***Official*** English Domestic Season 2014

[grecian]

I mentioned it and was told it was a stupid idea. The fact is we have no real test class option outside a firing Panesar and there has to be doubts as to whether he will be the bowler he once was.

Well if he bowls like this it's not a stupid idea, but he clearly hasn't been bowling like this for awhile.

Very promising today though, maybe he's improved over the winter. Not many opportunities earlier in the season to prove that I guess.

Yet picking people on one performance on Sky not really a thing we should go back too, IMHO.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

I am not saying he is going to come in and take 200 test wickets at 28 but if he was to take his wickets at 35 and average around the same with the bat then he could be a more than useful stopgap until we find a real spinner of test class.

I also think he is more likely to do it than Moeen Ali.

 

[91Jmay]

His batting has been very consistent for a while, which should always be the primary look for a 7 anyway.

Patel cleans up the tail. What a great win with such a depleted side, Woakes back in for Ollie H-D, Clarke/Troughton/Porterfield to come back as well in and all of a sudden I like our chances a bit more of competing this year.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

It looks a good season as no side looks that good and all are in and out so far. Could be a very exciting season.

 

[Howe_zat]

It is definitely a stupid idea.

 

[Howe_zat]

An eye to be kept on Chelmsford. Could well be a tight chase set up.

 

[grecian]

It is definitely a stupid idea.

Well the arguments remain the same despite today, he goes for too many runs, even though it's nice he's ripping a few. Just will get knocked out of the attack immediately with the Lankans or Indians.

TBH though, I've pretty much changed my mind, Kegga, Panesar have put in decent starts to the season. With Stokes still not fit, you can't really expect him to bowl a lot. So I've come round to playing a specialist. Weather's okay as well, so the pitches may well be decent for spin.

 

[Pothas]

We probably should just play Monty.

I just really want Moeen to play a test and will come up with any justification for doing so.

 

[grecian]

We probably should just play Monty.

I just really want Moeen to play a test and will come up with any justification for doing so.

Yeah, in the end 167 Test wickets really should make it a no-brainer.

Oh and a 15y-o scored a 50 for Northants today, is it First-Class?

 

[Prince EWS]

I think the reason I'm so pro-Moeen is because I just don't really have that much faith in Stokes's batting yet, and the balance of the side isn't really my cup of tea, especially with Prior injured/not selected/desperately out of form/re-establishing himself (take your pick). Stokes has absolutely earned his spot over the winter and has to play now if he's fit; I can't justify leaving him out so I balance the side around the idea that he to be selected and then work other players in to cover for the fact that I don't think he'll make enough runs. Hand on heart, picking an eleven that I think would actually perform best, I don't think I'd have either Stokes or Moeen in it tbh.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Think they have all but ruled Stokes out of the first test and possibly the second as well judging by the way they have spoken this week. I wouldn't pick Moeen, don't think he is good enough. Happy enough if Monty is selected as it means he may well be in form but think it will be Kerrigan.

 

[91Jmay]

It is definitely a stupid idea.

Quality posting. Really enhancing the debate.

Rashid at 7 is not a stupid idea. He has enough about him with the bat to play there, and would be an ok 5th option for two early season Test matches in England. Long term Stokes back in at 7 (which is were he should be batting anyway) and an in form Prior at 6.

 

[Dan]

Quality posting. Really enhancing the debate.

Rashid at 7 is not a stupid idea. He has enough about him with the bat to play there, and would be an ok 5th option for two early season Test matches in England. Long term Stokes back in at 7 (which is were he should be batting anyway) and an in form Prior at 6.

But his bowling is going to be thoroughly ineffective on early season pitches against good players of spin. Moeen would be no worse; heck, even Joe Root would be about as effective at taking wickets -- and they're significantly better batsmen.

Maybe Rashid is a fractionally better bowler than Moeen (and that's arguable), but that difference is negligible when both will be crap on unhelpful decks against batsmen used to facing good spin on turning tracks. Pick the best batsman who bowls some off-spin and you get equally-useful bowling performances. I mean, a dart merchant who keeps it tight would be more use in these conditions than a batting all-rounder masquerading as an attacking spinner.

