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*** Official *** Pakistan in India

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Another person with the WRONG point of view - Sunil gavaskar

India should have declared the moment Ganguly got out

But for a late declaration, India would have pulled off an astonishing win over Pakistan and ended the series 2-0 instead of 1-0. It would have been a great way to take on the Aussies with the super confidence of such a win under their belt. Why the declaration did not come earlier is a mystery, unless allowing Dinesh Karthik, a popular member of the team, to get to a half-century was a way of ensuring that he gets on the plane to Australia.

We keep hearing that the days when Indians played for individual glory and records is long gone, but is that really so? On such a pitch there was no way Pakistan was going to be able to get 250 even if they went hammer and tongs at the bowling and 374 was simply out of the question but by batting on for so long, India did not give themselves enough overs to get Pakistan out.

This is the difference between Australia and other teams, where they are simply not satisfied with a 1-0 win margin but are looking to win by as huge a margin as possible. They would have fancied their chances of getting any team out on a pitch like this and would have given themselves every chance of winning. In India there is a tendency to sit on laurels and be satisfied, not look for more glory and it was this attitude that was supposed to have changed by the new generation, but going by the last two Test series, it appears that we are still satisfied with the 1-0 win than strive for a bigger win.

This attitude comes from our first class cricket where teams are satisfied with the first innings lead and don't try for an outright win either through complacency or sheer laziness. The thinking is why go out and field in the hot sun again when one can sit back and bat for another day after having taken the lead. That adventurousness which is the hallmark of the new generation was missing. In the past, India hardly won any games. So it was understandable that they were happy to avoid defeat. But this Pakistan side has to be the weakest to have come to India for a long, long time and a 2-0 margin would have been an apt result.

The interest in the morning session's play was whether Sourav Ganguly would be able to get to a century and join the list of those who have got a double-century and a century in the same Test. That wasn't to be though he came agonisingly close. That seemed the right time to call a halt to the innings and give themselves a lot more overs than they eventually got and if they aren't ruing it but settling for the 1-0 win, then it is going to be a real battle in Australia, for they will be much tougher opponents than the Pakistanis and there won't be such pitches to help them.

Professional Management Group
Did sun rise in the west today ? SJS finally agrees with Sunny Gavskar..or wait it is Sunny Gavaskar that agrees with him, we must all agree with SJS else he is going to post every article from every newspaper that supports his opinion.
Yet another "WRONG" opinion - Pradeep Magazine - one of India's most respected cricket writers.

Kumble's 'safekeeping' took something special away
In the deluge of spoken and written words surrounding us nowadays, there is a danger of the mind becoming numb and the senses dull. And in the images of young men jumping around like there may be no tomorrow to celebrate, lies the danger of sanity getting eroded.

It is a new age, a new world and in this world, enjoying the beauty of sport in a simple, uncomplicated manner is seen as belittling the complex world that is being created around us. To live today means to find a hundred meanings where none may exist and to bombard a mind with as many theories as possible so that in the end, the best thing to do is to stop thinking.

India have won a series against Pakistan after 27 long years. Every Indian player has played like a team man. These are reasons enough to rejoice and to look forward to the tour of Australia with hope and expectation. But somehow the last day of the Bangalore Test rankles. There was something that just did not seem right to many of us. Something, which was not sport and not cricket. Anil Kumble is a man of few words, someone who weighs everything he says carefully. He may be changing a bit in the manner he carries himself, as the demands of captaincy are not easy.

He is far more expressive now, in words and in deed and also in the physical manifestation of his happiness. With his team doing well, he sulks and broods even less. He is a skilful manipulator of his resources on the field and knows how to keep his flock together. These are all hallmarks of a strong-willed man who knows what he is doing. These are also the hallmarks of a leader who can command.

Yet there was something that did not make sense on Wednesday afternoon. While the perky Dinesh Karthik was daring his fate and completing a miserable tour for Danish Kaneria, an interesting image flashed on the TV screen.

"Please declare and don't bore us," read a placard. The camera panned on the dressing room and before it could register his expression, Kumble immediately moved away to escape this scrutiny from the third eye. More images of bored spectators wanting a declaration flashed on the screen.

