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***Official*** South Africa in England

Should Freddy be included in team for the second Test?


  • Total voters
    44

open365

International Vice-Captain
In this situation, i agree. South Africa have every incentive to bat negatively, going along at under 2 an over will not bother anyone in the dressing room in the slightest if they lose no wickets.
However, when people refer to letting the bowlers 'get on top of you', they mean that they can set fields so attacking that any slight mistake will usually get you out. Look at Rahul Dravid's slowest-ever-12 against England last year for a good case of batting too negatively leading to a low score.
I think it's ok logic when run scoring is a valid objective, and that by scoring runs you can actively effect the strategy of the opposing team. But in a situation where runs aren't even in the euqation, say for example a team are chasing 980 to win with 1 day remaining, there is no point in 'playing positively' or not 'letting the bowler get on top of you'. It's just one of these randomly illogical commentator sayings that really annoys me.
 

Lillian Thomson

Hall of Fame Member
I think it's ok logic when run scoring is a valid objective, and that by scoring runs you can actively effect the strategy of the opposing team. But in a situation where runs aren't even in the euqation, say for example a team are chasing 980 to win with 1 day remaining, there is no point in 'playing positively' or not 'letting the bowler get on top of you'. It's just one of these randomly illogical commentator sayings that really annoys me.
It's just normal commentators spiel, has anyone yet said "they should just play their natural game.":)
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
How do we rate Anderson's bowling in this game?
As Smith said earlier this thread, he appeared to have bowled pretty decently in the first-innings. Hasn't really threatened much today though.

Century partnership up. Both damn lucky to be there of course, but near enough everyone's forgotten that... already. 8-)
 

Uppercut

Request Your Custom Title Now!
As Smith said earlier this thread, he appeared to have bowled pretty decently in the first-innings. Hasn't really threatened much today though.

Century partnership up. Both damn lucky to be there of course, but near enough everyone's forgotten that... already. 8-)
Aha, all century partnerships, particularly opening ones, need a bit of luck. Btw, are you still of the opinion that McKenzie will never make an opener? He's looked every inch an opener to me in both innings of this match.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
It'll take more than this and a game against India on the flattest pitch in history to change my mind about McKenzie as an opener TBH.

Thing is, though, if all century opening partnerships need luck, you'll only get them when there's let-offs. Which simply isn't true.
 

Athlai

Not Terrible
Ah yes, the 'natural' game. This is of course referring to how our most primitive human form approaches the game of cricket. Now we all know the origin of cricket (clubs, rocks, sabre tooth tiger bones) and the commentators are clearly just referring to this more 'natural' time, the way the game exists in the 'natural' order of things, which is of course a way for the male of the human species to avoid the female of his species for extended periods of time. This allows the male to rest and recuperate before being made to do the lesser activities of 'cleaning up' or 'looking after one's children'.
 

Uppercut

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It'll take more than this and a game against India on the flattest pitch in history to change my mind about McKenzie as an opener TBH.

Thing is, though, if all century opening partnerships need luck, you'll only get them when there's let-offs. Which simply isn't true.
He might not turn out to be a great opening batsman, maybe even a very poor one. But he's certainly looking like an opener now, he seems to have adjusted his game very well to it.

As i've said before, i've never seen a century opening stand with no play+misses, edges that didn't carry, dropped chances etc. Smith was very lucky with the inside edge nobody appealed for. As for McKenzie's lbw, his bat was close enough to the pad to make the umpire's decision fair, if not at all the correct one. But i don't think those incidents are so damning that you should feel the need to qualify every statement you make on the quality of their innings...
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Probably due to the fact that there've so far in this Test been a whole 4 conventional edges to wicketkeepers and slips, plus a couple from ones that have bounced more than they should.

Mostly slips have been utterly pointless fielders on this pitch. They're much better served saving runs where they'll be of some use. That way if SA do manage to get bowled-out at least they might not be out of sight that way.

If there were more slips it's highly likely they'd be far less than 200 behind now.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
He might not turn out to be a great opening batsman, maybe even a very poor one. But he's certainly looking like an opener now, he seems to have adjusted his game very well to it.
I don't think 2 games is enough evidence to suggest that. He's opened well this Test, not disputing that, but this so far is the whole 2nd time he's done such a thing.
As i've said before, i've never seen a century opening stand with no play+misses, edges that didn't carry, dropped chances etc. Smith was very lucky with the inside edge nobody appealed for. As for McKenzie's lbw, his bat was close enough to the pad to make the umpire's decision fair, if not at all the correct one. But i don't think those incidents are so damning that you should feel the need to qualify every statement you make on the quality of their innings...
Smith should've been out - simple as that. Even though no-one appealed, it was a nick that was caught.

Play-and-misses and balls landing just short of or out of reach of fielders, as I've said umpteen times before, are totally different to dropped catches, missed stumpings, Umpiring repreives, etc. You'll be waiting a long time if you're searching a century \ century partnership without one of them. But let-offs are something that will usually result in dismissal. So normally, you edge one to the wicketkeeper, you're gone. If you need one of those every century, you'll not get that many.

Basically, though, it's rather imprudent for me not to mention it. I always do, and some people like to pretend to themselves that I mention it loads for players I "like" and never for those I "don't like". Which, of course, is nonsense, so I need to demonstrate that.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Reckon it also says get comfortable guys and feel free to throw your hands at it.
Even when that's happened, mostly it hasn't carried. I care less about sending messages than I do about getting batsmen out and stopping them scoring runs, hence helping us win the game.
 

Athlai

Not Terrible
Even when that's happened, mostly it hasn't carried. I care less about sending messages than I do about getting batsmen out and stopping them scoring runs, hence helping us win the game.
Reckon the positive thing to have done would be to keep the slips and the message there, the wickets will come. The Saffies won that little battle by making England concede that they weren't in total control, with this much time left in the match, the mind comes heavily into the game IMO.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Amazing how many South African international batsmen go out with ex-Miss South Africas.

50 for McKenzie, again.
 

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