The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[Red]

While chatting up with a mate, an idea crossed my mind. How will a combined XI from West Indies of 70's / 80's + Australia of 90's / 00's look like?

Gordon Greenidge
Matthew Hayden
Ricky Ponting
Vivian Richards
Clive Lloyd *
Steve Waugh
Adam Gilchrist +
Shane Warne
Malcolm Marshall
Joel Garner
Glenn McGrath

Torn between Garner and Holding. But what a sight will that be!

2nd XI


Desmond Haynes
Justin Langer
David Boon
Richie Richardson
Michael Clarke
Mike Hussey
Jeff Dujon
Michael Holding
Andy Roberts
Stuart MacGill
Courtney Walsh

 

[Red]

Underrated Australian Cricketers

Sid Barnes - Didn't play enough tests as was weird as anything, but the Don recognised his brilliance when the Invincibles nearly lost a tour match
Bill Lawry- People know he was good, but perhaps he doesn't get full recognition. Dealt with some serious pace bowling and was as tough as anyone, ever
Ian Chappell - Like Lawry, better known for his media now, but was an exceptional batsman, batting at #3 against some great bowling. Average is low in comparison to most ATG, but imo he was one
Damian Martyn - Quiet an unobtrusive, and a low average like Chappell, but as good as anyone on his day
Jack Fingleton - Out of position in this XI, but a very reliable defensive batsman and an excellent cover fielder
Ken McKay - The epitome of the team man, and a very reliable and serviceable all rounder
Ian Healy - It might be forgotten, post Gilchrist, just how good a keeper Healy was. As in, possibly the best of all time. Very handy batsman too
CTB Turner - I've never understood why CTB isn't included in the same sentences as SF Barnes and Spofforth
Graham McKenzie - Carried the bowling load before Lillee arrived with aplomb
Craig McDermott - Worked hard in the period between Lillee and McGrath and helped usher in the successful Aust era. Always felt secure with him in the team in the early 90s
Bill Johnston - A remarkable bowler of both medium pace and swing, able to bowl all day and allow Miller to bowl short bursts

 

[Zinzan]

Add Bobby Simpson, Doug Walters & Stuart Clark imo.

 

[mr_mister]

and Paul Reiffel. Impressive AR stats

 

[Zinzan]

The 4 Ds ....Damien Fleming, David Boon, Dean Jones (test cricket only) & Darren Lehmann (ODIs) also tend to get underrated for mine.

 

[watson]

Add Bobby Simpson, Doug Walters & Stuart Clark imo.

Gideon Haigh selected Bob Simpson for his ATG Australian XI when part of the expert panel that picked the ATG XIs for ESPN. His team went;

01. VictorTrumper
02. Bob Simpson
03. Don Bradman
04. Greg Chappell
05. Allan Border
06. Keith Miller
07. Adam Gilchrist
08. Shane Warne
09. Alan Davidson
10. Dennis Lillee
11. Bill O'Reilly

 

[Zinzan]

Gideon Haigh selected Bob Simpson for his ATG Australian XI when part of the expert panel that picked the ATG XIs for ESPN. His team went;

01. VictorTrumper
02. Bob Simpson
03. Don Bradman
04. Greg Chappell
05. Allan Border
06. Keith Miller
07. Adam Gilchrist
08. Shane Warne
09. Alan Davidson
10. Dennis Lillee
11. Bill O'Reilly

Fair enough & a little surprising. I've found almost all Aust cricket historians place Arthur Morris above Barnes, Simpson & Hayden as the opening partner of Trumper.

 

[The Battlers Prince]

Simpson as an opener was better than Lawry from what I've heard. Fairly formidable combination really.

 

[jimmy101]

Stuart Macgill too. Just think, if there was no Warne, he could have been Australia's all time highest wicket taker. Or possibly 2nd to McGrath.

 

[watson]

Simpson as an opener was better than Lawry from what I've heard. Fairly formidable combination really.

Their average opening partnership was 60.94 runs which puts them behind only Hobbs and Sutcliffe who averaged 87.81 runs.

However, if you consider that the average opening partnership of their era was 38.40 runs, and then compare that to the average of 61.16 for the Hobbs-Sutcliffe era, then you can make the heretical statement that Simpson and Lawry formed the greatest opening partnership of all time (it's not that simple of course).

Stats from the past: The opening salvo | Cricket | ESPN Cricinfo

 

[Prince EWS]

Gideon Haigh selected Bob Simpson for his ATG Australian XI when part of the expert panel that picked the ATG XIs for ESPN. His team went;

01. VictorTrumper
02. Bob Simpson
03. Don Bradman
04. Greg Chappell
05. Allan Border
06. Keith Miller
07. Adam Gilchrist
08. Shane Warne
09. Alan Davidson
10. Dennis Lillee
11. Bill O'Reilly

Probably my favourite 'expert' lineup. I'd have McGrath in for Lillee but leave the rest as is.

 

[Gob]

Probably my favourite 'expert' lineup. I'd have McGrath in for Lillee but leave the rest as is.

Aust AT xi without Dennis Lillee is like err i don't know where to start really

 

[AldoRaine18]

Aust AT xi without Dennis Lillee is like err i don't know where to start really

You can replace Lillee with McGrath in that sentence and it would still be valid.

 

[Gob]

You can replace Lillee with McGrath in that sentence and it would still be valid.

No doubt those are the first two picks.

 

[honestbharani]

Yeah but isn't Lillee the more ***y stylish type of fast bowler? McGrath was just a bit of a metronome... It was always a case of when with him than if.. And honestly, it got pretty boring pretty quick, esp. if u r a fan of the opposition team.

 

[smash84]

Yeah but isn't Lillee the more ***y stylish type of fast bowler? McGrath was just a bit of a metronome... It was always a case of when with him than if.. And honestly, it got pretty boring pretty quick, esp. if u r a fan of the opposition team.

agreed.

And in the words of Ian Chappell, "Lille could do everything that McGrath could and he could do it 10 miles quicker."

 

[smash84]

tbf Lillee brought an excitement level to the game that has rarely been matched by other fast bowlers.

 

[Red]

Sort of think if you were only having two out of McGrath, Davidson and Lillee, it'd be Lillee and one of the other two.

 

[Red]

Not because Lillee is better, but because McGrath and Davidson played a similar role.

 

[Red]

Simpson as an opener was better than Lawry from what I've heard. Fairly formidable combination really.

Simpson started in the middle order then went to opening. Averaged 56 as an opener. Still dunno if we was "better" than Lawry, but he was excellent for sure.