*Official* New Zealand in England 2015

[Hurricane]

Tim is a 135 k bowler. He doesn't have the pace to beat batsmen through the air like a Johnson or a Starc does. Even then he still slips the occasional one through batsmen's defences (see his deliveries to Moeen and Taylor at the cake tin earlier this year). You only need to take a casual glance at the jablillion wickets that Starc has picked up in the 6 months to see that a ton of them have come from full swinging deliveries. Your posting in the last hour has been like Southee's bowling this series. Utter tripe from a guy who normally produces stuff of a very high standard.

have a spell, I'm really not sure what point you're trying to make. Just because it's not guaranteed to get a wicket doesn't make it invalid as a wicket taking option.

I will quit as I can see I am riling people up.

The point I will pay out is that there is a difference between a 150kms yorker and a 135-140kms yorker.

My only real argument was that I would like to think a top order batsman would keep out a 150 km yorker if they made an effort to do so.

Will retire from this now before B blows a gasket.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I will quit as I can see I am riling people up.

The point I will pay out is that there is a difference between a 150kms yorker and a 135-140kms yorker.

My only real argument was that I would like to think a top order batsman would keep out a 150 km yorker if they made an effort to do so.

Will retire from this now before B blows a gasket.

Yeah but Vettori's not a top order batsman ffs Hurricane

Regardless, I wouldn't have been surprised if a top order bat got out to that delivery either. Itw as quick, accurate, swinging, and bowled with a slingy action. Ridiculously difficult to keep out.

 

[Bahnz]

I will quit as I can see I am riling people up.

The point I will pay out is that there is a difference between a 150kms yorker and a 135-140kms yorker.

My only real argument was that I would like to think a top order batsman would keep out a 150 km yorker if they made an effort to do so.

Will retire from this now before B blows a gasket.

Yeah 'Cane I love ya almost as much as I love Kane, but can't agree in the slightest so will call it a day.

 

[NZTailender]

Anyone who played Shane Warne Cricket '99 multiplayer knew that bowling a yorker every delivery worked at the beginning but eventually you just walked down the crease to get under it and turn it into a 6 because you knew it was coming.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Anyone who played Shane Warne Cricket '99 multiplayer knew that bowling a yorker every delivery worked at the beginning but eventually you just walked down the crease to get under it and turn it into a 6 because you knew it was coming.

Nothing more deadly than a 65 mph half tracker which almost bounces twice before the batsman hits it. They see it coming, but the bails fly every time.

 

[Bahnz]

Anyone who played Shane Warne Cricket '99 multiplayer knew that bowling a yorker every delivery worked at the beginning but eventually you just walked down the crease to get under it and turn it into a 6 because you knew it was coming.

Didn't think you could walk down the crease in SWC'99. You could sorta slide from side to side, but as a batsman you were permanently stuck in the crease. Which from an NZ fan's point of view made it a very realistic simulation indeed.

 

[wellAlbidarned]

Nothing more deadly than a 65 mph half tracker which almost bounces twice before the batsman hits it. They see it coming, but the bails fly every time.

My favourite was using a spinner and lobbing a flighted delivery over the batsman's head and onto the stumps

 

[Salamuddin]

NZ are a good team but I think people are over hyping them slightly.

Let's look at their results objectively:

A 0-0 away draw with Bangladesh - so so result
Beating the WIndies twice (home and away) - yeah good but the WIndies are undoubtedly the weakest test team at the moment even if they do have some promising youngsters coming through.
Home wins against India and Sri Lanka - neither of whom are particularly good touring sides. And really had Kohli not dropped a dolly of Mccullum, NZ would almost certainly have lost that wellington test.
Away draw against England - a decent result but let's not get carried away. England aren't that strong - I would have been more impressed has NZ actually won the series. The way they were unable to force the issue in that first test from a position of strength is telling.
Away draw with Pakistan - probably their best result but again it was hardly a vintage Pakistan side. The fact that Pakistan spanked the Aussies 2-0 just before is more a reflection of how overrated Australia really are.

So in short, while I think they've played well I still don't think they've achieved anything really special. If they can beat OZ away later this year or even draw in Oz and maybe win or get a draw in India next year I'd start getting more excited.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Oh boy

 

[wellAlbidarned]

I personally don't think you can rate a side until they've beaten a team composed of reanimated corpses of past greats playing at the south pole of mars

 

[Bahnz]

NZ are a good team but I think people are over hyping them slightly.

Let's look at their results objectively:

A 0-0 away draw with Bangladesh - so so result
Beating the WIndies twice (home and away) - yeah good but the WIndies are undoubtedly the weakest test team at the moment even if they do have some promising youngsters coming through.
Home wins against India and Sri Lanka - neither of whom are particularly good touring sides. And really had Kohli not dropped a dolly of Mccullum, NZ would almost certainly have lost that wellington test.
Away draw against England - a decent result but let's not get carried away. England aren't that strong - I would have been more impressed has NZ actually won the series. The way they were unable to force the issue in that first test from a position of strength is telling.
Away draw with Pakistan - probably their best result but again it was hardly a vintage Pakistan side. The fact that Pakistan spanked the Aussies 2-0 just before is more a reflection of how overrated Australia really are.

So in short, while I think they've played well I still don't think they've achieved anything really special. If they can beat OZ away later this year or even draw in Oz and maybe win or get a draw in India next year I'd start getting more excited.

