this. Maybe NZC can officially release a statement otherwise this will carry on forever. I don't think he should say a thing about this in public. It will only make the matters worse.
 

_Ed_

Request Your Custom Title Now!
He made a mistake, a poor judgement, an abhorrent act whatever when drunk. Once. (once is all we can say, we have no evidence otherwise).
Not necessarily.
The charges are related to allegations by two separate victims of two different incidents that took place in March and May 2015.

The allegation of ***ual violation by way of rape is related to an incident on May 17, while the allegations of indecent assault pertain to incidents that took place between March 2 and 6.
Just because the alleged victim in the second instance decided not to go through the ordeal of a trial (and it absolutely is an ordeal), doesn't mean nothing untoward happened.
 

thierry henry

International Coach
he was not guilty in the eyes of the law, but he certainly wasn't innocent and sports stars get different treatment to the layman (you or i would be posting this from a small cell in his place).
Massive question marks over this tbh. People get found not guilty in iffy, he said/she said ***ual assault cases all the time. I seriously doubt whether his ‘status’ as a fringe international cricketer played much of a role in the deliberations of 12 jurors, most of whom probably had little idea who he was or didn’t give a ****.
 

Chewie

International Vice-Captain
I think that often it's in sentencing where the effect of the sentence on his career is sometimes considered to see whether it's disproportionate and where you might see promising rugby players for example afforded a more lenient sentence
 

thierry henry

International Coach
I think that often it's in sentencing where the effect of the sentence on his career is sometimes considered to see whether it's disproportionate and where you might see promising rugby players for example afforded a more lenient sentence
Exactly...I’m not sure to what extent his cricket career would’ve even come out in evidence, even if it did it strikes me as highly unlikely it would’ve been much of a factor in the guilty/not guilty deliberations of the jurors
 

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