It's a stupid idea; he literally adds nothing to the side that a better batsman who bowls some jammy off-spin (aka Moeen) couldn't offer.

As a side note, Marcus North would be perfect for England right now if he were qualified

 

[Dan]

Well, if these university matches count as FC, Lewis McManus has dual tons on debut. Not bad at age 19.

Also, Middlesex - literally nothing in their batting past Rogers/Robson, is there? I mean, Dawid Malan should be gun but really isn't, Eoin Morgan is a hack in long-form cricket, and Denly/Dexter are past their best. Seriously, Malan needs to move to Somerset and follow the career path of Nick Compton. I really don't understand why he's so, so mediocre.

 

[hendrix]

You're breaking my heart, Jeets.

 

[Jarquis]

There's no way that either Denly or Dexter are past their best, they're just very average batsmen - as are the vast majority of the Middlesex side. It's a bit of a joke to say they've got absolutely no batting besides the openers. I mean, they just lost by an innings but that was to a side with Ian Westwood, Sam Hain, Ateeq Javid and Keith Barker in its top 7. They're hardly domestic run machines are they ffs.

All of the players Dan has signled out would walk into the Essex side this week, for example, as well as a number of other counties. **** post tbh.

 

[Dan]

Suggesting Middlesex don't have much batting past their openers isn't suggesting that other teams have more than two quality bats

They just have this alarming tendency this season to collapse in a heap once Robson/Rogers get out. Even in the chase of 470, Rogers and Robson made over 300 of those runs.

I reckon Rossington is quite a decent prospect tbh. My criticism is more a case of "why are these guys seen as County Championship favourites when they'll probably lose one of their two performing batsmen to England duty, and the rest of their bats don't seem to step up very often."

Warwickshire bat deep but bat mediocre; so, so reliant upon the all-rounders (Woakes, Barker and, seemingly, Jeets + the rest of the tail) to get them to competitive totals; Javid is a decent prospect and Evans might be proving himself to be decent quality, but there really isn't much there either. On name alone, there's no way Middlesex should be going down by an innings to them; the batsmen, Rogers/Robson aside, have underperformed.

I don't understand the point you're making though - you're saying that Denly and Dexter are "very average" along with the rest of the side - which is basically the exact same thing I'm saying!

 

[King Pietersen]

I miss the good Joe Denly. Used to be a real prospect, but fell away massively after he dropped out of the England side. Him and Key opening up for Kent in the OD and T20 stuff were so good to watch back in the day.

 

[Prince EWS]

As a side note, Marcus North would be perfect for England right now if he were qualified

Moeen is an extremely similar player. If anything I think I'd rate him marginally ahead of North with bat and ball.

I honestly think people under-rate Moeen's offies a little bit on account of a) being fooled by his overall record and b) not watching him bowl much lately.

He's bowled much more, been much more successful and visibly looked a much better bowler over the last couple of seasons. He's not the best spinner in England on bowling alone but I'd definitely have him in the top five. He's a genuine attacking spin bowler these days.

 

[grecian]

Moeen is an extremely similar player. If anything I think I'd rate him marginally ahead of North with bat and ball.

I honestly think people under-rate Moeen's offies a little bit on account of a) being fooled by his overall record and b) not watching him bowl much lately.

He's bowled much more, been much more successful and visibly looked a much better bowler over the last couple of seasons. He's not the best spinner in England on bowling alone but I'd definitely have him in the top five. He's a genuine attacking spin bowler these days.

Yeah, this totally, if he plays it's not as an occasional spinner, it's because they believe he's one of the best spin options in the country.

Personally I find it impossible to properly judge, seen some good things in one-day cricket, but it's not really telling me how well he's bowling in first-class, and his wickets are coming in the second division. Yet he does seem to rip it, have variations, and be fairly accurate. I guess he'll probably bowl his full quota in the ODI series, which might give us a better idea.

BTW, Daryl Mitchell's form for Worcs has been pretty great this year. Wonder how far he is from being considered.