Stuart Clark - ODIs

[Richard]

People on this forum place WAY too much emphasis on the difference between ODI's and tests. It's all cricket ffs! If a bowler kicks ass as much as Stuart Clark did in tests for a whole year...proving himself to be a quality, class bowler (perhaps the best in Australia) then he should have gotten a free-pass into the WC squad regardless of a few indifferent games in colours.

If it was just "a few" you'd be right. But it's not. It's an entire career of 20 or 30 games.

The simple fact of the matter is, the two game-forms ARE different, and if you go around blindly picking the same players for both, you're going to have a pretty wretched time in one form.

 

[Richard]

Personally, I don't see any reasons as to why Clark can't become a successful ODI bowler, all you really need is accuracy, and variation is a bonus.

Read that + "if you can get the wicketkeeper up to the stumps".

Clark, sadly, is a bit too tall and a bit too fast for that, so hence accuracy alone isn't enough, and he isn't, as his record shows quite clearly, that good in ODIs.

 

[Richard]

I'm aware of his stats Clapo. A couple of good games in pyjamas would be all it takes to give him some confidence. I think he's the the pick of the new breed of Australian quickies/seamers and deserves a spot

New breed? At 31?

 

[Richard]

Look up Ewen Chatfield's ODI stats pup. A bowler who lacked any variation. Might as well look up McGrath's as well, a bowler Clark has been compared to ad nauseum

When was Ewan Chatfield's last ODI? In the 1980s I'd guess.

An era totally uncomparable to today.

Simple fact is, ODIs changed in the early 1990s and you just can't compare players across such eras, because only a few things remain the same.

As for Clark=McGrath, anyone who seriously says that doesn't know what they're on about. Clark has several similarities to McGrath, but there's no way on Earth that they're the same bowler.

 

[pasag]

The worst thing regarding claims that Clark deserves ODI spot have come on SEN Radio Station here in Melb, with callers asking "Why was our best bowler, Clark dropped? The guy's been class all summer" and "Of course we lost the finals against England, we didn't have Clark there to clean them up... what are the selectors doing?"

Heard it more often then you'd think too.

Lol, funniest radio station, especially in cricketing issues.

 

[four_or_six]

Clark wouldn't get the new ball, would he, even if he were in the team? McGrath and Bracken would probably take it (or Lee if fit). And I don't think he's that good with the old one, so I don't think it's that he's a bad bowler it's more that he doesn't fit into the team. And balance is critical for ODIs.

 

[Prince EWS]

Personally, I don't see any reasons as to why Clark can't become a successful ODI bowler, all you really need is accuracy, and variation is a bonus.

As I said in my post though, he only has accuracy to bowl in one particular spot. Whenever he tries to bowl anywhere else, be in slightly straighter, slightly shorter or slightly fuller, he sprays it everywhere. He consistently bowls in the same place in test matches but he's distinctly inaccurate whenever he tries to bowl in the ball in a slightly different area. His "accuracy" is an illusion of his consistency, really.

 

[Fiery]

As I said in my post though, he only has accuracy to bowl in one particular spot. Whenever he tries to bowl anywhere else, be in slightly straighter, slightly shorter or slightly fuller, he sprays it everywhere. He consistently bowls in the same place in test matches but he's distinctly inaccurate whenever he tries to bowl in the ball in a slightly different area. His "accuracy" is an illusion of his consistency, really.

Struggling to get my head around that post, particularly the last sentence

 

[dontcloseyoureyes]

I'm with Cribb and (surprisingly) Richard on this issue.

 

[Johnners]

Seems Stuey will go to the World Cup afterall. He's got big boots to fill in replacing Lee.

Anyway, again i was ropable after reading the Toowoomba Chronicle this morning, with the same reporter crapping on about Clark & the world cup. He further proved his direness as a cricket reporter by talking about Brett Lee's incosistency in ODI's, and how he doesn't take wickets regularly enough, and his position would be underfire in the WC

He also went on to say that Stuart Clark should've been the 1st bowler selected in the WC squad because he's the form bowler for Australia. Add to that the bit where he wrote how Australia could ill-afford to have him missing from the squad due to his consistency, and realiability in the ODI form of the game

 

[Slow Love™]

Can't say I disagree with much that has been said here about the OTT talk of Clark's obvious numero uno status in the media when it comes to one-day cricket, but I have to say I still hold hopes for him becoming a decent ODI bowler. I'd have probably had him in front of Tait, too.

 

[pup11]

Can't really see clark, bracken and McGrath playing together in the final XI, the reason is simple the variety in our bowling would not be there, since these 3 blokes are pretty similar bowlers. IMO, if aussies need to do well someone like tait needs to have a hell of a tournament(like lee had in 03 world cup), and Hogg also needs to bowl really well in the middle overs backed up by Watson.

 

[Fiery]

Seems Stuey will go to the World Cup afterall. He's got big boots to fill in replacing Lee.

