*Official Third Test at Headingley* 25-29 August

[OverratedSanity]

Yeah people are way overthinking it. India's issue just isn't really a selection one, it's that they have a world class middle order going nowhere. All of them have made multiple matchwinning hundreds overseas, Rahul and Pant too. The moment they get their **** together the lineup will look fine.

Rahane has averaged mid 30s for close to 6 years. It was less talked about when Kohli and Pujara were gunning it but when they've had some (Hopefully temporary) dips in form recently, it's hard to have much patience. Dropping rahane is seriously overdue. Its not going to be a miracle fix but that doesn't mean serial underperformers shouldn't be replaced.. Its bairstow level performance over a long long period . We've lost a ton of tests due to a brittle lineup.

 

[Uppercut]

He's not been disastrous but he's generally looked very iffy when England have bowled well. It'd be unfair to disregard his 91 entirely but he got some very very generous bowling early in his innings which you can't bank on again.

Sure but literally everyone but Smith looks very iffy when England bowl well in England.

I don’t love his innings here but I’m not sure he got enough credit for grinding out a crucial 200-ball 45 in an away win when he was struggling. The focus was very much on how hard he seemed to find it, but you want batsmen who show that kind of grit when they’re not in good form.

I think if Stokes played that innings in a win in Australia the English fans and media would respond very differently. Maybe he’d even get too much credit and the truth is in the middle.

 

[Flem274*]

Games like this really reassert that a lot of the bowling prospects in Indian domestic cricket are nowhere near Test standard.

"sheldon jackson"

wait, what? they let rando overseas blokes into this? *checks profile* oh ok, maybe we'll see him partner washington sundar sometime.

also that jadeja knock that low in that score...really doesn't help your case for batting him higher.

 

[Manee]

also that jadeja knock that low in that score...really doesn't help your case for batting him higher.

Was just replying to that post. I think we've all seen that he can score runs against good bowling such as Oval 2018, Lords 2014 or Nottingham 2021. I just think in terms of technique (not when hitting out with the tail), he is a step up from peak batsman Stuart Broad (i.e., the best you'd get in terms of a lower order counterattacker that is still very much a bowling all-rounder).

 

[harsh.ag]

Sure but literally everyone but Smith looks very iffy when England bowl well in England.

I don’t love his innings here but I’m not sure he got enough credit for grinding out a crucial 200-ball 45 in an away win when he was struggling. The focus was very much on how hard he seemed to find it, but you want batsmen who show that kind of grit when they’re not in good form.

I think if Stokes played that innings in a win in Australia the English fans and media would respond very differently. Maybe he’d even get too much credit and the truth is in the middle.

A lot of people here just don't seem to want to acknowledge that it's not a form issue if it's been going on for more than 2 years. Most of us didn't criticize Pujara for a long time because we thought it was a form issue.

There are levels of looking iffy. Rohit and KL have had instances where they looked iffy but have been far more assured than Pujara and Rahane. But, again, that's not the primary cause of wanting them dropped. This level of long term performance just isn't acceptable and not having a disastrous tour is not enough to retain them anymore if all signs are that they haven't fixed their problems.

 

[Manee]

A lot of people here just don't seem to want to acknowledge that it's not a form issue if it's been going on for more than 2 years. Most of us didn't criticize Pujara for a long time because we thought it was a form issue.

There are levels of looking iffy. Rohit and KL have had instances where they looked iffy but have been far more assured than Pujara and Rahane. But, again, that's not the primary cause of wanting them dropped. This level of long term performance just isn't acceptable and not having a disastrous tour is not enough to retain them anymore if all signs are that they haven't fixed their problems.

Yes I have to agree with this. England can pretty much just hang it outside off to him and he'll be almost entirely dried up.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

So is Woakes gonna be replacing Anderson?

 

[Arachnodouche]

Rahane's problem is that the one good innings where he looks like a million bucks and/or bloody-minded is no guarantee he won't do something braindead the next time he bats. So if India's happy tearing its collective hair out in anticipation of the one win he orchestrates every 10+ games, then by all means they should keep picking him.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Cook in 10/11 is probably the only other time Ive seen an Eng batsmen look so impenetrable......sensational to see (from our pov)

I'm desperate to see Root have a big series in Aus, it's a bit of a hole in his CV atm and quite frankly if he's not in the big runs this could turn out to be the most humiliating tour down under yet. And there's some stiff competition for that mantle.