I don't think anyone is really overhyping New Zealand. The main things that I've seen people saying are that

a) New Zealand are the 3rd best team in the world: difficult to say for certain but they've played every other member of the 3-7 chasing pack in the last 18 months and have a 5-2-2 record against them, which certainly makes a persuasive argument. They've also been probably the most convincing of those sides when on tour, which is another big tick for them.

b) This is the best New Zealand side ever: not 100% convinced on this but it's certainly arguable. No New Zealand side has ever produced the kind of consistency in such a wide variety of conditions as the current one has. I'd also say that no New Zealand side in history has as many genuine test quality players as the current side does (even if none of them are a megastar like Hadlee - and no Flem, Kane still isn't going to take 200 wickets - unless he plays about 50 tests against England).

However, for me to believe that this is NZ's best ever test side, I think they'd first need to do something like win or at least draw a home series against South Africa. Hadlee's heroes had a winning home record against the Windies in the 80's, McCullum's marauders would need to do something similar to the current #1's.

 

[kiwiviktor81]

b) This is the best New Zealand side ever: not 100% convinced on this but it's certainly arguable. No New Zealand side has ever produced the kind of consistency in such a wide variety of conditions as the current one has. I'd also say that no New Zealand side in history has as many genuine test quality players as the current side does (even if none of them are a megastar like Hadlee - and no Flem, Kane still isn't going to take 200 wickets - unless he plays about 50 tests against England).

One thing we have to keep in mind is that a lot of people are rating this BCs side on potential. Really only Taylor and McCullum could be said to be the finished product in terms of playing at the peak of their career. Williamson, Southee, Boult, Henry, Latham, Watling, Craig, Anderson, Neesham, and even Guptill to an extent are all likely to be considerably better players in 3 or 4 years time than they are now.

 

[CricAddict]

NZ are a good team but I think people are over hyping them slightly.

Let's look at their results objectively:

A 0-0 away draw with Bangladesh - so so result
Beating the WIndies twice (home and away) - yeah good but the WIndies are undoubtedly the weakest test team at the moment even if they do have some promising youngsters coming through.
Home wins against India and Sri Lanka - neither of whom are particularly good touring sides. And really had Kohli not dropped a dolly of Mccullum, NZ would almost certainly have lost that wellington test.
Away draw against England - a decent result but let's not get carried away. England aren't that strong - I would have been more impressed has NZ actually won the series. The way they were unable to force the issue in that first test from a position of strength is telling.
Away draw with Pakistan - probably their best result but again it was hardly a vintage Pakistan side. The fact that Pakistan spanked the Aussies 2-0 just before is more a reflection of how overrated Australia really are.

So in short, while I think they've played well I still don't think they've achieved anything really special. If they can beat OZ away later this year or even draw in Oz and maybe win or get a draw in India next year I'd start getting more excited.

So out of nine test playing nations (forget Zimbabwe at the moment), you have eliminated Bangladesh, Windies, India, Srilanka, England and Pakistan as weak teams. So that counts to 9-6=3 which is exactly what people are saying. Saying that NZ is at No 3 out of 3 teams is not overrating in any way.

 

[CaptainGrumpy]

NZ are a good team but I think people are over hyping them slightly.

Let's look at their results objectively:

A 0-0 away draw with Bangladesh - so so result
Beating the WIndies twice (home and away) - yeah good but the WIndies are undoubtedly the weakest test team at the moment even if they do have some promising youngsters coming through.
Home wins against India and Sri Lanka - neither of whom are particularly good touring sides. And really had Kohli not dropped a dolly of Mccullum, NZ would almost certainly have lost that wellington test.
Away draw against England - a decent result but let's not get carried away. England aren't that strong - I would have been more impressed has NZ actually won the series. The way they were unable to force the issue in that first test from a position of strength is telling.
Away draw with Pakistan - probably their best result but again it was hardly a vintage Pakistan side. The fact that Pakistan spanked the Aussies 2-0 just before is more a reflection of how overrated Australia really are.

So in short, while I think they've played well I still don't think they've achieved anything really special. If they can beat OZ away later this year or even draw in Oz and maybe win or get a draw in India next year I'd start getting more excited.

Who took the jam out of your donut?

NZ tied their last tour to Aus in 2011/2012, NZ is a stronger team now, and Aus may be weaker.

If India could tie a series in England, New Zealand or Australia they might have a bowler worth watching.

 

[hendrix]

What's more, after the World Cup, the public will be absolutely gagging for a few ODI's against Australia..

I guess what surprises me is the fact that they don't think the public will be absolutely gagging for Tests against Australia.

I still think there's a lot of commercial viability in not only the ticketing but also the broadcasting rights for a Test series between the current number 2 vs number 4 ranked sides. Particularly if the away series goes decently.

 

[CaptainGrumpy]

ODI night audiences.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I can't believe we're actually ranked number 3. Feels so wrong.

 

[vic_orthdox]

I guess what surprises me is the fact that they don't think the public will be absolutely gagging for Tests against Australia.

I still think there's a lot of commercial viability in not only the ticketing but also the broadcasting rights for a Test series between the current number 2 vs number 4 ranked sides. Particularly if the away series goes decently.

Interest will be there, but can only convert it into $$$ with ODIs, really.

Was disappointed to see the article, but didn't realise that there weren't any ODIs on the tour at all. Practical reality as it turns from a tour that the NZ board should have, to one that now can have tangible benefits financially.

 

[Hurricane]

I can't believe we're actually ranked number 3. Feels so wrong.

Who do India have next in tests?

 

[Spark]

sa.