***Official*** New Zealand in the West Indies 2014

[Flem274*]

Didn't realise King Kirk scored 50. WAG.

Yeah well another McCullum/Watling special would be good. Drop anchor in the second innings, but look to push singles to keep things ticking.

 

[Kippax]

 

[Blocky]

Bravo tends to be boom or bust though, centuries or nothing in between. It's not surprising that he can score runs, it's just not something you expect he'll do consistently. He's been the type of guy that'll score a century every few tests but have lean patches in between.

I've been one of Williamson's hardest critics due to his inconsistency and the fact that he tends to follow up a good score with a low score, not to mention soft dismissals at a time he should be putting the opposition to the sword.

In many ways, Bravo is the same.

 

[WindieWeathers]

 

[Beamer]

Bravo tends to be boom or bust though, centuries or nothing in between. It's not surprising that he can score runs, it's just not something you expect he'll do consistently. He's been the type of guy that'll score a century every few tests but have lean patches in between.

I've been one of Williamson's hardest critics due to his inconsistency and the fact that he tends to follow up a good score with a low score, not to mention soft dismissals at a time he should be putting the opposition to the sword.

In many ways, Bravo is the same.

Darren has 6 centuries and 8 half centuries in 52 innings. That's not a terrible consistency rate at all, especially for a young batsman. In fact it took him a while to get the first test hundred as he kept giving it away after reaching 50. Now he has discovered the art of scoring big hundreds just like his mentor BCL.

Bravo averages 45, Williamson 38. They've both played approximately the same number of tests. I think it's quite clear Darren is ahead.

 

[Bahnz]

No he certainly hasn't. Hasn't found a length at all - either well short of a length or long HVs, which is also along the lines of how he bowled in the ODIs over our summer. I'd only be guessing but for a lot of guys it can be a mental thing - takes a while to trust the ball coming out of your hand. He needs conditions to be in his favour at the moment to be successful, can't see him being too much of a factor here, in the UAE etc. That's certainly not to say a tall guy who can bowl 140+ won't rectify that.

Anderson was completely toothless v India over the summer (Test wise). I think over time his bowling will become a very secondary entity to his batting.

It's worth remembering that a decent clump of Neesham's Plunket Shield wickets from last season were basically T20 wickets taken during a 4th innings chase for 150ish (iirc). Also, I think people need to qualify their statements about Neesham being 140+. For a start, I can't remember him ever bowling faster than about 140 flat in ODI's. Given that fast bowlers usually bowl slower in tests than in ODI's (for obvious reasons) I would usually expect Jimmy to be in the 130-135 range in the longer form.

Still he's definitely been worse than I would've expected from a bowler who took 15 wickets at 30 for Otago last season. I wonder if he's been focussing on his batting and ignoring his bowling over the past few months.

 

[Bahnz]

Bravo averages 45, Williamson 38. They've both played approximately the same number of tests. I think it's quite clear Darren is ahead.

Yeah, that's fair. Of course, Kane has the defence that he's a couple of years younger than Bravo, and has shown significant improvement in the last 18 months, so I think the gap is narrower than their career records suggest. But yeah, at this stage Bravo has the edge.

 

[WindieWeathers]

Brathwaite= outstanding and tbh it's no surprise because like i said the boy has been on fire for two years now...and the more he plays the more his game and technique will be enhanced...so happy for the kid.

Bravo= believe it or not i had to defend this man on WI forums because some wanted him dropped...today he showed his undoubted class.

Edwards= Must admit i wanted him dropped after the first test but well done to Kirk...he's a senior guy in the team now and it was good to see him batting with confidence.

The Bravo/Brathwaite partnership was just a dream to watch...and those two will surely form the backbone of our top order for many years to come.

Tomorrow will be about Roach and Shiv trying to use up the new ball as much as possible before young Blackwood makes his debut and also Ramdin is there too. Would be happy with a 150 lead but if we can get above that of course that would be great.

Today we seemed to finally have a plan at the crease...frustrate Southee and Boult and then have a go at Craig, Sodhi and Neesham...like yesterday i won't be making any bold statements (like some on this forum) but no doubt we're in a decent position here.