One wondered why a captain was being so irrational on a wicket that was behaving like a scorned beloved thirsting for revenge. When you see short-of-length deliveries keep so low that the ball, instead of sailing over the heads of a ducking batsman, hit their knee-rolls and elbows, you know that far from making runs, even surviving would be an ask.

There was even the danger of someone getting hurt. VVS Laxsman was lucky that he only bruised his elbow and did not break it. Does the modern-day obsession with safety stretch to such ridiculous lengths that you don't feel safe with a lead of over 300 runs with only two sessions remaining, especially on a track which was playing far more dangerous pranks than a poor journalist played in the press box and got banished from it for?

It somehow did not seem right and somehow, for a few of us, took the sheen away from India's admirable display and Kumble's undoubted ability as a leader of men.
India didn't deserve to win because they had shown no intent - in fact, after lunch Kumble seemed more focused on giving Dinesh Karthik an opportunity to bat than on forcing a win - and a result would have somewhat redeemed a pitch that was just not good enough.

-Sambit Bal - Cricinfo​
Imran criticises late declaration
It is a mystery to me how subcontinent captains wish to win without risking a little losing it, says Imran Khan about Kumble's late declaration in Bangalore Test. He was talking to NDTV.

Since subcontinent mentality does not allow risking a loss, teams lose many opportunities of winning it, said the former Pakistan Captain.

Imran was emphatic that with ball going up and down so much, India could have declared much earlier​

What did I say. 8-) 8-)
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
I was furious when he wasn't declaring after having taken a 300 plus lead.

I told my wife, "This is ridiculous. I hope now India gets close to winning and cant do it because they run out of time."

Then I stopped watching the game and went back to my computer.

I am not furious any more but I am amazed at how so many Indian fans have defended this action. It shows that a defensive mind set is built into our genes so we cant just blame Kumble for it.

If we are going to be happy with our rare wins and clasp them to our bosoms fearing that any movement will mean loss of these rare treasures, the chances are that such wins will remain just that - rare.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Its just getting more and more ridiculous. It's allright if people feel that way and I really don't have a problem with it but please don't attack Indian genes and the mind set. 8-)
 

Evermind

International Debutant
I am not furious any more but I am amazed at how so many Indian fans have defended this action. It shows that a defensive mind set is built into our genes so we cant just blame Kumble for it.
Bingo. All I can say is "right on". It's so deep-rooted that it's often reflected in the military conduct as well.

Though that's a whole different can of worms I suppose.

But anyway, let us acknowledge that 1-0 is better than 27 years of failure. Here's to hoping that in the next series they act a little bolder and seize the chances.
 

Dasa

International Vice-Captain
I was furious when he wasn't declaring after having taken a 300 plus lead.

I told my wife, "This is ridiculous. I hope now India gets close to winning and cant do it because they run out of time."

Then I stopped watching the game and went back to my computer.

I am not furious any more but I am amazed at how so many Indian fans have defended this action. It shows that a defensive mind set is built into our genes so we cant just blame Kumble for it.

If we are going to be happy with our rare wins and clasp them to our bosoms fearing that any movement will mean loss of these rare treasures, the chances are that such wins will remain just that - rare.
8-) Don't say "we" - you don't speak for anyone else but yourself...and keep the idiotic and offensive crap about "genes" to yourself as well. Seriously, if it was anyone else going on and on about this it would've been called trolling.
 
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Dasa

International Vice-Captain
You decide what anyone writes here do you ?
I didn't say that. I do however, have an issue with you saying "we" when referring to Indian fans. Who are you actually calling "we"? Obviously, you're not a part of this "we" because you disagree with many Indian fans. And who are you to comment on the attitude or mindset of so many Indian fans, coming from a variety of backgrounds and locations, and who are you to generalise about anything like that? I've noticed this with you time and time again, when you find viewpoints with which you disagree, you tend to attack the attitude of the person making that point rather than argue the point itself.
Another 'genetic' defect ?

...not being able to take criticism :)
Oh, and this? Very immature. Pathetic.
 

Evermind

International Debutant
8-) Don't say "we" - you don't speak for anyone else but yourself...and keep the idiotic and offensive crap about "genes" to yourself as well. Seriously, if it was anyone else going on and on about this it would've been called trolling.
You're just proving his point about defensiveness and lack of ability to take critcism.
 

