The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[TheJediBrah]

Yeah think he might be having you on a bit haha, no where near as good as a de Villiers, Rhodes or Gibbs. Wouldn't be putting big Jacques at point or cover, but a solid enough slip fielder, in a similar vein to a Mark Taylor or Shane Warne (but slightly more athletic).

Mark Taylor has more catches per match than Kallis but I can't see anyone calling him one of the best fielders int he history of the game

 

[Nintendo]

Yeah think he might be having you on a bit haha, no where near as good as a de Villiers, Rhodes or Gibbs. Wouldn't be putting big Jacques at point or cover, but a solid enough slip fielder, in a similar vein to a Mark Taylor or Shane Warne (but slightly more athletic).

Mark Taylor has more catches per match than Kallis but I can't see anyone calling him one of the best fielders int he history of the game

Ok thanks for the information, really appreciate the recount.

 

[OverratedSanity]

In the slips, Kallis was definitely an all time level fielder.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Slightly above average at best for an international slip fielder

 

[kyear2]

:o

he was a solid slipper but this is a stretch

Jacques was well above average as a 2nd slip fielder.
If forced to allocate him, I would say just below that absolute top tier, but he made it all look so effortless.
But yeah, way above solid in the cordon.

 

[kyear2]

Yeah think he might be having you on a bit haha, no where near as good as a de Villiers, Rhodes or Gibbs. Wouldn't be putting big Jacques at point or cover, but a solid enough slip fielder, in a similar vein to a Mark Taylor or Shane Warne (but slightly more athletic).

Mark Taylor has more catches per match than Kallis but I can't see anyone calling him one of the best fielders int he history of the game

In my opinion he was better than Taylor and significantly above Warne in the cordon. He wasn't as AB at 3rd, but he was definitely at an ATG level at slip.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Jacques was well above average as a 2nd slip fielder.
If forced to allocate him, I would say just below that absolute top tier, but he made it all look so effortless.
But yeah, way above solid in the cordon.

Yeah definitely above average. I'd put him above Warne too (Warne was pretty ordinary though).

Don't agree that he was better than Taylor, and he was well below guys like Ponting and M.Waugh. That's my level for "ATG".

 

[Uppercut]

I feel like Ponting went through a phase where he put a few down at slip. I remember him as a quality all-round fielder rather than a slips specialist. I'm sure Kallis dropped a few too but I actually don't think I ever saw it happen.

 

[Furball]

I feel like Ponting went through a phase where he put a few down at slip. I remember him as a quality all-round fielder rather than a slips specialist. I'm sure Kallis dropped a few too but I actually don't think I ever saw it happen.

Did Ponting even field at slip during the great Australian era? Hayden fielded at slip to Warne, and I'm almost certain Hayden and Warne would have been the first two slip catchers to McGrath.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Did Ponting even field at slip during the great Australian era? Hayden fielded at slip to Warne, and I'm almost certain Hayden and Warne would have been the first two slip catchers to McGrath.

Ponting "graduated" to 2nd slip when M.Waugh was dropped. Hayden never fielded 2nd slip, he was slip to Warne and either 1st or 3rd to the quicks, or gully earlier in his career

 

[Gob]

Remember Matt Hayden at gully taking some gooduns while Warne and Ponting respectively at 1st and second.

As for big Jaques, can't remember him dropping many compared to Smith who dropped Plenty. Most notably Ponting of Steyn in Johannesburg 09 when Aust were 3 for **** all on the back of losing the home series few months ago. Ponting hooked the next ball for a dlf maximum and set up the series

 

[kyear2]

Yeah definitely above average. I'd put him above Warne too (Warne was pretty ordinary though).

Don't agree that he was better than Taylor, and he was well below guys like Ponting and M.Waugh. That's my level for "ATG".

That's like saying through that Sobers and Smith are ATG and everyone below them aren't. There's tiers to this. Border is ATG even if he isn't quite the batsmen those two are.

 

[kyear2]

Ponting "graduated" to 2nd slip when M.Waugh was dropped. Hayden never fielded 2nd slip, he was slip to Warne and either 1st or 3rd to the quicks, or gully earlier in his career

Hayden only fielded at slip during Warne's "absence" and he was at 1st, where by the way he was way better than Warne. He fielded at gully to the quicks where he pulled off some blinders.
He did go back to 1st for the spinners sometimes though.

 

[Calm_profit]

Kallis was great but I think Brian Mcmillan was better than him in slips.

 

[kyear2]

Kallis was great but I think Brian Mcmillan was better than him in slips.

I don't think I've ever seen him drop anything. But I have seen better. Hooper, deVIlliers, Richie Richardson, Waugh etc. But doesn't mean he wasn't in that top tier as well

 

[Jayro]

Was Kallis ever dubbed as best (the best) test batsmen of his era/time? There were many other batsman who were scoring with an average above 50 with much better strike rate during his days? Wonder if Sobers was indeed the best batsman easily and also scored more freely at will.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Was Kallis ever dubbed as best (the best) test batsmen of his era/time? There were many other batsman who were scoring with an average above 50 with much better strike rate during his days? Wonder if Sobers was indeed the best batsman easily and also scored more freely at will.

Kallis was the best batsman on his team. Gary Kirsten was a close second.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Kirsten doesn't get talked about enough. Every bit as good as Graeme Smith

 

[Bolo.]

I watched far more of Kallis play than anyone else, and cant remember him shelling a catch in a test. Does anyone?

Of the other guys being talked about, I dont really remember watching Taylor/M Waugh at all, can remember Ponting shelling one or two (but only watched him live less than 1/10 of the amount I did with Kallis) and Smith shelling a number (who was admittedly only considered a very good slipper, not a great one).

 

[Coronis]

Quite bored this particular lockdown night so I was thinking about who I’d send as a 15 man touring squad.

Hobbs
Sutcliffe
Bradman*
Tendulkar
Hammond
Sobers
Gilchrist+
Procter
Marshall
Warne
McGrath

My normal ATG XI, just replacing Wasim with Procter cos why not, adds strength to the batting and another spinner if its turning.

Sangakkara - If Gilly gets injured had to have a backup keeper, obviously can also slot into any of the middle order slots too.
Wasim - Need a fast bowler backup too and I couldn’t not pick him.
Murali - If something happened to Warne, its gotta be Murali.
Miller - The only choice I really struggled with but based on the other 14, he was the best choice imo. Thought about Kallis too but feel like that weakens the bowling too much. If two of the batsmen have been injured the batting order is strong enough to include Miller and it would also give as yet another bowling option, keeping everyone fresh.