Placing our bets on "Test Cricket's Young Fab Four"

[Slifer]

The irony of all this is that Kohli is my favorite batsman of the lot and the one who I think has the most potential but the results are what they are and Smith is the best atm

 

[Adders]

OMG. Opened this thread this morning from my last read and saw 15 pages since yesterday. Like a ****ing idiot I waded through them all in some sadistic self flagellation exercise..........I love this place and the vast majority of its members, but fmd sometimes these threads really do implode and normal, perfectly fine contributors lose the plot.

Jono said it best when he said something along the lines of why can't you all just be ****ing happy that we have 4 such awesome young batsmen on the scene to watch and enjoy. Instead you want to pic apart each and every one of them to try and prove your horse is better and have the biggest Waaahhhh when someone else thinks differently.

I have my own opinions of how they line up, and right as of now it would be Smith>Kohli>Root>KW.......but they are all beasts and that order can easily change by the series. I don't know how anyone can be so adamant that they're opinion is so right in this discussion, but that's exactly what you've been raging over the last 2 days. It's mental!!

PS.

The other thing driving me nuts is how some of you are looking for "holes" in a players records to prove your point and cite Root in Aus or Kohli in Eng.........**** off!! You're looking at one tour FFS, the best of the best will have the odd poor tour. In Roots case especially it is disingenuous......first year in test cricket, got dropped at the end of it and then came back as the batsmen we are now looking at and discussing today. Would any of you talking this bollocks put your hard earned money on these 2 failing next time they visit?? I know when India next tours Blighty it will be Kohli I'll be most scared of and I don't give a **** what he did there last time.

 

[Coronis]

Smitteh now has the 3rd highest centuries per match (Bradman, Headley), the 4th highest runs per match (Bradman, Headley, Pollock) and the 5th highest average (Bradman, Voges, Pollock, Headley, Sutcliffe). Am liking his style.

 

[TheJediBrah]

cant let it go even after copping a ban, huh?



It was fun for a while seeing Blocky Vs TJB. It is the usual heel vs heel throwaway match for no reason where you are enjoying the fact that they are beating the crap out of each other and you dont care who wins as long as they tear each other to pieces and then Blocky went too far, and I ended up liking ****ing TJB posts. What has CW come down to?

I'm definitely over it, but being easily one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen some someone try and argue it'll be hard to forget

 

[Adders]

I think Blocky's adamant dismissing of Smith is one of the most irrational things I've ever seen.........certainly a case of letting your opinion of the bloke cloud your cricketing judgement.

I mean just about everyone outside of Aus thinks he's a ****, and he would be one batsman I'd almost go out of my way to avoid watching as I find him so hideous to watch at the crease..........but none of that has anything to do with his record as a batsmen which is outstanding just about everywhere. Like so many others I never thought it would last and thought it only a matter of time before that massive form slump comes and the average comes tumbling with it. But it never came and doesn't look like it is going to any time soon.

So at some point you just have to put your hand up and admit that he is a ****ing top notch batsmen.

 

[Blocky]

"Dismissing of Smith"

I rank the guy 5th, I say he's amazing at making big runs with riskless cricket, but point out that any time he's been in tougher conditions, he's struggled - i.e Sri Lanka, against South Africa, his tour in England. He does have a tendency to get at least one average saving performance in those series, you're acting like I'm pretending he's a hack - I'm saying a fairer indication of him is more a 45-50 average rather than the 60 average, as can be seen by the fact that guys like Voges also averaged 60 during the time Smith has become unbeatable.

He has the easiest conditions of any of them for batting; let's revisit this after India where undoubtedly he gets dismissed cheaply frequently.

 

[TheJediBrah]

"Dismissing of Smith"

I rank the guy 5th, I say he's amazing at making big runs with riskless cricket, but point out that any time he's been in tougher conditions, he's struggled - i.e Sri Lanka, against South Africa, his tour in England. He does have a tendency to get at least one average saving performance in those series, you're acting like I'm pretending he's a hack - I'm saying a fairer indication of him is more a 45-50 average rather than the 60 average, as can be seen by the fact that guys like Voges also averaged 60 during the time Smith has become unbeatable.

He has the easiest conditions of any of them for batting; let's revisit this after India where undoubtedly he gets dismissed cheaply frequently.

Ranking him 5th is pretty dismissive when he's clearly the best

 

[Blocky]

Ranking him 5th is pretty dismissive when he's clearly the best

He's not clearly the best, he went missing entirely when his team lost against South Africa and only got a performance when it didn't matter. He was also completely missing against Sri Lanka in Sri Lanka.

De Kock performed far better than him in Australia, Root's performances in India will look superb in comparison to what I expect Smith to put up.

 

[Shady Slim]

virat kohli the best for mine with smith a reluctant second - his tour of england is funny because he absolutely tore **** up on the highway at lord's and though he wasn't terrible elsewhere he wasn't exceptional - kinda similar to YK in england in that one massive knock saved the average so the stats themselves aren't the best

 

[Victor Ian]

I get the feeling this thread has hemorrhoids, yet people keep picking at them. Why? That just makes them worse. Apparently, you just need to wait them out.

 

[Zinzan]

Ranking him 5th is pretty dismissive when he's clearly the best

Lol, Not sure what's worse in this thread, those underrating Smith or those absolutely categorically asserting he is clearly the best.