Dasa

International Vice-Captain
You're just proving his point about defensiveness and lack of ability to take critcism.
It's not a lack of ability to take criticism, criticism is fine. However, accusing people of having views influenced by "misplaced nationalism", accusing people of having no objectivity, accusing people of poor attitudes, generalising about a large number of people with no justification, and posting articles and condescending posts over a period of days (!) about an issue where there is just a simple disagreement is not criticism.
 

silentstriker

The Wheel is Forever
Silentstriker praises sound judgment

Silentstriker lashed out at critics, whom he called short sighted and irrational. According to SS, it is ironic that defensive captains such as Gavaskar have the gall to critisize an Indian captain for winning the first home series against Pakistan in 27 years. If Gavaskar was in with a one game lead, he'd still be batting in the first innings.

Since India rarely wins at home against Pakistan, it would be the height of stupidity to go for anything other than the course of action which would guarantee victory beyond a shadow of a doubt.

SS was emphatic that with such a historic series win on the line, India would have been foolhardy to put up the series up for grabs when they already had it in the bag.​
 

neutralguy

U19 Debutant
I was furious when he wasn't declaring after having taken a 300 plus lead.

I told my wife, "This is ridiculous. I hope now India gets close to winning and cant do it because they run out of time."

Then I stopped watching the game and went back to my computer.

I am not furious any more but I am amazed at how so many Indian fans have defended this action. It shows that a defensive mind set is built into our genes so we cant just blame Kumble for it.

If we are going to be happy with our rare wins and clasp them to our bosoms fearing that any movement will mean loss of these rare treasures, the chances are that such wins will remain just that - rare.

Big difference SJS. When you think about the last 3-4 series calmly, why india were not able to force wins with greater margins in tests, the real reason lie in the fact that they were trying to rewrite history and in that process are willing to compromise on their test match wins for series wins.

1. West indies series win 1-0 after some 30 years approximately
2. England series win 1-0 after some 30 years approximately
3. Indias win against pakistan at home in tests and one-dayers after some 30 years approximately.

Iam pretty confident that in the next series against same opponents, Indian captains (new or old) are not going to make conservative decisions in winning the match and series.
 

jeevan

International 12th Man
Bingo. All I can say is "right on". It's so deep-rooted that it's often reflected in the military conduct as well.

Though that's a whole different can of worms I suppose.

But anyway, let us acknowledge that 1-0 is better than 27 years of failure. Here's to hoping that in the next series they act a little bolder and seize the chances.
Never seen any one this desperate to flame bait a particular bunch of folks. Probably got spanked too hard by somebody Indian (his nanny?) as a kid and never got over it, I suppose.

Edit: Removing offensive speculation on Evermind being a Pakistani army brat.
 
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Turbinator

Cricketer Of The Year
Never seen any one this desperate to flame bait a particular bunch of folks. Probably got spanked too hard by somebody Indian (his nanny?) as a kid and never got over it, I suppose.
Or worse, could even be one of those Pakistani army brats whose dad got spanked in 1971.
:lol::lol:

Or probably got spanked himself during Kargil.
 

Fusion

Global Moderator
Never seen any one this desperate to flame bait a particular bunch of folks. Probably got spanked too hard by somebody Indian (his nanny?) as a kid and never got over it, I suppose.
Or worse, could even be one of those Pakistani army brats whose dad got spanked in 1971.
:lol::lol:

Or probably got spanked himself during Kargil.
I can't believe there are still idiots around that are willing to hurl war insults over a cricket game. I'm specially disappointed in you Turb. I've lost a lot of respect for you today. Both posts reported.
 

Turbinator

Cricketer Of The Year
I can't believe there are still idiots around that are willing to hurl war insults over a cricket game. I'm specially disappointed in you Turb. I've lost a lot of respect for you today. Both posts reported.
Dude honestly, no disrespect meant, was just stating a reason for Everminds' posts constantly attacking India. Apologies if you or anyone else got offended, but in no way did I mean to hurl a war insult, I guess it just came out the wrong way.
 

Beleg

International Regular
Mate, it didn't 'come out the wrong way.' If you hadn't meant to hurl a war insult you wouldn't have posted what you wrote. Yer excuse just made me chortle.

In any case, it's silly to blame Kumble for not declaring earlier.
 

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