***Official*** Sri Lanka in England

[luckyeddie]

My head is not in the clouds i know very well what i am saying

What you are saying is true but in England's case since you dont have an experienced spinner in Giles who is proven to be ineffective even when conditions assist him & a young spinner in Panesar who is still in his early days, plus you don't really have a test standard keeper batsman which will expose the lower half of the batting, so the idea of playing 4-seamers & 7 batsmen just cant been thrown away just because of this true fact. But i know it won't happen judging by how Fletcher & co does things.

It won't happen not because of anything to do with Fletcher - it won't happen because it's totally bonkers and anachronistic.

Playing just 4 seamers for a start gives the captain no flexibility whatsoever - it'll be a continual 4 overs on, 4 overs off rotation throughout the day - great when things are working but one that is prone to so many dangers, especially when a bowler gets injured or is just plainly getting a bit of tap and gets forced out of the attack.

One of the biggest problems nowadays is the back-to-back test matches and the lack of recovery time, together with the amount of high-intensity cricket played.

Back in the 1970's and 80's, when the great West Indies sides used this ploy to some effect (with the greatest fast quartets you could imagine), they still had other options - often they would pick a spinner (ok, not always one of the Lance Gibbs standard), or Viv would get through a fair few overs - in other words, there was a 'Plan B' for the odd occasion that sides weren't blown away, even if that was just someone doing a 'holding' job a-la Giles.

Even then, when things came unstuck, you'd end up with one or the other of the big guns (Holding in particular but I remember Garner on more than one occasion) breaking down in exactly the same way that Jones, Harmison and Flintoff have done in recent times.

The idea of playing just 4 seam bowlers and 7 batsmen can indeed be thrown away - and good riddance.

 

[Sanz]

4 rpo is easier to do when you know that's all you need and fast scoring in the Test arena is something England are proven at doing. There was plenty of turn at Trent Bridge, Murali even admitted in a post match interview the pitch suited him well. I don't really see the relevance of Pakistan, your trying to apply what happened on a pitch in Pakistan last year and imply that because Kaneria took 3 wickets 4/52 in the 4th innings Murali would have swept through England at Lords 7 months later? I see what your saying but it's not exaclt sound. Anyway the series is over now.

Actually, you are right, with all the great batsmen in the team, England would have chased 30 runs per over, they would have scored 180-200 runs in 7 overs. The ball was turning miles @ TrentBridge else Murali would never have been able to take 8 wickets against the English team. They are just so good against spin bowling. Sri Lanka were lucky that they tied the series, England are so good that they could win each test in 2 days. Now I see your logic, very Sound and makes a lot of sense.

 

[Autobahn]

England one day squad.

Marcus Trescothick
Andrew Strauss (capt),
Tim Bresnan
Alastair Cook
Ed Joyce
Ian Bell
Kevin Pietersen
Paul Collingwood
Geraint Jones (wk)
Alex Loudon
Jamie Dalyrymple
Sajid Mahmood
Glen Chapple
Tim Bresnan
Steve Harmison
Liam Plunkett

 

[Magrat Garlick]

Ed Smith
Jamie Dalrymple
Tim Bresnan
Glenn Chapple
Ed Joyce
Loudon

All in the OD squad no clarke, kabir ali or solanki, flintoff or vaughan.

Now there's a cruel twist of fate. Joyce to play Ireland next Tuesday?

Brave selections. Guess they've realised picking the old guard isn't working and want to try something new...

Edit: No Lewis, either.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Finally gotten rid of Kabir and Solanki.

 

[Benny2k1]

Marcus Trescothick, Andrew Strauss (capt), Tim Bresnan, Alastair Cook, Ed Joyce, Ian Bell, Kevin Pietersen, Paul Collingwood, Geraint Jones (wk), Alex Loudon, Jamie Dalyrymple, Sajid Mahmood, Glen Chapple, Tim Bresnan, Steve Harmison, Liam Plunkett.

Interesting, am glad to see Kabir and solanki gone! Chapple deserves a chance but has it come too late? looks like Loudon will be the main spin threat which isnt looking too good.

 

[Autobahn]

i swear i saw ed smith on the sky list....

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

ME Trescothick
EC Joyce
AJ Strauss (C)
KP Pietersen
PD Collingwood
JWM Dalrymple
GO Jones (wk)
G Chapple
LE Plunkett
SI Mahmood
SJ Harmison

...perhaps.
I say play Dalrymple as the spinner, as he's not far worse than Alex Loudon (statistically) and is probably a better batsman. Surely they won't enter any of the matches with Pietersen as the sole spin option.

With Plunkett able to hold the bat, the team bats pretty deep, but the quality arguably doesn't run quite as deep. However, picking an extra batsman leaves a bowling attack of 3 + Dalrymple + Collingwood + change.

I also wouldn't mind Bell getting a few more chances at the top of the order tbh.

 

[Barney Rubble]

I'd pick:

ME Trescothick
IR Bell
AJ Strauss*
KP Pietersen
EC Joyce
PD Collingwood
GO Jones+
AGR Loudon
LE Plunkett
SI Mahmood
SJ Harmison

With the option of dropping Joyce and bringing in Chapple or Bresnan at 8, with Geraint at 6, if the bowling goes up the spout. However, that would probably mess the batting up. Ah well.

 

[luckyeddie]

Delighted to see Dalrymple in the squad.

No Rikki though. Just fancied an international Clarkewatch.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

How has Bell's form been recently?

 

[Benny2k1]

i swear i saw ed smith on the sky list....

He isnt, i think somebody got confused with Ed Joyce?!

