**Official** New Zealand in Australia

[Flem274*]

"I think you saw from Haddin's reaction that he knew something was wrong so he probably should have made more noise about it," Vettori said.

"It is (disappointing) because I thought that was the partnership that was going to win the game, so it put us under a bit more pressure. We've just got to make sure it doesn't happen again."

Nothing much, but it probably would've been smarter to have just remained diplomatic about the whole thing. Ponting was not impressed, though he admittedly hadn't seen the dismissal.

"I think he'd better make sure he's 100 per cent right before he comes out and makes those sort of statements. It's a bit much, he's basically claiming (Haddin's) a cheat, isn't he? That's a bit strong unless they're 100 per cent certain," Ponting said.

"We'll wait and see. If (a replay) does show anything that Brad is in the clear, I'll certainly be letting Daniel know about it.

"It's probably worth Haddin having a chat to him as well. He's basically had a bit of a crack at Haddin's makeup."

I think Saint Ponting should really keep quiet, because Vettori has a very good point. He didn't call him a cheat either Saint Ricky.

 

[Burgey]

Amazing how the game's changed y'know? I remember Greg Dyer in the 80s claiming a catch down leg side that bounced (think in the Ashes of 86-87). The bloke's career basically ended within a match or two after that - he was treated like a leper.

These days it seems to be "That's a bit suss, isn't it? Now we'll move on to the next game". Sad, really.

 

[TazzX]

Controversies and Issues - How was that out? Brad Haddin cheats - CricketCrowd – Rich ...

Here is the Haddin incident if anyone is wondering. Clear as day what happened there ...

 

[HMas]

Best NZ ODI team for India series

Ryder
McCullum
Guptil
Taylor
Styris
Oram
Broom/Elliot
Mills
Vettori
Southee
Brian

 

[Top_Cat]

Amazing how the game's changed y'know? I remember Greg Dyer in the 80s claiming a catch down leg side that bounced (think in the Ashes of 86-87). The bloke's career basically ended within a match or two after that - he was treated like a leper.

These days it seems to be "That's a bit suss, isn't it? Now we'll move on to the next game". Sad, really.

Two reasons I reckon;

1) I think it's been acknowledged that blokes like Dyer were treated poorly and, although he should have been sanctioned, in my view, there's no way an incident like that should be career-ending. Same with a bloke like Meckiff. So people are less likly to just stomp on a player these days.

2) Better TV coverage means you see more of the game and that most players, whilst maybe not actively cheating, don't throw back a break which comes their way and pretty much always have. Since the 'problem' is more widespread than people thought, we see it more often so it seems less shocking I think. The coverage helps the other way too; many incidents where players might have been black-balled in the past, people understand that although it looked bad, the player probably genuinely didn't know exactly what happened.

 

[Flem274*]

Warner
Jaques
Clarke
Hodge
Dussey
Hopes (might help him slightly if he's up the order a wee bit)
Haddin
Johnson
Bracken
Tait
Bollinger

IMO.

For NZ


Guptill
BFJ
Howitzer/Watling/Pinga (drop Cumming FFS and bring in one of these guys )
Taylor
Broom
McCullum
Elliott
Millsssssssssssssssssssy
Vettori
Southee
O'Brilliant

There, the side remains balanced and I've managed to avoid the possibility of Diremanti playing.

 

[Top_Cat]

Controversies and Issues - How was that out? Brad Haddin cheats - CricketCrowd – Rich ...

Here is the Haddin incident if anyone is wondering. Clear as day what happened there ...

Too easy from the sidelines.

Should definitely have been a no-ball call from the umpire or at least queried. The bails were flicked so lightly, though, that I doubt Haddin would have felt it. Noticed a bit of hesitation when he took the ball so I reckon he was wondering whether he did flick them but then, because he didn't feel it, might reasoned that the ball had just flicked the bails because it was pretty damn close. Far be it from me to defend him because I'm not a fan and I can see Vettori's point that he might have at least said he wasn't sure but if Haddin said he didn't feel his gloves touch the bails, I'd believe him. Ponting's defensive reaction isn't helpful, though.

 

[Flem274*]

Best NZ ODI team for India series

Ryder
McCullum
Guptil
Taylor
Styris
Oram
Broom/Elliot
Mills
Vettori
Southee
Brian

This is the Australian series. Lets wait until the Indian series or post in the tour thread.

 

[Burgey]

Tazz, thanks for posting it.

Certainly seems to me it's not out. Whether he did it consciously or not, well I guess only he can tell you about that.

 

[cowboysfan]

umpires should be aware that aussies will try every trick in the book-they should be very vigilant in every dissmisal.

 

[KiWiNiNjA]

I think all the allegations are a bit over the top, especially the ones about "Aussies are cheats", and "Aussies doing anything to win".

Yeah, it shouldn't have been given out.
Yeah, by looking at the replays it looks as if Haddin had to of noticed that something was wrong.

But the fact of the matter is, that in the heat of the moment he obviously didn't, and if he says that he didn't then all we can do is take his word for it. Maybe he was unsure at the time, but the umpires said nothing and he was well in his right to claim the dismissal, even if his celebration was a little bit over the top for something that was so marginal. That probably had to do with the situation of the game more than anything.

