• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

*Official* Group B Discussion - South Africa, Sri Lanka, New Zealand, England

B

Blakey

State Vice-Captain
Butler consistently the fastest bowler today. Getting great bounce also. Maybe losing those kg's has streamlined the big man.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

Request Your Custom Title Now!
mean while, Elliott bowling like a drunk ....and on cue, rubbish ball to get a wicket that ..top catch Taylor
 
Scaly piscine

Scaly piscine

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
I'm all for pitches with something in them for the bowler, but this one is just random. It's making garbage bowlers into wicket-takers.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Scaly piscine said:
I'm all for pitches with something in them for the bowler, but this one is just random. It's making garbage bowlers into wicket-takers.
Click to expand...
Agree with that, Elliott's spell so far is a good example. Between the wickets balls, he's looked like a 2nd XI club bowler.
 
Uppercut

Uppercut

Request Your Custom Title Now!
zinzan12 said:
I've no problem with criticism & tbh it's not really your criticism of him as a batsman that bothers me, it's the suggestion that he's 'miles' away from being our best limited-over batsman. Not sure what your definition of 'miles' is, but if Ryder is a better batsman as you've suggested (I'd personally have Taylor slightly ahead), its by a smidgen.

Furthermore, your filtering of stats is all good & well, as long you realize & acknowledge pretty much every International batsman that's been around the traps has a inferior record when you remove Bangladesh & other minnows. On that, I reckon you're a tad tough on the Deshies to tag them 'minnow's' based on their improvement in ODI's the last 2 years - particularly at home where Taylor got a 100 against them last year in a series we almost lost when Shakib was wheeling magic on those dry dust-beds.

I definately concede he has his flaws such as his 'hit everything leg-side' mindset, but is that much different than McCullum's premeditated charging down the track every 3rd ball, Guptill's compulsive hooking or Ryder's inability to adjust to a seaming deck? It's not like we have a Tendulkar or a Ponting in the side to compare him with.
Click to expand...
Hurricane said:
I rate Taylor as our best followed by Ryder. At one point you could have listed McCullum as one of our best ODI batsman but Moles has counselled him out of being an attacking batsman.

I think you are right that the reason why he is a star for us is that the rest of the batsman are inconsistent. Taylor is our money player. I don't think though that we ever say he is an international super star or anything or that he would walk into any team around the world. I think he might struggle to make some of the line ups for some of the other countries.

By the way if Paul Collingwood wants to come and play for NZ he would be most welcome he would be a valuable contributor for us.
Click to expand...
straw man said:
Haha, yes NZ fans can be a little touchy of criticism of our players. Well, unless you want to criticise Hopkins or Diamanti... then go ahead ;-) (though as has been mentioned it's the selectors at fault - not the players).

Think I remember you saying something similar during the SL test series and I found that Taylor had scored runs against most of the best teams and therefore compared favourably to someone like Ian Bell. Looked at his ODI record but it is less impressive, with more runs against lesser teams and fewer against top teams. You do have a point.

Would contend that Taylor has improved though. Not as much as you could hope for, as shown by his innings against SA where he didn't play his go-to slog sweep and therefore struggled to score. But seems to be a slightly more consistent batsman these days and more mature. He would never have played an innings like the one he did against South Africa a few years ago, which says some good things as well as bad things.

As for the question, who is NZ's best one day bat? I don't think Ryder (600 runs), Guptill (500 runs) or Elliott (500 runs) can be considered as they haven't been around long enough. I like all of them but they won't have been through the ups and downs of form etc that Taylor has; he has nearly 2000 runs. Therefore it's down to him or McCullum as best bat and Taylor wins hands down.
Click to expand...
I'm surprised that so many people in New Zealand rate Taylor ahead of Ryder. Taylor's been around for longer, but that doesn't count for anything- Ryder always looks more likely to score for me (and his current ODI average, albeit on limited evidence, is indeed better than Taylor's against test sides) but more importantly he scores quite significantly faster and doesn't struggle to rotate the strike the way Taylor does. Although that may be to do with their respective roles, because Ryder invariably has 15 overs at the crease before he has to try rotating the strike whereas Taylor has to come in and rotate from ball one when he's really more of a boundary hitter.

Ryder's been much more impressive for me. Has outperformed Taylor in the tests they've played together too if I'm not mistaken. I don't think we need to wait til he's got a standard number of games under his belt before saying he's a quality player.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Top