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*Official* English Football Season 2015-16

Uppercut

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I imagine Wenger's logic was that if they were to have any chance of going through they would have to at least get a few goals in the home leg. 0-0 at home wouldn't have been a disaster, but it would have meant the chances going through overall would have been basically nil. Possibly thought it would be better to go down swinging. May as well have a go etc...
I don't get why Arsenal's chances of getting a score draw at the Nou Camp would be "basically nil". Deportivo did it just a couple of months ago, and Arsenal are arguably better away in Europe than they are at home.

Among fans there's been a sort of defeatist attitude towards the tie, and it makes sense as a kind of defence mechanism, but you would hope the players+manager weren't treating it this way.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
I think that's 32 games straight now Barca are unbeaten - best record in club's history. Nuts.
 

cpr

International Coach
Didn't watch the match but TBH surprised it was only 0-2. This is the best team of all time IMO, better than Pep's, because of the front 3 and the crazy ability they have to score. They'd be deserving to be the first team to win back-to-back CL titles.

Sorry, but this sort of thing irks me, the CL has been going since before 1994, there have been plenty of teams to win it back to back....
 

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
The Jordi Alba/Giroud thing from last night's game is a good example of the sort of thing that bothers me a lot more than diving does. Feigning off the ball contact to the head and playing for a red that way.
Also, what are the odds that if it was Giroud who'd stuck his head in like that afterwards there'd have been a red somewhere?
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
Sorry, but this sort of thing irks me, the CL has been going since before 1994, there have been plenty of teams to win it back to back....
Technically, the European cup but I get what you mean. Still, 24 (think it started in 1992) years with no back-to-back winner is a heck of a streak to break.

EDIT: actually, no back-to-back winner since 1990 so 26 years.
 
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sledger

Spanish_Vicente
I don't get why Arsenal's chances of getting a score draw at the Nou Camp would be "basically nil". Deportivo did it just a couple of months ago, and Arsenal are arguably better away in Europe than they are at home.

Among fans there's been a sort of defeatist attitude towards the tie, and it makes sense as a kind of defence mechanism, but you would hope the players+manager weren't treating it this way.
I was just being hyperbolic. Their chances would have been better than basically nil, but all things considered, I would have rated their chances of progression in those circumstances to be extremely slim.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
Wound up watching yer scousers by default on TV tonight and it's been a decent match. Can't remember the last time I watched the Europa league before this
 

Furball

Evil Scotsman
Sorry, but this sort of thing irks me, the CL has been going since before 1994, there have been plenty of teams to win it back to back....
The CL only came into existence in 1993.

Ikki is correct in saying no team has won back to back titles.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
Random thought. But if Liverpool or Man U win the Europa League and Chelsea the Champions League, then 4th in the prem (assuming none of those three somehow grab that spot in the league) won't qualify for the CL. :ph34r:
 

cpr

International Coach
The CL only came into existence in 1993.

Ikki is correct in saying no team has won back to back titles.

And the Premier League only came into existence in 1992, but there were English champions before that who's records and achievements still stand. It'll be like saying Man Utd are the only team to have won the league 3 times in succession. What Ikki said is technically correct, but just ignores so much football history.
 

Tom Halsey

International Coach
And the Premier League only came into existence in 1992, but there were English champions before that who's records and achievements still stand. It'll be like saying Man Utd are the only team to have won the league 3 times in succession. What Ikki said is technically correct, but just ignores so much football history.
Yeah but the CL is actually formatted in a totally different way now to the point where it pretty much may as well be a different competition, as opposed to the league which is the same. Certainly the CL is far harder to win now, and therefore retain, than it was in the one-team-per-country days (I realise this changed slightly after it became the CL, but).
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
Yeah but the CL is actually formatted in a totally different way now to the point where it pretty much may as well be a different competition, as opposed to the league which is the same. Certainly the CL is far harder to win now, and therefore retain, than it was in the one-team-per-country days (I realise this changed slightly after it became the CL, but).
Two points to this.

Understand the point you are making, however, the league is actually a different competition under a different board. The CL is the same competition renamed. Still carries the same trophy.

Secondly, not certain it's harder to win. Have heard arguments from both sides over the years. Obviously you play more games in it now, but on the other hand the knockout pressure was there from the start back in the day. Probably an interesting topic to be fair. I would probably agree with you if push came to shove but don't think it's an open shut case.
 

Uppercut

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It was definitely much easier to retain, because it meant you qualified the next season. Pre-1999 much of the challenge was qualifying for it in the first place. Once you were in it was obviously far easier. A fraction of the teams to compete against.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
It was definitely much easier to retain, because it meant you qualified the next season. Pre-1999 much of the challenge was qualifying for it in the first place. Once you were in it was obviously far easier. A fraction of the teams to compete against.
Sorry but not having that logic under any circumstances given they've never gone ahead without the holders. The only time where the rules stated it should happen they caved and let Liverpool back in, thereafter changing the rules. And this is ignoring the fact it's been easier for sides from the countries where the winners tend to come from to qualify since they changed it up.

Unless I've completely misread you, I mean my next point will tell you if I have...

My old man was a big advocate of 'Champions only' for a long time, but at the same time when I was a kid would tell me that sometimes he felt the UEFA Cup was the harder trophy to win, because the champions of any given nation could go to pot the following season (e.g. Leeds in 92) whereas with 3 or 4 teams that were the next best, there's a good chance of coming up against the best sides in Europe in that competition.

I don't think he was going as far to say it was the harder to win, but there was logic there. And now the Champions League has that same logic, e.g. 2013 you had prank English champions under Moyes, but City/Chelsea/Arsenal were all still good sides (though probably not in Europe that season, so bad example, but you see my point).

Ultimately I just think it's one of them. Going to Eastern Europe and knowing a bad night could send you out of the competition in October carries a lot more pressure than being able to absorb a loss because you have five more group games, but the higher volume of good sides probably does swing it in favour of Halsey's argument. I just don't think it's cut and dry.
 

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
Kind of weird to think Barca in 2011 are the last winners who would have actually qualified for the competition the previous season, under the "Champions only" rule. Pretty sure they or Bayern would've retained it at least once if there wasn't a Madrid and only one English side etc.
 

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