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Selfish mother ****ers

Spark

Spark

Global Moderator
Bahnz said:
Yeah, given the number of times Chanders would take a single first ball of the over with number 11 waiting at the other end, it's hard to avoid the conclusion that he really did care more about his wicket than the extra runs that his team often so desparately needed. I can understand why he did this though. It was never his fault that his team mates were always collapsing around him, so why should his career record have to suffer for it?
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It goes beyond this though. Taking singles is one thing, calling your partner through for suicidal singles on the last ball so you wouldn't have the strike next over is another.
 
TheJediBrah

TheJediBrah

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***** said:
Spinners who choose to bowl tight and hold up and end vs trying to take wickets as a default mode of operation are selfish. They know a 0/40 off 15 is less likely to be dropped than a 2/80, and realise that perception beats reality - that if you are getting tonked for runs the captain and selectors will perceive you as being **** instead of understanding how you chose to risk that in order to create wicket-taking opportunities.

Especially early in a spell. A spinner comes on and decides that he's going to dart in his first 2-3 overs so he can be kept in the attack, vs tossing the ball up right away and risk being smacked for a few and being taken off. Ultimately these dart flingers end up with economical figures but not many wickets, and even worse end up offering respite to the batsmen who are often not even troubled by their bowling. They can milk the spinner for the easy ones and twos and catch their breath, and return focused to face the real bowlers. It's actively harmful to the team. But perception beats reality, and when the selectors and coaches analyse the stats and see that their spinner was economical they continue to pick him/sign him on to a new contract, and he continues to live another day, all the while being essentially useless if not harmful to the team's cause.

Now some spinners are assigned the role of being that tight, hold up an end bowler beforehand, and that's fine. Then you're just doing the job you have been asked for. But when a new spinner rocks up at the start of the season and decides right off the bat that that's how they are going to bowl, and especially when that new spinner has the skills and tools to toss it up but chooses not too, that spinner is a selfish ****.

I don't know the pace bowling equivalent of this.
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The opposite can also be true though. Bowling too many boundary balls and costing the team runs in a vain pursuit of wickets can be just as selfish.
 
Spark

Spark

Global Moderator
TheJediBrah said:
The opposite can also be true though. Bowling too many boundary balls and costing the team runs in a vain pursuit of wickets can be just as selfish.
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That would be extremely selfish if it went against what the captain wanted.

Bowling selfishness is actually very easy to define in that regard: are you doing whatever you want as opposed to what your captain wants? If so, then that's selfish.
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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Spark said:
It goes beyond this though. Taking singles is one thing, calling your partner through for suicidal singles on the last ball so you wouldn't have the strike next over is another.
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Heh. I'm glad that innings against SA happened. Everyone caught on after that and realized what people had been saying for years. I copped so much **** on here for calling Chanders selfish before that game. Great batsman, but he played for himself.

I never liked how he didn't move up the order either. People defend him saying he always came in when west indies were collapsing. That's chanderpaul's fault for refusing to move up the order and do what a top class batsman can do: Get runs up front and prevent collapses from even happening (or at least limit them)
 
cnerd123

cnerd123

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TheJediBrah said:
The opposite can also be true though. Bowling too many boundary balls and costing the team runs in a vain pursuit of wickets can be just as selfish.
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Yup that is a very good point.

I have also see fast bowlers who try to bowl extremely quick and short and be intimidating and macho and end up bleeding runs in the process - byes, wides, top edges going for boundaries, and the occasional long up being smashed. They get all puffed up and angry and the rest of us are face-palming and telling him to stop wasting the new ball and stick it on a ****ing line and length and let the pitch and ball do the work.

Yea, bowlers can very definitely be selfish too.
 
Red

Red

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OverratedSanity said:
Heh. I'm glad that innings against SA happened. Everyone caught on after that and realized what people had been saying for years. I copped so much **** on here for calling Chanders selfish before that game. Great batsman, but he played for himself.

I never liked how he didn't move up the order either. People defend him saying he always came in when west indies were collapsing. That's chanderpaul's fault for refusing to move up the order and do what a top class batsman can do: Get runs up front and prevent collapses from even happening (or at least limit them)
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This argument becomes so tiresome.

Not everyone is suited to opening or batting 3. Plenty of good players are a whole lot more valuable to their team at 5 or 6.
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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Red Hill said:
This argument becomes so tiresome.

Not everyone is suited to opening or batting 3. Plenty of good players are a whole lot more valuable to their team at 5 or 6.
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Not in a weak lineup. The best batsman has to bat higher up and take that responsibility.

Or he should bat lower down but be prepared to take the majority of the strike.

Chanderpaul did neither of those two.
 
Burgey

Burgey

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Spark said:
That would be extremely selfish if it went against what the captain wanted.

Bowling selfishness is actually very easy to define in that regard: are you doing whatever you want as opposed to what your captain wants? If so, then that's selfish.
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Slow over rates. Brett Lee the classic example - putting his team under pressure as a result of being so slow. WAC he was/ is.Abbott loving filth.
 
cnerd123

cnerd123

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OverratedSanity said:
Had to have been a selfish endeavor surely?

Gavaskar's excuse later was that he was "unable to time the ball". Yeah, right.
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You want a fun cricket conspiracy?

Footage and highlights of almost all the games in that tournament can be found online. Except for one game, where you can only find footage of the first innings but not the second.

Take a wild guess which game that is
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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Oh I know. It's fishy as **** imo.

Although it's quite possible the cameramen said "**** this ****" and stopped recording to save future generations the agony.
 
TheJediBrah

TheJediBrah

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Red Hill said:
This argument becomes so tiresome.

Not everyone is suited to opening or batting 3. Plenty of good players are a whole lot more valuable to their team at 5 or 6.
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Why though? No way this applies to someone who's top order constantly fails. If you're the best batsman in your team at no. 6, you should be able to be the best batsman in your team at no. 3
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

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Burgey said:
The "All About Me" XI

Boycott
Gavaskar
Chanderpaul
Tendulkar
Kallis
Al Hasan/ Pietersen
Dhoni
Hadlee
Warne
McDermott
Akhtar
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Good side that, KP must have run close.

Incidentally, I'm slightly more forgiving of Kallis' selfishness having seen a recent docu about him. His selfishness with the bat was requested to a large extent...was always given clear instructions not to get dismissed and the team would bat around him. So would probably replace him with KP>
 
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