The Great Allrounders in County Cricket

[Coronis]

Anyone know how Garth le Roux fared. Probably a little short of these guys on the batting front, but bowling would be interesting as he played in the same team as Imran.

(78-87)
137 matches 3341 @ 28 18 50’s
393 @ 23 SR 50 15 5’fers 1 10’fer
40 catches

 

[the big bambino]

Thank you for this information! As a big Hadlee fan, I knew that he had incredible bowling stats in CC. However, I also know that, as Hadlee's Notts team-mate Derek Randall said (in an August 2013 interview at https://leftlion.co.uk/features/201...ttinghamshire-england-test-cricket-cricketer/), their groundsman, Ron Allsopp, sometimes misplaced his mower. As in every week! (I've paraphrased his words) By contrast, I have read (I don't know whether or not it's true) that when Malcolm Marshall bowled at Hampshire, it was often on flat tracks. So I think it would be VERY interesting to see home and away CC stats for the above six cricketers, and for Marshall as well. I know this could be a big ask as such information may be hard to obtain so if it's too much trouble, don't worry about it. Thanks in advance!

I haven’t been on since it became a pay site but I remember cricketarchive having a search filter which could give you that info for all six. I see Coronis has given you figures for Hadlee already.

Imo Hadlee’s record puts him no.1. I was surprised how well he batted. I’m not surprised at Botham’s figures as he seems like a player who needed a stage to motivate him. Perhaps the day to day of county cricket didn’t do that for him.

 

[Coronis]

I haven’t been on since it became a pay site but I remember cricketarchive having a search filter which could give you that info for all six. I see Coronis has given you figures for Hadlee already.

Imo Hadlee’s record puts him no.1. I was surprised how well he batted. I’m not surprised at Botham’s figures as he seems like a player who needed a stage to motivate him. Perhaps the day to day of county cricket didn’t do that for him.

I’m definitely not sneaking behind a paywall to see these stats.

 

[ankitj]

Kapil has superb averages. Very few matches though

 

[shortpitched713]

So we all know the big four AR’s of the 80’s. All did play county and I’m also adding in the records of Procter and Rice, just for some comparison. (unfortunately the sites don’t have no. of innings bowled)

Procter (68-81)
259 matches 437 innings 14441 @ 36.19 32 tons 70 fifties 209 catches
259 matches 833 @ 19.56 SR 45.95 42 5’fers 5 10’fers

Imran (71-88)
173 matches 279 innings 8847 @ 38.30 17 tons 51 fifties 51 catches
173 matches 537 @ 21.08 SR 47.92 27 5’fers 2 10’fers

Hadlee (73-87)
148 matches 196 innings 5854 @ 38.76 11 tons 29 fifties 105 catches
148 matches 622 @ 14.51 SR 40.15 38 5’fers 5 10’fers

Rice (73-87)
283 matches 450 innings 17053 @ 44.29 37 tons 85 innings 268 catches
283 matches 476 @ 23.58 SR 54.53 12 5’fers 0 10’fers

Botham (74-93)
251 matches 379 innings 11904 @ 35.32 22 tons 60 fifties 184 catches
251 matches 659 @ 27.22 SR 53.16 28 5’fers 3 10’fers

Kapil (81-85)
24 matches 40 innings 1456 @ 42.82 1 ton 11 fifties 21 catches
24 matches 72 @ 22.55 SR 50.11 2 5’fers 0 10’fers

Draw what conclusions from this you will.

Botham the worst of the lot, as expected.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Any cc stats for Kevin Curran (Zimbabwean allrounder and father of Sam and Tom)?

Not to be confused with Kevin Curren (SA tennis player).

 

[shortpitched713]

And although Hadlee is the best bowler of the lot, in actual Test competition he's not THAT much better of a bowler. He must have had some special techniques or insights to really make hay against FC opponents especially the lower end of the batsmen quality, to be able to have such ridiculous numbers, which didn't translate as much against the cream of Test cricket.

 

[the big bambino]

I’m definitely not sneaking behind a paywall to see these stats.