As for Ian Bell he made a 50 in his last game his stats so far this season:

Championship

M I NO R HS AVG
IR Bell 3 5 0 129 79 25.80


C & G M I NO R HS AVG S/R
IR Bell 4 2 0 78 78 39.00 64.46

 

[The Baconator]

Can't believe they picked Chapple, Bresnan, Looudon and Dalrymple but not Rikki

 

[Benny2k1]

am pretty happy with the squad We all know what Rikki can do, mite as well give the others a chance, Chapple has been supurb for Lancs for many years, as for his age does it matter if you are good enough! Chapple can bowl 10 reliable overs and add a valuble quick fire 40/50

 

[superkingdave]

Well Chapple has been pretty good this year so far, but his success with the bat has come in the CC, you could argue that he's not had much chance with the bat in OD though. It was only last season that he didn't look worth his place in the OD side, but he has put on a yard of pace this year (yes i know it's a bit strange to talk about someone 32 putting on a yard of pace but it's actually true, he was Lancs fastest bowler on their preseason tour)

 

[Lostman]

why do the english selectors keep picking life long first class cricketers in their mid 30's, they obviously dont have it in them to be international players other wise they would have been given a chance a while ago. Wont it make more sense to give a chance to a young guy that has a lot of potential and therefore a higher upside?

 

[Gloucefan]

Actually, you are right, with all the great batsmen in the team, England would have chased 30 runs per over, they would have scored 180-200 runs in 7 overs. The ball was turning miles @ TrentBridge else Murali would never have been able to take 8 wickets against the English team. They are just so good against spin bowling. Sri Lanka were lucky that they tied the series, England are so good that they could win each test in 2 days. Now I see your logic, very Sound and makes a lot of sense.

Now what you wrote there is just crap, I'm not saying anything like that.

Look Murali is good, in choose him before Warne (Not gonna get into a debate about this with Anyone) but you can't just assume that he would have ripped through the England attack at Lords just because he did at trent Bridge and because Kaneria took three wickets on a flat track at Pakistan. I know Englands weakness is spin but you're making a big presumption, bigger than me saying I believe England could score 180-200 in 50 overs at Lords against SL.

That is my opinion, come back with another stupid ramble if you like but I'm not replying to this again.

 

[TheEpic]

I'm pleased and surprised by a number of the selections, and happy to finally see the back (permanently hopefully) of Solanki, Prior and Kabir Ali.

However, Chapple? I think he has talent and has obviously been chosen for his ability with the bat alongside the ball, but I don't know what he offers as opposed to Clarke. Clarke needs some experience if he is to figure in the World Cup, and what better time when our dominant all-rounder is injured and we're playing a (relatively) weak side?

Wanna see more of Broad and Tom Smith as well but luckily time is on their sides.

 

[marc71178]

Good logic in the scheduling of the Twenty20 International there - same time as an England World Cup game.

 

[aussie]

It won't happen not because of anything to do with Fletcher - it won't happen because it's totally bonkers and anachronistic..

Fletcher has much to do with, you can't say thats not true he has shown as a coach since he took over his likeness to playing a spinner in the side even if he is not really test standard. The only time he did not go for it was in 2000 when Gough/Caddick/Cork & White for a lethal 4-man attack that caused the windies headache all summer.

Playing just 4 seamers for a start gives the captain no flexibility whatsoever - it'll be a continual 4 overs on, 4 overs off rotation throughout the day - great when things are working but one that is prone to so many dangers, especially when a bowler gets injured or is just plainly getting a bit of tap and gets forced out of the attack..

The idea of flexibilty would not be such of a problem with a top-class seam attack because in more times than not as the windies showed in their hay days that they would restrict most batting line-ups around the world & once fully fit the England pace attack clearly has that capability.

Plus this England attack showed in the ashes that if one bowler is getting smashed someone will rise up or if one is bowling well the others will compliment.

One of the biggest problems nowadays is the back-to-back test matches and the lack of recovery time, together with the amount of high-intensity cricket played.

Yes i know and i have concluded that even though once fit i know this England pace attack would be very lethal & can cause similar headaches to modern day batsmen like how the great west indies pacers did, since the likes of Freddie & Jones are very injury proned maybe the idea wont work & having the spinner to cover them wont be such a problem.

Back in the 1970's and 80's, when the great West Indies sides used this ploy to some effect (with the greatest fast quartets you could imagine), they still had other options - often they would pick a spinner (ok, not always one of the Lance Gibbs standard), or Viv would get through a fair few overs - in other words, there was a 'Plan B' for the odd occasion that sides weren't blown away, even if that was just someone doing a 'holding' job a-la Giles.

Even then, when things came unstuck, you'd end up with one or the other of the big guns (Holding in particular but I remember Garner on more than one occasion) breaking down in exactly the same way that Jones, Harmison and Flintoff have done in recent times.

The idea of playing just 4 seam bowlers and 7 batsmen can indeed be thrown away - and good riddance.

West Indies dominance years from research & knowledge would have covered 1976-1995 so really they would not have had Lance Gibbs much or at all. Their phylosophy was full on the pacers even on the turning tracks in India. Roger Harper was the main spinner during all these years & he played few a far between in test cricket.

In the likes of Vaughan & KP England have guys who could bowl some tidy back-up offspin similar to what Richards & Hooper did since they have the talent they just dont bowl enough. But in Vaughan's case his knee injury would have made his bowling abilities dimish, so again the idea of having a spinner isn't too bad.

But the idea of playing 4 seamers & 7 bats cannot be thrown away even in todays game since if a country best bowling resources are its seamers & their is no spinner making a mark. Wouldn't you want to use the best options available to you?