*Official* First Test at the Gabba

[Woodster]

It's not really losing a bowler though, because spin shouldn't play a major role anyway. So it's essentially just gaining a batsman, given that Watson can make up the 4th seamer. I think you are massively underestimating Watson as well. He bowls very well in conditions which are good for swing and seam movement (i.e. the Gabba at the moment). I'd go as far as to say he is probably the best bowler out of those 4 quicks in those conditions.

Good spinners will always play a part, regardless of what the Gabba pitch will look like, I cannot imagine England going in without Swann, so you'd be playing a couple of average spinners when you could include a quick bowler who will suit the conditions.

I probably am being a touch harsh on Watson, and like against Pakistan, he can be useful when conditions suit. Surely he's not as effective as the actual bowlers though ? Hilfenhaus especially.

 

[GotSpin]

Yeah, they may as well not have replaced Mervyn.

Just been banging my head against the table because of this squad. So terrible.

If dougeh gets replaced by Siddle it's the last straw really.

 

[Spikey]

If dougeh gets replaced by Siddle it's the last straw really.

Oh it's bound to happen. Everyone in the set-up ****ing loves Siddle. Those ODers he got and getting rested for Victoria are danger signs. It's gonna happen. Everyone should get themselves into the frame of mind that Siddle is playing so when it happens we don't all break our computers and TV screens.

 

[Ruckus]

Good spinners will always play a part, regardless of what the Gabba pitch will look like, I cannot imagine England going in without Swann, so you'd be playing a couple of average spinners when you could include a quick bowler who will suit the conditions.

I probably am being a touch harsh on Watson, and like against Pakistan, he can be useful when conditions suit. Surely he's not as effective as the actual bowlers though ? Hilfenhaus especially.

No, believe it or not, Watson is as effective as the other bowlers. And, not suprisingly, he has a better FC bowling average than Bollinger, Johnson and Hilfenhaus. His bowling is much improved since he dropped his pace and focussed on the more intricate skills.

I agree that spinners will play a part, but I disagree that including Smith is losing a bowler. It would be losing a bowler if Doherty was as intergral to the teams success as Swann is to England, but he simply isn't.

 

[Woodster]

No, believe it or not, Watson is as effective as the other bowlers. And, not suprisingly, he has a better FC bowling average than Bollinger, Johnson and Hilfenhaus. His bowling is much improved since he dropped his pace and focussed on the more intricate skills.

I agree that spinners will play a part, but I disagree that including Smith is losing a bowler. It would be losing a bowler if Doherty was as intergral to the teams success as Swann is to England, but he simply isn't.

Stats can at times be deceptive, but you make a compelling case, we'll have to see how his role develops as the series progresses.

If Smith is only going to be used sparingly, as you suggested he should, then effectively you are giving the number 8 slot to a guy that, imo, is not a good enough batsman at this stage, who might get a few overs with the ball. Get a proper bowler in there, one to share the workload.

 

[Son Of Coco]

Just get home to read that Xavier Doherty, according to the Courier Mail, is set to be selected when the squad is pruned today. My God, if we're going to go for an unproven left arm tweaker, let's go for O'Keefe who at least has a good FC average, is just 24 years of age, and has just taken four wickets in a tidy innings display against the English Test batting lineup. By contrast, Doherty has been floating around the scene for years, and has an average of 48. Some of our decision making just leaves me stunned.

It's almost like the selectors have forgotten that a number of the guys who went on to be mainstays of the team (and in many cases, great players) in the past, were picked after not many FC matches, but had put in good performances at that level.

They're have a bet each way with guys who have been around for ages and put in a decent performance or two, instead of picking some real up and coming talent. These days, a guy has to prove himself for a few year before getting a crack. Seems to be a flow on from when we actually had a great team.

 

[NUFAN]

I realise he has a decent first class average, but he's only played around 17 first-class games. Although I thought his bowling average was closer to 50 than his batting in first-class cricket ?

I'm just not much of a fan of his mate, I'm sure you guys have seen much more of him, but what I've seen is not good enough for an Australian Test player, but maybe that's a reflection of your choices these days.

His technique with the bat (I know tech isn't everything) looks pretty shoddy, strikes a clean ball, I'll give him that. As you say he does make runs, so he's obviously doing something right.

His bowling needs a lot of work aswell, he may become a decent player, but can't think he'll develop quick enough to play a serious part in this series.