Anyway, again i was ropable after reading the Toowoomba Chronicle this morning, with the same reporter crapping on about Clark & the world cup. He further proved his direness as a cricket reporter by talking about Brett Lee's incosistency in ODI's, and how he doesn't take wickets regularly enough, and his position would be underfire in the WC

He also went on to say that Stuart Clark should've been the 1st bowler selected in the WC squad because he's the form bowler for Australia. Add to that the bit where he wrote how Australia could ill-afford to have him missing from the squad due to his consistency, and realiability in the ODI form of the game

You have been riled by a few articles recently I've noticed Clapo. Do you think these guys who actually make a living out of writing about the sport might actually know something or even have valid opinions? I'm starting to think the only people who don't want Stuart Clark in the team are Australians and the majority of those are young Australians. Does anyone else think there might be some ageism going on here, because outside Australia's borders and to most Aussies over 30 (I'm sure) it seemed an incredible decision to leave him out in the 1st place.

 

[pasag]

You have been riled by a few articles recently I've noticed Clapo. Do you think these guys who actually make a living out of writing about the sport might actually know something or even have valid opinions? I'm starting to think the only people who don't want Stuart Clark in the team are Australians and the majority of those are young Australians. Does anyone else think there might be some ageism going on here, because outside Australia's borders and to most Aussies over 30 (I'm sure) it seemed an incredible decision to leave him out in the 1st place.

Alot of these writers aren't even cricket writers half the time, they're just footy writers on the off season, who I must say know sfa and I must question whether they've actually watched him in ODI's or are just basing their opinions on his Test record. I wouldn't go around following the mass hysteria and bias coming from some sections of the media. When you see how hard the Melbourne papers push Brad Hodge and Cameron White when they're not in the team, you'll understand how **** most of the opinion sections are in the media, this time the push is coming from Sydney.

Plus, I'd listen to some members here before 90% of journalists on cricketing issues, who actually think about what they type as opposed to the stupid knee-jerk articles that they have to produce on deadline.

 

[Fiery]

Alot of these writers aren't even cricket writers half the time, they're just footy writers on the off season, who I must say know sfa and I must question whether they've actually watched him in ODI's or are just basing it on his Test record. I wouldn't go around following the mass hysteria and bias coming from some sections of the media. When you see how hard the Melbourne papers push Brad Hodge and Cameron White when they're not in the team, you'll understand how **** most of the opinion sections are in the media.

Plus, I'd listen to some members here before 90% of cricket journalists, who actually think about what they type as opposed to the stupid knee-jerk articles that they have to produce on deadline.

OK, fair comments. A lot of it has to do with state vs state then would you say?. We don't get that at all in NZ Cricket. We do in rugby a wee bit but not a great deal.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

A lot of it has to do with state vs state then would you say?.

Yeah, for whatever reason that sort of stuff seems to be really important to some cricket fans in this country. I couldn't give a crap about what state a player comes from tbh, but I guess I've lived in a number of states so I don't have any particular loyalty.

Other than that, it's also based on general ignorance about the game. Stuart Clark was nothing short of brilliant in the test series, but most actual cricket followers will recognise that he's not necessarily going to be the best option in ODIs because of that, just like Brad Hogg's not going to head into the test side. When you've got space to fill and a reasonably limited knowledge of the game, it's not hard to come up with some utter crap.

 

[thierry henry]

Read that + "if you can get the wicketkeeper up to the stumps".

Clark, sadly, is a bit too tall and a bit too fast for that, so hence accuracy alone isn't enough, and he isn't, as his record shows quite clearly, that good in ODIs.

Disagree. Keepers are standing up to all sorts of bowlers these days. e.g. James Franklin bowling 135-138kph, who is about Clark's height. He just has to adjust his length.

btw Fiery, really struggling in this thread, sounding like someone who has listened to too much RadioSport and Martin Crowe and maybe even spent hours pondering the erudite opinions of Richard Book to boot.

 

[pup11]

If clark's gonna bowl full-tosses, half-volley's and balls down the leg-side(which he has done so far in odi cricket), then what difference can a keeper standing up to the stumps make.

 

[Johnners]

You have been riled by a few articles recently I've noticed Clapo. Do you think these guys who actually make a living out of writing about the sport might actually know something or even have valid opinions? I'm starting to think the only people who don't want Stuart Clark in the team are Australians and the majority of those are young Australians. Does anyone else think there might be some ageism going on here, because outside Australia's borders and to most Aussies over 30 (I'm sure) it seemed an incredible decision to leave him out in the 1st place.

Yeah, see what pasag said

btw... it's hard to beleive a reporter has a valid opinion on cricket when he has on two occassions called Shaun Tait a lefty

 

[Richard]

Can't really see clark, bracken and McGrath playing together in the final XI, the reason is simple the variety in our bowling would not be there, since these 3 blokes are pretty similar bowlers.

McGrath and Bracken are similarly good.

Clark is not.