Me neither. I'm still outraged!

 

[reyrey]

(78-87)
137 matches 3341 @ 28 18 50’s
393 @ 23 SR 50 15 5’fers 1 10’fer
40 catches

Not far off those others names. South Africa would have had some Test team in that era!

Yeah Hadlee would be the clear 1st pick here and then close between Procter and Imran. I'd take Proctor, then Imran and then Rice, but you have a winning picking choosing any of them really.

Bothams bowling really dropped off his early success, so no huge surprise there.

Kapil had a poor bowling record in Tests in England so it's a pleasant surprise to see he did well during his CC stint.

Would have been a great time to be a CC fan.

 

[Coronis]

Just for a comparison too re: actual runs per innings and tons.

Runs per innings
Procter 33.05
Imran 31.71
Botham 31.41
Hadlee 29.87

Innings per ton
Procter 13.66
Imran 16.41
Botham 17.23
Hadlee 17.82

 

[Swamp Witch Hattie]

And although Hadlee is the best bowler of the lot, in actual Test competition he's not THAT much better of a bowler. He must have had some special techniques or insights to really make hay against FC opponents especially the lower end of the batsmen quality, to be able to have such ridiculous numbers, which didn't translate as much against the cream of Test cricket.

He did have Rice helping him out and missed that level of penetrative support in Tests.

 

[reyrey]

He did have Rice helping him out and missed that level of penetrative support in Tests.

Although not listed I'd guess his economy rate was better here too than tests as he wouldn't need to go searching for wickets as much or go trying to make things happen. Strike rate wise he's probably just slightly higher than Waqar in CC

 

[Coronis]

Although not listed I'd guess his economy rate was better here too than tests as he wouldn't need to go searching for wickets as much or trying to make things happen. Strike rate wise he's probably just slightly higher than Waqar in CC

2.17 vs 2.63 in tests

 

[Swamp Witch Hattie]

Any cc stats for Kevin Curran (Zimbabwean allrounder and father of Sam and Tom)?

Not to be confused with Kevin Curren (SA tennis player).

Kevin Curran: 10 interesting things to know about the late Zimbabwean all-rounder - Cricket Country

A hard-hitting batsman and bowler capable of hitting high speeds, Curran was an integral part of Zimbabwe's ODI side despite playing only a handful of games.

www.cricketcountry.com

:



So:

Gloucestershire:

139 matches, 6,765 runs at 38.43, 16 100s and 27 50s

239 wickets at 26.39, 9 5WI and 3 10WM

Northamptonshire:

139 matches, 6,990 runs at 38.19, 6 100s and 48 50s

271 wickets at 30.18, 5 5WI (and presumably 0 10WM)

(for some reason, he did not have the same conversion rate of 50s into 100s at Northants; I don't think these numbers are necessarily wrong as the figures are consistent with those at Wikipedia (see below))

Overall:

278 matches, 13,755 runs at 38.31, 22 100s and 75 50s

510 wickets at 28.40, 14 5WI and 3 10WM

I don't have information on his number of catches in CC but we can estimate it:

from Wikipedia:



209 catches in 324 FC matches (no Tests) so in 278 CC matches, we might estimate 278/324 * 209 = 179 catches.

Something odd I came across: his entry at HowSTAT has not yet been updated to reflect his death in 2012 at the age of 53:

Kevin Curran - Profile & Statistical Summary - ODI World Cups

Kevin M Curran - One Day International World Cup, statistical overview, batting graphs, bowling graphs, performances by ground, performances by opponent, performances by year, performances by series, performances by batting position, analysis of dismissals, list of innings, partnership records...

www.howstat.com

 

[Coronis]

Kevin Curran: 10 interesting things to know about the late Zimbabwean all-rounder - Cricket Country

A hard-hitting batsman and bowler capable of hitting high speeds, Curran was an integral part of Zimbabwe's ODI side despite playing only a handful of games.

www.cricketcountry.com

:

View attachment 41203

So:

Gloucestershire:

139 matches, 6,765 runs at 38.43, 16 100s and 27 50s

239 wickets at 26.39, 9 5WI and 3 10WM

Northamptonshire:

139 matches, 6,990 runs at 38.19, 6 100s and 48 50s

271 wickets at 30.18, 5 5WI (and presumably 0 10WM)

(for some reason, he did not have the same conversion rate of 50s into 100s at Northants; I don't think these numbers are necessarily wrong as the figures are consistent with those at Wikipedia (see below))

Overall:

278 matches, 13,755 runs at 38.31, 22 100s and 75 50s

510 wickets at 28.40, 14 5WI and 3 10WM

I don't have information on his number of catches in CC but we can estimate it:

from Wikipedia:

View attachment 41204

209 catches in 324 FC matches (no Tests) so in 278 CC matches, we might estimate 278/324 * 209 = 179 catches.

Something odd I came across: his entry at HowSTAT has not yet been updated to reflect his death in 2012 at the age of 53:

Kevin Curran - Profile & Statistical Summary - ODI World Cups

Kevin M Curran - One Day International World Cup, statistical overview, batting graphs, bowling graphs, performances by ground, performances by opponent, performances by year, performances by series, performances by batting position, analysis of dismissals, list of innings, partnership records...

www.howstat.com

Probably just age lessening his abilities, mainly stamina and hand eye coordination? He played for Gloucestershire first (age 25-30) then Northamptonshire (age 31-39). The fact he managed to retain a similar average just shows he was more consistent but less able to continue on from his starts.

 

[peterhrt]

Mushtaq Mohammad: 262 matches 1964-77
15961 runs @ 39.12. 32 centuries
551 wickets @ 24.00. 175 ct.

Greig: 209 matches 1966-78
9528 runs @ 28.27. 14 centuries
509 wickets @ 28.56. 187 ct.

Like Botham, enjoyed the social side.

Some older ones when there were more county matches:

Grace: 360 matches 1870-99
22808 runs @ 40.51. 50 centuries
1339 wickets @ 18.48. 377 ct + 4 st.

Hirst: 717 matches 1891-1929
32035 runs @ 34.74. 56 centuries
2477 wickets @ 18.01. 520 ct.

Rhodes: 883 matches 1898-1930
31098 runs @ 30.04. 46 centuries
3597 wickets @ 16.02. 587 ct.

Tarrant: 206 matches 1904-14
12169 runs @ 38.02. 26 centuries
1005 wickets @ 17.43. 193 ct.

Woolley: 764 matches 1906-38
47868 runs @ 41.76. 122 centuries
1680 wickets @ 18.84. 773 ct.

Jack Hearne: 465 matches 1909-36
27612 runs @ 41.15. 71 centuries
1438 wickets @ 23.16. 237 ct.

 

[howitzer]

Mushtaq Mohammad: 262 matches 1964-77
15961 runs @ 39.12. 32 centuries
551 wickets @ 24.00. 175 ct.

Greig: 209 matches 1966-78
9528 runs @ 28.27. 14 centuries
509 wickets @ 28.56. 187 ct.

Like Botham, enjoyed the social side.

Some older ones when there were more county matches:

Grace: 360 matches 1870-99
22808 runs @ 40.51. 50 centuries
1339 wickets @ 18.48. 377 ct + 4 st.

Hirst: 717 matches 1891-1929
32035 runs @ 34.74. 56 centuries
2477 wickets @ 18.01. 520 ct.

Rhodes: 883 matches 1898-1930
31098 runs @ 30.04. 46 centuries
3597 wickets @ 16.02. 587 ct.

Tarrant: 206 matches 1904-14
12169 runs @ 38.02. 26 centuries
1005 wickets @ 17.43. 193 ct.

Woolley: 764 matches 1906-38
47868 runs @ 41.76. 122 centuries
1680 wickets @ 18.84. 773 ct.

Jack Hearne: 465 matches 1909-36
27612 runs @ 41.15. 71 centuries
1438 wickets @ 23.16. 237 ct.

Not bad that for Tarrant. Good WPM there.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Mushtaq Mohammad: 262 matches 1964-77
15961 runs @ 39.12. 32 centuries
551 wickets @ 24.00. 175 ct.

