Rank your Top 20 Bowlers of the modern era

[BlazeDragon]

You forgot to mention the main point in my argument please see above

Yes but how can you say which pressure is greater? Tbh the pressure on Tendulkar to perform every time (i.e. the weight of expectations) sounds quite similar to the pressure on the Aussies to perform every time.

Also it might well be argued that cricket is not easily the major sport in Australia (I think) or at least there are viewers of other sports but in India and Pakistan there is literally no other national sport that can compete with cricket therefore cricket in India-Pakistan-SL means a lot more to a greater proportion of the public than in England-Australia hence greater public scrutiny and pressure on the players.

Whenever Ponting does bad there are dozens of articles and hundreds of dozens of comments criticizing him saying he should retire, saying he is a waste of spot and even worse stuff. A good amount of Aussies are part of that Ponting bashing club as well.

Whenever Tendulkar does bad most Indians go "its okay, your the god of cricket, better luck next time and keep playing all you want."

And that's all it takes because most Indians = majority of cricket fans. His critics are just tiny little dots compared to his fanboys.

That also applies to the Pakistanis or Sri Lankans or any Asian countries. Ponting for his failures has gotten 50x times more bashing than Tendulkar or Inzamam.

The greater population also comes with greater number of fanboys. From what I have seen people in the Asian countries literally worship their players. So a whole lot of them excuse their players for not doing well sometimes. Aus-Eng players on the other hand get bashed for literally almost every one of their failures since they don't have as many fanboys.

So what you are talking about also has its disadvantages.

 

[ankitj]

Yes and everything in your posts are trying very desperately to prove how you guys have it all hard. Unless you are reading stuff that are not there I don't see any of your posts that suggests otherwise.

LOL. You literally have no idea. Ikki said playing for Australia puts more pressure because of expectations to win every match. I said that's as inconsequential as the argument that Tendulkar has to bear the pressure of expectations of a billion fans when it comes to assessing the players. He then said that perform or get dropped is a real threat for Australians. I said that's very much like the perform or get your houses stoned pressure that Indians have to play in and again it's inconsequential to rating players.

As I said try reading the posts properly. It seems you make your posts while running to catch a train.

 

[vcs]

how is it possible to gauge or decipher how much pressure there is on someone playing in the ashes as opposed to someone playing in a team gets very few tours away and has to, in a manner of speaking, almost justify it's raison d'etre every time they toured (ie referring to the england tour here since it is about the same team)? it can easily be argued that warne was playing for his place and country while murali was playing for his country's right to play and be 'allowed' to tour or be granted more matches. slightly hyperbolic, but i'm sure u can catch my drift. in my view, both are intangible. or rather, there is no way to say who had more pressure or found it more challenging. the only thing that is somewhat gaugable is the quality of opposition played.

This, in a nutshell, has been pretty much what I've been trying to say from the beginning.

 

[BlazeDragon]

Perform or get your house stoned. How about that for pressure. Doesn't mean anything when rating players though.

LOL. You literally have no idea. Ikki said playing for Australia puts more pressure because of expectations to win every match. I said that's as inconsequential as the argument that Tendulkar has to bear the pressure of expectations of a billion fans when it comes to assessing the players. He then said that perform or get dropped is a real threat for Australians. I said that's very much like the perform or get your houses stoned pressure that Indians have to play in and again it's inconsequential to rating players.

As I said try reading the posts properly. It seems you make your posts while running to catch a train.

The fact that you trying to argue that your not only favoring toward Indian players in your argument is quite funny. The part I above shows that you only trying to show the disadvantages to being an Indian player and ignore all the advantages.

Maybe you should take your own advice and read as well. Your provided some disadvantages to being an Indian player and I merely named some advantages. The sooner you figure out that the train goes both ways the better.

 

[ankitj]

The fact that you trying to argue that your not only favoring toward Indian players in your argument is quite funny. The part I above shows that you only trying to show the disadvantages to being an Indian player and ignore all the advantages.

Maybe you should take your own advice and read as well. Your provided some disadvantages to being an Indian player and I merely named some advantages. The sooner you figure out that the train goes both ways the better.

Facepalm.jpg

 

[smash84]

That also applies to the Pakistanis or Sri Lankans or any Asian countries. Ponting for his failures has gotten 50x times more bashing than Tendulkar or Inzamam.

So whatif it applies to all Asians? That is my point that in the SC the only sport being followed is cricket hence greater public scrutiny since the public always has its attention on cricket.

The greater population also comes with greater number of fanboys. From what I have seen people in the Asian countries literally worship their players. So a whole lot of them excuse their players for not doing well sometimes. Aus-Eng players on the other hand get bashed for literally almost every one of their failures since they don't have as many fanboys.

What am I supposed to make of this? Aus-Eng players don't have fan-boys so they always get bashed. While Dhoni and Inzi and Wasim and Ganguly have fanboys and hence they get their effigies burnt and houses stoned. Right?

Facepalm.jpg

haha....THIS

 

[BlazeDragon]

Facepalm.jpg

Its better than just 1.

 

[BlazeDragon]

So whatif it applies to all Asians? That is my point that in the SC the only sport being followed is cricket hence greater public scrutiny since the public always has its attention on cricket.