Is it too much to expect this absurd form to carry on into next year? My pessimistic side thinks that yes it probably is.

Vaughan had 12 months where he smashed 6 centuries against India and Australia and most were 150+ and Bell's ashes in 2013 are the only times that come close to this. Can't really say Gooch in 90 as India were very ordinary and it was minnow bashing.

 

[Niall]

He's not been disastrous but he's generally looked very iffy when England have bowled well. It'd be unfair to disregard his 91 entirely but he got some very very generous bowling early in his innings which you can't bank on again.

A lovely knock when the game was gone?

That's a a Shafiq special.??

 

[Flem274*]

Was just replying to that post. I think we've all seen that he can score runs against good bowling such as Oval 2018, Lords 2014 or Nottingham 2021. I just think in terms of technique (not when hitting out with the tail), he is a step up from peak batsman Stuart Broad (i.e., the best you'd get in terms of a lower order counterattacker that is still very much a bowling all-rounder).

there's a wide field between peak stuart broad and #6

he's a latter day daniel vettori with the stick. good enough for 6 but so much more valuable at 7-8. 5 is too high, 3 is a joke.

 

[M0rphin3]

there's a wide field between peak stuart broad and #6

he's a latter day daniel vettori with the stick. good enough for 6 but so much more valuable at 7-8. 5 is too high, 3 is a joke.

Yeah awta, much more accurate comparison wrt Dan. Plays similar sorta innings too, holds things together when the top shits the bed. But ideally should remain @ no higher than 7, or if really pushing it, 6.

 

[Daemon]

Rahane’s basically an Asad Shafique these days and if there’s one thing he’s good at it’s making random match winning hundreds in between going missing for 10 games.

The more I think calmly about it, the more I think I want him to play the next two. The **** does not deserve it given his output over the last 3 years, but he’s still got the best chance of tonning up from all the other reserves and given Pujara and Kohli woes, we don’t need Vihari 30s - we may as well go for the all or nothing approach.

If we jag even one Test now we walk away with a drawn series minimum and that’s an absolutely massive feat in England over 5 tests.

It could of course cost us the series too but you can never have a risk-free plan.

 

[Shri]

yeah i am thinking they both need to go just before the nz series at home

starting from home test series, i'd go

rohit
rahul
gill
kohli
shaw/sky/vihari
pant

 

[Uppercut]

there's a wide field between peak stuart broad and #6

he's a latter day daniel vettori with the stick. good enough for 6 but so much more valuable at 7-8. 5 is too high, 3 is a joke.

I would have said Jadeja is quite badly suited to batting with the tail. Very good at rotating the strike, which is useless when he has to farm it. Pant OTOH hits the ball hard and can clear deep fielders.

Getting off topic but Vettori absolutely should have batted higher imo.

 

[SteveNZ]

Great to see Ollie Robinson back and firing, after the ECB **** on their own shoes. Keen to see how he goes away from home

 

[Burgey]

I don’t love his innings here but I’m not sure he got enough credit for grinding out a crucial 200-ball 45 in an away win when he was struggling. The focus was very much on how hard he seemed to find it, but you want batsmen who show that kind of grit when they’re not in good form.

There were elements of this out here at times when he was grinding out a poultice of runs. He isn’t what you’d call the most fluent stroke maker going around but he’s been vital to two series wins here while looking at times like he was battling to get it off the square. Then you sort of realised a day and a half later that he’s still there.

 

[Burgey]

making random match winning hundreds in between going missing for 10 games

Dean Jones literally made a 45+ career average by doing precisely this. Took the selectors about eight years to realise he was doing it and end his career in 93.

 

[Manee]

there's a wide field between peak stuart broad and #6

he's a latter day daniel vettori with the stick. good enough for 6 but so much more valuable at 7-8. 5 is too high, 3 is a joke.

You've convinced me - agree with all this.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

So I was able to take a few photos of Root celebrating his century and forgot to upload, so here they are:





and this last one was creepy af…there’s a tin-foil hat chap in yellow: