***Official*** India in South Africa

[silentstriker]

Thats true....id try him against WI and SL in january and feb...... in india, where its safe!!

And he'll score a century and tell you absolutely nothing about his true class. This is TEST CRICKET mate, you can't coddle players. At this level, you've got to be ready to put them in whenever they might be needed, and then have the conviction to give them a fair run if they flounder initially.

 

[adharcric]

Thats true! Would've wanted VVS to go on and score a better one today! Pathan on for a big score? Or will he just fall tomm anyway? Doesnt really matter IMO as the indian batting has just failed!

Also, y do some of u want VRV Singh in the side! He's crap, TBH!! I guess ur looking to replace Munaf......but i still think india should go in with 2 spinners. VRV got some wickets today, but doesnt he always do that in the warm up games and then fail anyway??

Exactly how many times has VRV been used as a strike bowler in a test match for India?
Exactly how many times have you watched him bowl at the first-class level?
He's done well in the opportunities he's gotten and you'd have to be blind to say he isn't talented.

 

[adharcric]

And he'll score a century and tell you absolutely nothing about his true class. This is TEST CRICKET mate, you can't coddle players. At this level, you've got to be ready to put them in whenever they might be needed, and then have the conviction to give them a fair run if they flounder initially.

Completely agree, but I don't have full faith in the selectors' ability to do that last part.
I guess after seeing some of our young talent being misused, I fear for new Indian cricketers in tough situations.

 

[Jono]

Well I reckon this test series is a massive test for Sachin. He has to stand up really, simple as that. His country hasn't needed him this much since the 2003 World Cup.

See, I wasn't worried about Sachin despite all his indifferent form from 2003 to late 2005, but I officially was very concerned during the 3rd test vs. England in Mumbai. I felt like crying when I saw him bat against James Anderson in the way he did.

 

[Anil]

I wouldn't say Laxman and Ganguly are necessarily out of form. Neither is Dravid, but he can lift himself out of form any day. Sehwag, Jaffer and Tendulkar are the main worries.

you mean into form, don't you? not sure about sehwag, but i have a feeling jaffer and tendulkar will struggle to begin with but will come good in the test series(might have to eat my words of course but still...)

Badrinath may have been a good option but there is a valid argument against pitting a youngster on debut against Ntini, Pollock and Nel.

no that's really not a valid argument...so should all youngsters debut against bangladesh then?

 

[PhoenixFire]

Didn't he score 141* not too long ago against Australia not too long ago?

 

[adharcric]

no that's really not a valid argument...so should all youngsters debut against bangladesh then?

yeah i took that back already.

 

[silentstriker]

Completely agree, but I don't have full faith in the selectors' ability to do that last part.
I guess after seeing some of our young talent being misused, I fear for new Indian cricketers in tough situations.

Yea, its true that often they don't get a run. Raina IMO got a fair run, and the same should be done with players like Badrinath.

 

[silentstriker]

Exactly how many times has VRV been used as a strike bowler in a test match for India?
Exactly how many times have you watched him bowl at the first-class level?
He's done well in the opportunities he's gotten and you'd have to be blind to say he isn't talented.

VRV is talented but wayward from what I've seen of him. With that said, I can't really think of a replacement (Gagandeep Singh, but selectors are stupid) so I suppose he has to play.

 

[adharcric]

VRV is talented but wayward from what I've seen of him. With that said, I can't really think of a replacement (Gagandeep Singh, but selectors are stupid) so I suppose he has to play.

As I said earlier, VRV is a lot like Harmison but not as wayward. If he's fit, he usually bowls some excellent spells.

 

[adharcric]

Yea, its true that often they don't get a run. Raina IMO got a fair run, and the same should be done with players like Badrinath.

They overdid it with Raina. When he was struggling for form, they put him down the order.
When he continued to struggle, they continued to play him and killed his confidence.

 

[silentstriker]

As I said earlier, VRV is a lot like Harmison but not as wayward. If he's fit, he usually bowls some excellent spells.

Without his speed and bounce though.

 

[Nishant]

And he'll score a century and tell you absolutely nothing about his true class. This is TEST CRICKET mate, you can't coddle players. At this level, you've got to be ready to put them in whenever they might be needed, and then have the conviction to give them a fair run if they flounder initially.

Yeh! Give them a good run for a while , where they just mess up....then they will be treated like Raina and forgotten and critised by people like you!