What are you getting at? It applies meaning all Asian players usually get excused for a lot of their failures due to the greater number of fanboys which Aussie and English players usually doesn't.

What am I supposed to make of this? Aus-Eng players don't have fan-boys so they always get bashed. While Dhoni and Inzi and Wasim and Ganguly have fanboys and hence they get their effigies burnt and houses stoned. Right?

Okay, they also get worshiped and their feet touched when they come out to play. Right?
Sourav Ganguly tries to stop a fan who jumped the fence to touch his feet | Photo | Indian Premier League 2011 | ESPN Cricinfo

haha....THIS

See above.

 

[centurymaker]

go read comments on times of india and you'll find out how outraged the indian fans are atm-
they want harby, sachin and dhoni dropped for the next test.

 

[BlazeDragon]

Does it surpass the percentage that thinks he is god?

 

[GotSpin]

lol at SC players the only ones under public pressure

Yeah, Ponting got off completely scott free. He was out picking flowers with journalists the week after

 

[BlazeDragon]

lol at SC players the only ones under public pressure

Yeah, Ponting got off completely scott free. He was out picking flowers with journalists the week after

 

[smash84]

]lol at SC players the only ones under public pressure[/B]

lol @ stupid people who don't bother reading the posts before replying.

 

[centurymaker]

lol @ stupid people who don't bother reading the posts before replying.

awta

 

[GotSpin]

lol @ stupid people who don't bother reading the posts before replying.

I've read the posts before me, otherwise I would have commented on the top 20 bowlers of the modern era which is what the thread was originally intended to be about.

Was just pointing out that players not from the SC face immense pressure as well. Just because we don't go and throw rocks at their home and family doesn't mean our players don't get criticised.

 

[ankitj]

lol @ stupid people who don't bother reading the posts before replying.

Exactly. How ****ng silly it is that people are arguing with us against the exact same argument that smalishah and I were arguing against. It was Ikki who claimed that Australian players are under more pressure than the rest and that their stats should be adjusted upwards, FFS. I don't know how to react to the monumentally stupid posts that haven't bothered to check who was saying what. Not for once did either smalishah or I said that sub-continent players' stats should be adjusted upwards.

 

[akilana]

Exactly. How ****ng silly it is that people are arguing with us against the exact same argument that smalishah and I were arguing against. It was Ikki who claimed that Australian players are under more pressure than the rest and that their stats should be adjusted upwards, FFS. I don't know how to react to the monumentally stupid posts that haven't bothered to check who was saying what. Not for once did either smalishah or I said that sub-continent players' stats should be adjusted upwards.

if he really said that.. but not surprised

 

[smash84]

I've read the posts before me, otherwise I would have commented on the top 20 bowlers of the modern era which is what the thread was originally intended to be about.

Was just pointing out that players not from the SC face immense pressure as well. Just because we don't go and throw rocks at their home and family doesn't mean our players don't get criticised.

When did anybody say that non-SC players don't have pressure or get no criticism?

 

[Ikki]

Exactly. How ****ng silly it is that people are arguing with us against the exact same argument that smalishah and I were arguing against. It was Ikki who claimed that Australian players are under more pressure than the rest and that their stats should be adjusted upwards, FFS. I don't know how to react to the monumentally stupid posts that haven't bothered to check who was saying what. Not for once did either smalishah or I said that sub-continent players' stats should be adjusted upwards.

Er, no. Australia is just an example of a team that was one of the greatest of all time and hence was always expected to win. You could be talking about WIndies of the 80s and the points would still be the same. Or with regards to the Ashes, I was referring to the added pressure of that series, but it is not limited to Australia as I exemplified both India and Pakistan having this same trait in their series. I didn't even mention adjusting stats. I just said certain stats can be misleading without context.

Your act of condensing an argument to a sentence which fails to recognise the context of the discussion is poor and petty.

 

[ankitj]

Er, no. Australia is just an example of a team that was one of the greatest of all time and hence was always expected to win. You could be talking about WIndies of the 80s and the points would still be the same. Or with regards to the Ashes, I was referring to the added pressure of that series, but it is not limited to Australia as I exemplified both India and Pakistan having this same trait in their series. I didn't even mention adjusting stats. I just said certain stats can be misleading without context.

Your act of condensing an argument to a sentence which fails to recognise the context of the discussion is poor and petty.

Yeah, you mentioned India vs Pak and now you are mentioning West Indies, which is alright. I didn't say you don't recognize other kind of pressures. If that's how it came out, I did not intend it to.

Nevertheless, gist of your argument was that pressure due to media scrutiny and pressure of playing Ashes counts in judging players. I said this kind of pressure counts for nothing. I produced "possible" counter-arguments to you to show there is a flip side to everything you wanted to say about pressure faced by Australians. It was at this point that BlazeDragon and GotSpin jumped into it blaming me and others for suggesting that Indian players are under greater pressure which, one, I did not say and two, I think is inconsequential. This was a complete **** up on their part. I know what I disagree with you on, and have no issues so long as you don't misunderstand my opinion.

To me it's also silly to suggest that being dubbed "God" of cricket eases the pressure rather than raising it. But again, that's inconsequential. I give no extra point to Tendulkar for having born in India and therefore having to deal with laughable levels of adulation and criticism.