The only thing that has really changed in the last couple of months or so when we all seemed to agree it was tight at the top, is Smith has scored really good runs at home, Root has scored really good ( not as many but much more challenging runs) away, Kohli's scored really good runs at home, & KW has fallen off the pace somewhat.

Let's wait for Smith to tour against the toughest attack away from home, like Root had to before categorically asserting him as number 1 eh?

If it really was 'clear' as you say, there wouldn't be the disagreement across the board there seems to be.

As a Kiwi, I'm happy to accept KW is out of the race for now based on his last 12 months & particularly in reviewing his performances against the best sides, so there's no bias impacting me finding it difficult splitting Root and Smith at the top, I don't have a foot in either camp.

If Smith guns it in India, I'll happily say he deserves to be at the top of the heap for now. If he averages in the 30s and gets dominated by Ashwin like KW did, then I won't.

 

[watson]

Not sure why Kohli is so far ahead of Smith in the voting as Smith has proven himself with 3 years of epic run scoring after a slowish start to his career. Only in the last 12 months has Kohli 'taken-off'.

SMITH
2014 = 81.85
2015 = 73.70
2016 = 71.93


KOHLI
2014 = 44.57
2015 = 42.66
2016 = 75.93

 

[Zinzan]

Not sure why Kohli is so far ahead of Smith in the voting as Smith has proven himself with 3 years of epic run scoring after a slowish start to his career. Only in the last 12 months has Kohli 'taken-off'.

SMITH
2014 = 81.85
2015 = 73.70
2016 = 71.93


KOHLI
2014 = 44.57
2015 = 42.66
2016 = 75.93

You're a smart guy watson, you know there's more to it than just posting overall numbers like that without the context of who the opposition is, where they played etc.

Smith has been better in the last 3 years than Kohli, but I'd like the study the break down a bit more carefully than to take those numbers at face value.

FTR, I do have both Smith and Root marginally ahead of Kohli as Test bats currently.

 

[vic_orthdox]

Also the fact that the poll was made in August 2014.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Lol, Not sure what's worse in this thread, those underrating Smith or those absolutely categorically asserting he is clearly the best.

The only thing that has really changed in the last couple of months or so when we all seemed to agree it was tight at the top, is Smith has scored really good runs at home, Root has scored really good ( not as many but much more challenging runs) away, Kohli's scored really good runs at home, & KW has fallen off the pace somewhat.

Let's wait for Smith to tour against the toughest attack away from home, like Root had to before categorically asserting him as number 1 eh?

If it really was 'clear' as you say, there wouldn't be the disagreement across the board there seems to be.

As a Kiwi, I'm happy to accept KW is out of the race for now based on his last 12 months & particularly in reviewing his performances against the best sides, so there's no bias impacting me finding it difficult splitting Root and Smith at the top, I don't have a foot in either camp.

If Smith guns it in India, I'll happily say he deserves to be at the top of the heap for now. If he averages in the 30s and gets dominated by Ashwin like KW did, then I won't.

For the last 2 years it's been the same old story. "Smith will get found out in insert series" and he never does.

It will never end for him. He'll finally have a bad series in 2028 after averaging 76 in Test cricket and everyone will say "I told you so, he's not good! Told you he'd be found out"

 

[Blocky]

"He never does" - he got found out against South Africa, he looked horrible when the ball was moving, he also got found out in England except for one innings, and in Sri Lanka.

He'll be found out again in India.

 

[Zinzan]

For the last 2 years it's been the same old story. "Smith will get found out in insert series" and he never does.

It will never end for him. He'll finally have a bad series in 2028 after averaging 76 in Test cricket and everyone will say "I told you so, he's not good! Told you he'd be found out"

Well it will end as far as I'm concerned, & whats-more you'll now be able to quote me on it. I've just said, (as a few have) if he guns it in India, I'll say he deserves to be out on his own currently. Right now I find it tough to split he and Root on the back of Smith's great form at home and Root's very good series in the most difficult conditions.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Not sure why Kohli is so far ahead of Smith in the voting as Smith has proven himself with 3 years of epic run scoring after a slowish start to his career. Only in the last 12 months has Kohli 'taken-off'.

SMITH
2014 = 81.85
2015 = 73.70
2016 = 71.93


KOHLI
2014 = 44.57
2015 = 42.66
2016 = 75.93

pretty definitive statistics

along with Smith averaging over 10 runs more than everyone else away from home

it doesn't get much clearer

Anyone saying that his stats are only superior because he benefits from home conditions good for batting is a fool

 

[Zinzan]

Isn't it great that he's got a chance to put it all to bed in the next couple of months then, you should be happy about that.

Adds an extra element to this upcoming tour to India, which is a mouthwatering prospect in it's own right.

There's no reason you shouldn't be very confident that he'll do well.

 

[Jono]

Not sure why Kohli is so far ahead of Smith in the voting as Smith has proven himself with 3 years of epic run scoring after a slowish start to his career. Only in the last 12 months has Kohli 'taken-off'.

SMITH
2014 = 81.85
2015 = 73.70
2016 = 71.93


KOHLI
2014 = 44.57
2015 = 42.66
2016 = 75.93

1. The poll is almost 2.5 years old
2. The poll is about who will end their career the best. There's potentially 8-10 more years of cricket to decide that.