robinjr
School Boy/Girl Captain
Andrew Flintoff and Mathew Hoggard ?
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*Official* Second Test at the Adelaide Oval
- Thread starter James
- Start date
Howe_zat
Audio File
Were both okay in that series. Without them it'd have been like net practise for the Aussies.
robinjr
School Boy/Girl Captain
i'd have those two ahed of all the fastbowlers you have now.
social
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Johnson and Hilf should both be gone IMO
I rate extremely low on the Clapo scale of Johnson Worship - I was one of his biggest detractors early in his Test career and maintained for quite a while that he had just been outrageously lucky. He never, to me, appears to be bowling particularly well. Even given all that though I still agree - he's proven, particularly in Australian conditions, that he can consistently take pretty cheap wickets and break key partnerships. At this stage I'd probably pick him for Adelaide (no Hilfenhaus), although if it came down to a straight choice between him and Dougey (I rate an 8.5 on a scale of 1 to Julian87) I'd take Dougey.
My main concern is that England have really done their homework on him. It's always appeared extremely obvious to me that if you look to leave the majority of Johnson's bowling as a right hander you can just wait for the leg stump trash, but after watching quality batsmen fish outside off against him for years, I just came to the conclusion that it wasn't that simple against express left arm over bowling. If Flower and Strauss have worked this out and developed a method to leave him successfully, it's possible he's been Iversoned. I think he's worth at least one more Test to bounce back though, given his track record.
Hilf is not a wicket taker (he is simply too one-dimensional) but more importantly, he simply isnt as good a bowler as either Harris or Dougeh
I'd play Johnson if it were Perth but we simply cant afford a complete passenger at Adelaide
Jarquis
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Dropping him helps how? Surely saying "Forget about the last Test, you're our best bowler" is the biggest vote of confidence you could give him right now?
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Gets him out of the team.
Not that I actually would drop Johnson, but it's not always about player management. If he's less likely to perform well in Adelaide or going forward in the rest of the series than Harris, then he shouldn't play. Dropping him wouldn't be about helping him - or not should it be - it'd be about helping the team. I don't think it would help the team, personally, but if it would then he shouldn't be selected again anyway just because it wouldn't help him.
Jarquis
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I was strictly speaking about how it helps Johnson and not the team. If confidence is so integral to him and you drop him now, you might as well say goodbye to his career.
If you reckon he's still got it in him to be a top bowler, and he hasn't been figured out, then stick with him for at least one more Test IMO. Yeah he's been out of form, yeah he had an absolutely horrific Test but none of your bowlers did particularly well besides Siddle in the 1st innings.
Hilfenhaus should be the first one on chopping block and then Doherty IMHO.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Yeah, I don't think people necessarily mind that though.
You shouldn't retain a player for a longer period just because you think he's a soft **** and would never recover. He probably shouldn't be in the team to begin with if he's that temperamental. If he's not the best option in the short to medium term, then shouldn't play. I think he is, but if people disagree, they shouldn't retain him based on the fact that it'd help him. Australia actually do have a bit of untapped fast bowling depth; there's no need to bend over backwards for Johnson if people don't think he's the right option at the moment.
Uppercut
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I'd drop Johnson for sure. It's a joke that you can have someone in the team bowling that badly when two out of Bollinger, Harris and Hilfenhaus are sitting it out. If you're worried about lower-order batting taking a hit, compromise with the quality of spinner you play.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Haha, O'Keefe's a better spinner than Doherty anyway. I promise.
Jarquis
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Hilfenhaus is hardly a vastly superior option to Johnson for this series. If it were in England, sure. But it's not and he isn't.
social
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Both O'keefe and Hauritz are better batsmen than Doherty and at least as good bowlers
Also, Johnson has been a walking wicket in tests for ages so I'm not even sure that his batting should come into it
If I had my way, Smith would replace North (no better place to blood a young bat than Adelaide), O'Keefe for Doherty, Harris For Johnson and Bolly for Hilf
However, the best we can hope for is one change IMO
Sylvester
State Captain
From that squad I'd pick a bowling lineup of
Harris
Doherty
Siddle
Bollinger
Don't see the need for 4 seamers, if we went down that road Hilfy would be the way to go but he hasn't been taking enough wickets for my liking. In Bollinger and Harris we have the more steady and wicket taking bowlers we need and Siddle can then be the strike bowler without worrying about Johnson going at 4 an over at the other end.
Harris
Doherty
Siddle
Bollinger
Don't see the need for 4 seamers, if we went down that road Hilfy would be the way to go but he hasn't been taking enough wickets for my liking. In Bollinger and Harris we have the more steady and wicket taking bowlers we need and Siddle can then be the strike bowler without worrying about Johnson going at 4 an over at the other end.