So all this talk of it being deliberate is a bit over the top, IMO.
Just let it go, in the end it didn't effect the result, and can be forgiven. It's the umpiring that needs to be looked at here.

 

[cowboysfan]

I think all the allegations are a bit over the top, especially the ones about "Aussies are cheats", and "Aussies doing anything to win".

Yeah, it shouldn't have been given out.
Yeah, by looking at the replays it looks as if Haddin had to of noticed that something was wrong.

But the fact of the matter is, that in the heat of the moment he obviously didn't, and if he says that he didn't then all we can do is take his word for it. Maybe he was unsure at the time, but the umpires said nothing and he was well in his right to claim the dismissal, even if his celebration was a little bit over the top for something that was so marginal. That probably had to do with the situation of the game more than anything.

So all this talk of it being deliberate is a bit over the top, IMO.
Just let it go, in the end it didn't effect the result, and can be forgiven. It's the umpiring that needs to be looked at here.

there is no way a keeper doesnt know he put his gloves in FRONT of the stumps-no way.that is his job to keep his gloves behind the stumps.i dont buy it.

 

[Bahnz]

Too easy from the sidelines.

Should definitely have been a no-ball call from the umpire or at least queried. The bails were flicked so lightly, though, that I doubt Haddin would have felt it. Noticed a bit of hesitation when he took the ball so I reckon he was wondering whether he did flick them but then, because he didn't feel it, might reasoned that the ball had just flicked the bails because it was pretty damn close. Far be it from me to defend him because I'm not a fan and I can see Vettori's point that he might have at least said he wasn't sure but if Haddin said he didn't feel his gloves touch the bails, I'd believe him. Ponting's defensive reaction isn't helpful, though.

As a wicketkeeper myself (albeit a piss poor one), I can say with a good deal of confidence that he would've felt his fingers touching the stumps. Doesn't mean that he didn't think the ball hit the stumps beforehand, especially given how both bails popped off, but I'm pretty sure he would've felt it.

 

[KiWiNiNjA]

there is no way a keeper doesnt know he put his gloves in FRONT of the stumps-no way.that is his job to keep his gloves behind the stumps.i dont buy it.

Yes, he shouldn't have had them in front of the stumps but it was a very close thing. When he is keeping he isn't looking at the stumps, but rather the ball. I'm willing to believe that in the heat of the moment he wasn't aware of hitting the bails, and maybe in the split second that it all happened believed that if there was anything hitting the gloves then it was the bails be dislodged after the ball had hit the stumps before entering his gloves.

He may have been over celebratory, but in the end of the day it was the umpires who let him "get away with it".

Like Uppercut said, I view the Collingwood incident as far worse.

 

[cowboysfan]

Yes, he shouldn't have had them in front of the stumps but it was a very close thing. When he is keeping he isn't looking at the stumps, but rather the ball. I'm willing to believe that in the heat of the moment he wasn't aware of hitting the bails, and maybe in the split second that it all happened believed that if there was anything hitting the gloves then it was the bails be dislodged after the ball had hit the stumps before entering his gloves.

He may have been over celebratory, but in the end of the day it was the umpires who let him "get away with it".

Like Uppercut said, I view the Collingwood incident as far worse.

you are giving him the benefit of the doubt-fair enough,unfortunately previous incidents by other aussie players means i cannot.

 

[KiWiNiNjA]

you are giving him the benefit of the doubt-fair enough,unfortunately previous incidents by other aussie players means i cannot.

But you can't judge one player by previous incidents of another. That's just silly.

Obviously if NZ had of lost I wouldn't be so sporting but.....

 

[Bahnz]

He may have been over celebratory, but in the end of the day it was the umpires who let him "get away with it".

You certainly can't lay any blame on the umpires. In real time, from behind the bowlers arm, it was obviously out. No questions. And there's no way that the square leg umpire was going to call a no ball for Brad Haddin having his gloves an inch in front of the stumps for half a second.

 

[Top_Cat]

As a wicketkeeper myself (albeit a piss poor one), I can say with a good deal of confidence that he would've felt his fingers touching the stumps. Doesn't mean that he didn't think the ball hit the stumps beforehand, especially given how both bails popped off, but I'm pretty sure he would've felt it.

Surely if he thought he flicked the bails, he would have been able to realise that he must have flicked them before the ball hit the stumps? I know what you're saying and most of the time it's true. Just looked like a very light flick to me and I do query whether he felt it.

Have only kept for a laugh, though, so I'm not speaking from a position of authority here.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

And there's no way that the square leg umpire was going to call a no ball for Brad Haddin having his gloves an inch in front of the stumps for half a second.

Rubbish. I've called keepers for exactly this thing from Square Leg. It's quite easy to tell if the keeper's put his gloves in front before the ball has reached him.

 

[cowboysfan]

But you can't judge one player by previous incidents of another. That's just silly.

Obviously if NZ had of lost I wouldn't be so sporting but.....

sure you can if the team has made cheating into an art form-i guess you have forgotten a lot.