Its very easy to just say...put him into the team in a tough situation....but it doesn't always work out! You have to give them a bit of confidence first. In that way, they will feel that they belong in the team. Otherwise, they all will just start playing for themselves.

Speaking of test and one day cricket. Form is transferred from one form of the game to the other! IMO, in test cricket, we dont need to give young palyers a chance yet. Tell them to prove themselves in ODIs. Thats because if they cant prove themselves in the ODI arena.....they definitely cant do it in test cricket!!

Finally, about true class......even tendulkar is struggling on these pitches and so is Dravid!! Does that suddenly mean they have no class. Just because players do well in india and mess up overseas does not make them a bad player. The true test is being able to adapt yourself to certain conditions. If a young player plays in SA right now and fails...he will be instantly thought of as rubbish and will not be tried out in india either!

I say, first give them confidence....if then they cant do well....they should be dropped!!

 

[adharcric]

Without his speed and bounce though.

He does have pace and bounce though. Not Harmison-esque, but it's a handful nevertheless.
His good spells come in the high 80s with almost Harmison-esque natural bounce.
Of course, all this means nothing until he takes big wickets for India in test matches.

 

[silentstriker]

Yeh! Give them a good run for a while , where they just mess up....then they will be treated like Raina and forgotten and critised by people like you!

Raina got more than a fair run. He is just not good enough at this point.

Its very easy to just say...put him into the team in a tough situation....but it doesn't always work out! You have to give them a bit of confidence first. In that way, they will feel that they belong in the team. Otherwise, they all will just start playing for themselves.

Test cricket is not a pre-school. They better have confidence already. And if it doesn't work out, you have to stick with them to give them a fair run!

Speaking of test and one day cricket. Form is transferred from one form of the game to the other!

No, it doesn't. Sehwag was good in Tests while being rubbish in ODI. Tendulkar does better now in ODI than tests.

IMO, in test cricket, we dont need to give young palyers a chance yet. Tell them to prove themselves in ODIs. Thats because if they cant prove themselves in the ODI arena.....they definitely cant do it in test cricket!!

Wrong. Aaksh Chopra would be the worst ODI selection in the history of cricket. He would not be a bad Test selection.

Just because players do well in india and mess up overseas does not make them a bad player.

Yes, it does.

The true test is being able to adapt yourself to certain conditions. If a young player plays in SA right now and fails...he will be instantly thought of as rubbish and will not be tried out in india either!

Give them a fair try.

I say, first give them confidence....if then they cant do well....they should be dropped!!

They better not be short on confidence by the time they come into the test side.

 

[C_C]

Yes, it does.

Actually no, it doesnt.
Besides, you should realise that Indian batsmen of the highest class are usually significantly better overseas than most other great batsmen from elsewhere, considering subcontinent vs outside subcontinent is a massively huge difference compared to England vs OZ.

 

[silentstriker]

Actually no, it doesnt.
Besides, you should realise that Indian batsmen of the highest class are usually significantly better overseas than most other great batsmen from elsewhere, considering subcontinent vs outside subcontinent is a massively huge difference compared to England vs OZ.

Yup, but for my money good batsmen should be able to perform outside as well as within India.

 

[C_C]

Yup, but for my money good batsmen should be able to perform outside as well as within India.

Most good batsmen do...infact a lot of Indian batsmen of the current gen. have better records outside India than in India...hardly surprising, given that India hasnt been as much of a road as Australia/England/Pakistan/WI in the recent years.

 

[silentstriker]

Most good batsmen do...infact a lot of Indian batsmen of the current gen. have better records outside India than in India.

Right, so we don't disagree...what were you disagreeing about?

 

[Nishant]

No, it doesn't. Sehwag was good in Tests while being rubbish in ODI. Tendulkar does better now in ODI than tests.




I wouldnt say that....sehwag is not performing in ODIs and so will not do well in the test arena. When sehwag did well in pakistan in the test series in 2004...he also did well in the ODIs because he transferred that form into the ODIs. Harmison was a good bowler in tests.....he mucks up in the one days and look whats happened to him now!!

Are u telling me a person who gets 5 scores of less than 10 in ODIs will go on to get 5 scores of above 50 in the test matches? A bowler that is wicketless for a whole one day series will go on to get 10 wicket hauls? That is not possible!