 

[Blocky]

Darren has 6 centuries and 8 half centuries in 52 innings. That's not a terrible consistency rate at all, especially for a young batsman. In fact it took him a while to get the first test hundred as he kept giving it away after reaching 50. Now he has discovered the art of scoring big hundreds just like his mentor BCL.

Bravo averages 45, Williamson 38. They've both played approximately the same number of tests. I think it's quite clear Darren is ahead.

It's the recent performance aspect, in their last ten matches

Bravo scored 712 at an average of 44.5, 3 centuries, 1 fifty from 10 matches
Kane scored 818 at an average of 48.11, 3 centuries, 5 fifties.

Bravo had a double tonne, Kane never scored higher than 113.
That's what I mean about consistency. I used to bag Williamson because he wasn't a consistent player (hence an inferior average at the time that he's now rebuilding) - recently, he's a lot less boom or bust. Bravo still seems to be a guy that scores a big one, or not much at all.

 

[Flem274*]

Young batsmen are never going to be perfect. Both should rectify it in time.

 

[Bahnz]

Also, while overall it was a bad day for us, I want to say well done to Boult. He bowled superbly, and was pretty much the only bowler who applied any kind of a hand brake on WI's progress. It's probably the best that he's bowled all year by a distance.

 

[Howsie]

Now he has discovered the art of scoring big hundreds just like his mentor BCL.

Which is the major difference between both Williamson and Bravo. They've both scored six test 100's except Williamson averages 114 per hundred and Bravo 158. It's both the one big criticism of Williamson and his batting and the one big exceptional thing about Bravo's.

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah, which is odd given that Kane has historically had no problems scoring big hundreds in FC cricket.

 

[Howsie]

Yeah, which is odd given that Kane has historically had no problems scoring big hundreds in FC cricket.

Except for the last few years. The summer before he made his debut for New Zealand he was scoring some big hundreds for ND, iirc he scored a couple of 190's. Aside from his 284* has he gone past 150 at all since then in any first class game? I mean he hasn't scored a hundred for Yorkshire yet but probably has 10+ 50's for them.

Edit: Yep, his highest score in his last 41 first class games is 135. He's scored six 100's and 20's 50's during that period.

 

[RxGM]

Also, while overall it was a bad day for us, I want to say well done to Boult. He bowled superbly, and was pretty much the only bowler who applied any kind of a hand brake on WI's progress. It's probably the best that he's bowled all year by a distance.

And had a fever

 

[Zinzan]

Some people have agenda's Kyear...it's ok let them talk .

Agenda? Or perhaps a case of telling it like it is. Flattering yourself thinking people would have an agenda against you don't you think?

 

[_Ed_]

And had a fever

Did he? That's a massive effort.

 

[SteveNZ]

It's worth remembering that a decent clump of Neesham's Plunket Shield wickets from last season were basically T20 wickets taken during a 4th innings chase for 150ish (iirc). Also, I think people need to qualify their statements about Neesham being 140+. For a start, I can't remember him ever bowling faster than about 140 flat in ODI's. Given that fast bowlers usually bowl slower in tests than in ODI's (for obvious reasons) I would usually expect Jimmy to be in the 130-135 range in the longer form.

Still he's definitely been worse than I would've expected from a bowler who took 15 wickets at 30 for Otago last season. I wonder if he's been focussing on his batting and ignoring his bowling over the past few months.

Yep he's not consistently 140+ but he can get there, which is what I mean. I can't comment on what he's been focusing on, but it looks like a release issue - perhaps confidence-based. I remember him bowling big in-duckers in club cricket as well, but I think he's going to be groomed as an into the deck, hit the splice sort of guy who is hard to get away in ODIs (not there yet I know)

And he'll learn to be a successful #6, he can't play the sort of awful swipe he did in the first dig.

 

[RxGM]

Did he? That's a massive effort.

That's what they were saying on the radio.

 

[Kippax]

Sort of a Sodhi of pace. Even in his finest bowling hour, you just wonder whether the mechanics can ever really deliver a pitch map to be proud of.