Greig: 209 matches 1966-78
9528 runs @ 28.27. 14 centuries
509 wickets @ 28.56. 187 ct.

Like Botham, enjoyed the social side.

Some older ones when there were more county matches:

Grace: 360 matches 1870-99
22808 runs @ 40.51. 50 centuries
1339 wickets @ 18.48. 377 ct + 4 st.

Hirst: 717 matches 1891-1929
32035 runs @ 34.74. 56 centuries
2477 wickets @ 18.01. 520 ct.

Rhodes: 883 matches 1898-1930
31098 runs @ 30.04. 46 centuries
3597 wickets @ 16.02. 587 ct.

Tarrant: 206 matches 1904-14
12169 runs @ 38.02. 26 centuries
1005 wickets @ 17.43. 193 ct.

Woolley: 764 matches 1906-38
47868 runs @ 41.76. 122 centuries
1680 wickets @ 18.84. 773 ct.

Jack Hearne: 465 matches 1909-36
27612 runs @ 41.15. 71 centuries
1438 wickets @ 23.16. 237 ct.

Thanks Peterhrt. Surprised by Greig's batting really, looks quite poor compared to his Test performances. Also, didn't knew Grace has kept wickets!!?

 

[peterhrt]

Thanks Peterhrt. Surprised by Greig's batting really, looks quite poor compared to his Test performances. Also, didn't knew Grace has kept wickets!!?

Grace kept wicket occasionally when the regular keeper suffered an injury. In the first innings of a county match against Yorkshire he bowled 54 overs then took the gloves and completed a stumping off his elder brother's bowling.

At the time It was generally thought that Greig over-achieved in Tests. The South Africans reckoned he wouldn't have made their side and Greig agreed. Mushtaq was a contemporary and considered in England to be a better all-round cricketer. He bowled less in Tests than his ability warranted due to the presence of Intikhab.

 

[Swamp Witch Hattie]

Probably just age lessening his abilities, mainly stamina and hand eye coordination? He played for Gloucestershire first (age 25-30) then Northamptonshire (age 31-39). The fact he managed to retain a similar average just shows he was more consistent but less able to continue on from his starts.

I never really gave it much thought, I just noticed that Curran's conversion rate from 50 to 100 really dropped off once he was at Northants but your post has got me thinking (and perhaps irresponsibly speculating) a bit more.

In 139 matches at Gloucestershire, he passed 50 a total of 16 + 27 = 43 times and pushed on to 100 16 times giving a conversion rate of 16/43 = 37.2%.

In 139 matches at Northamptonshire, he passed 50 a total of 6 + 48 = 54 times and pushed on to 100 6 times giving a conversion rate of 6/54 = 11.1%.

His conversion rate went down by a factor of 37.2/11.1 = 3.35.

That's a heck of a decline. I'd like to see if that sort of change is typical for other batsmen as they age but I suspect that it wouldn't be. The fact that he was able to pass 50 more times at Northants than at Gloucestershire in the same number of matches tells me that it probably wasn't a hand-eye coordination thing. Your stamina suggestion makes more sense to me.

Curran died in 2012 after collapsing while out jogging. I can't find a definite cause of death but a suspected heart attack was mentioned a few times (even though the man was a fitness fanatic, apparently). Maybe he had an undiagnosed heart condition? Hadlee had something similar (Wolff-Parkinson-White syndrome) which he thinks might have started to affect him for the last few years of his test career. At the time, he put his greater difficulties in recovering from a demanding test match down to aging. A year to the day after he played his last day of test cricket, he underwent open heart surgery.

I'm now wondering whether Curran had some sort of problem with his heart which got worse with age (like with Hadlee) and it might have undermined him at Northants when his innings went on for too long and the aerobic demands became greater. Hence his struggles to push on from 50 to 100.

I'd like to see stats pertaining to the conversion rate from 50 to 100 for other batsmen as they age, limiting the data to when their average doesn't change too much (which was the case for Curran).