I agree with this exactly. IMO Smith is quickly becoming one of the most overrated cricketers. Yes he's young, but it's too early for him at the moment.

If everyone available for Australia was fit, Smith would be pushing (but not making) my Australia A team.

I tend to agree O'Keefe > Doherty, but I think Doherty will do a decent job. He's definitely a Cricketer who gets himself in the game and I doubt he'll be a disaster. Also on the plus, it gives Jason Krejza more of a chance to shine for Tassie, hopefully NSW selectors can find room for O'Keefe too.

Also regarding the 3 quicks it appears that most people are thinking it's a race between Bollinger and Siddle. I actually question why Hilfenhaus is seen as an automatic selection in front of Siddle.

They both average 31 and even though Hilfenhaus is seen as the more tighter option, Siddle has the better economy rate. I think they are very similar in ability and so far this Shield Season, Siddle has out performed Hilfenhaus.

 

[Son Of Coco]

Can you be more specific?

 

[treamcast34]

The smooth buildup is starting to have me a little spooked, lol. It can't all go this well can it?

 

[Tom 1972]

C'mon mate, he averages 50 with the bat in FC cricket.

Hope they don't make the same mistake with him that they made with Watson - ie. just because he can bowl, they think his batting is not up to scratch and therefore bat him below the keeper.

Crazy stuff.

44.8 is not 50....

That being said, he's 21 and will wind up playing 100 tests for Australia me thinks. I mean he IS from NSW.

 

[Ruckus]

Stats can at times be deceptive, but you make a compelling case, we'll have to see how his role develops as the series progresses.

If Smith is only going to be used sparingly, as you suggested he should, then effectively you are giving the number 8 slot to a guy that, imo, is not a good enough batsman at this stage, who might get a few overs with the ball. Get a proper bowler in there, one to share the workload.

Well tbh I think Smith could bat at no.6 if required, he is actually overqualified to bat at no. 8. All of this discussion though is pretty pointless really, because, firstly, I wouldn't even have chosen a squad anything like this to begin with, and secondly, I'm almost certain the selectors won't be playing Smith instead of Doherty. Given the current squad though, I still think that batting Smith at 8 would be more of a benefit to Australia than a disadvantage.

 

[NUFAN]

No way could Smith bat at 6 and it be considered a smart selection. He bats behind Tim Paine so he'll bat behind Brad Haddin for sure.

Both teams will end up with:

6 batsman
1 keeper
3 quicks
1 spinner

Hopefully Johnson is back in form with the bat, because Hauritz is a better bat over Doherty.

 

[GIMH]

Only question for us now is Tremlett or Finn?

Imagine Finn will get the nod but we shall see.

 

[Ruckus]

No way could Smith bat at 6 and it be considered a smart selection. He bats behind Tim Paine so he'll bat behind Brad Haddin for sure.

When you consider the alternative is Marcus North, I don't think the idea is particularly dumb...

 

[BoyBrumby]

Ward was saying in the Sky studio that's it's being reported that Hilditch asked Ponting if he wanted Hauritz or Doherty and the skipper went for his Tassie mate. Interesting if true.

Batsman's game, innit? North & Hussey get infinite patience and two ropey tests for Doogie gets his plug pulled.

 

[Spikey]

hauritz really should have joined the boys club

 

[Jacknife]

Only question for us now is Tremlett or Finn?

Imagine Finn will get the nod but we shall see.

Personally I'd go with Tremlett, at this stage in his career , he offers a bit more than Finn. As we've seen today, he keeps it real tight and has got the ball reversing at good pace.

 

[NUFAN]

When you consider the alternative is Marcus North, I don't think the idea is particularly dumb...

I'm not a huge North fan but he's proven himself to be capable of making hundreds and that is what is required from a top 6 bat.

There is no way that Smith would be trusted batting ahead of Haddin, so he would bat 7 at the earliest.

If we need 2 spinners and Smith is one of the best two (I doubt he is, but who cares) he would bat at 7.

 

[GIMH]

Only question for us now is Tremlett or Finn?

Imagine Finn will get the nod but we shall see.

 

[Ruckus]

Only question for us now is Tremlett or Finn?

Imagine Finn will get the nod but we shall see.

Talent-wise, Tremlett>Finn. Selection-wise, Finn>Tremlett.

O'Keefe averages 56 with the bat haha, WAG.