***Official*** English Domestic Season 2008

[Richard]

De-motivated? I simply cannot believe that. Sure, he might have got it into his head that he was at the end of 2007, but I refuse to believe that someone who has battled so hard to overcome other injuries in the past, and these latest bouts as well, would simply lose motivation - and then regain it by a simple measure such as a change of county.

Just makes no sense.

 

[GIMH]

Maybe demotivated wasn't the right word, but he sure as hell wasn't happy at Glamorgan - long before the international acclaim - and the change has done him the world of good. I'm not making this up, I've read it in a few interviews with him.

 

[Richard]

As I say, he may have got this into his head - but I simply refuse to believe the reason he could not attain and maintain fitness was down to not trying hard enough.

 

[GIMH]

No, but I don't think that is what he's saying. He's saying he never felt happy or welcomed at Glamorgan and that this affected his performance there; he only played 57 FC games for them apparently. He hasn't attributed his injuries to not trying hard enough, nor his poor fitness, he is a professional. But he said the fact that he's bowled so well as well as staying fit is down to the move, Glamorgan had gone stale for him.

 

[Richard]

Thing is, though, he's a proud Welshman and many times during his career (not just during his international days) said he was happy playing for Glamorgan, loved the club, wanted to spend the rest of his career there, etc.

I think, in that last season, he might have got something of a siege mentality. Felt that everything was stacked against him - had loads and loads of bad memories. So he tried a move.

And sure enough, things started to go right as soon as the move happened. I think it was more a case of his bad luck running-out, as it surely had to eventually (for the time being at least - won't be presumptious enough to presume it won't return, maybe soon). That just happened to happen after he'd moved counties, for my money.

"Going stale" is a nice way out people like to use sometimes for my money, to create the illusion of "freshness" when it's not really there. Sometimes, by playing mind-games with yourself, you can make things better.

But as I say - I don't feel that's happened in this case. It's simply coincidence - his bad luck had to end eventually, and it ended when he changed counties.

 

[open365]

I recently read an interview from Jones in The Wisden Cricketer (IIRC) and he stated that he is feeling very fit.

I don't think there's been a sportsman recovering from injury that hasn't said that when given the chance to in the history of sport.

 

[wpdavid]

(re Jones)

I hope, if he's going to come back, it'll happen before that.

Honestly, I wouldn't rule-out the possibility of him playing at some point in the upcoming four-Test series against SA. I still reckon it's less likely than more

I'm increasingly of the view that he's more likely than Flintoff to play against SA.

btw what do folks make of Kabir Ali's performances this year?

 

[superkingdave]

Jones in for Anderson is something i can definitely see happening in the second test.

Would suggest Flintoff in for Broad for 3rd/4th if his recovery goes to plan.

If we ended up with Flintoff/Jones/Sidebottom/Panesar come the end of the series it would be our best bowling attack for a very long time.

 

[Richard]

btw what do folks make of Kabir Ali's performances this year?

I'd imagine he'll be the same as ever. He's had seasons (or half-seasons so far, rather) like this before.

There's still bowlers I'd prefer not see at Test level than him, but I remain far from convinced he'll be Test-class.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

I'd imagine he'll be the same as ever. He's had seasons (or half-seasons so far, rather) like this before.

There's still bowlers I'd prefer not see at Test level than him, but I remain far from convinced he'll be Test-class.

Not sure there can be that many seamers in England ahead of him though...

Sidebottom
Hoggard
Tremlett
Anderson I guess
Jones if fit
Flintoff if fit
Lewis?

 

[Richard]

Reckon he'd be ahead of Lewis right now TBH. Though I also wouldn't rule-out Vaughan wanting Lewis ahead of Kabir as it was hardly a secret he didn't think much of him in that only Test, and he's never captained Lewis.

Still, that's a fair crop who'd have to go down (or in Anderson's case just go crap again) for an opening to arise.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

Though I also wouldn't rule-out Vaughan wanting Lewis ahead of Kabir as it was hardly a secret he didn't think much of him in that only Test, and he's never captained Lewis.

Wanted your opinion and not real life tbh. If I was talking about the England selectors, I'd probably add Harmison, Broad, Onions, Shreck and Chris Jordan.

 

[wpdavid]

Wanted your opinion and not real life tbh. If I was talking about the England selectors, I'd probably add Harmison, Broad, Onions, Shreck and Chris Jordan.

I think you've overstated Jordan's position at this stage of his career.

I suppose I'd see the current situation as

1. The three currently in possession plus Flintoff & Jones if they're deemed test-match fit.
2. Tremlett, Hoggard & Harmison depending on form if a vacancy occurs and what type of vacancy
3. Others such as Kabir, Shreck & Onions if enough of the above were injured or out of sorts

Actually, that looks better than it has for a while.

 

[Magrat Garlick]

I think you've overstated Jordan's position at this stage of his career.

Possibly. Though England selectors' capability to pick talented allrounders early seems to be difficult to understate.

I suppose I'd see the current situation as

1. The three currently in possession plus Flintoff & Jones if they're deemed test-match fit.
2. Tremlett, Hoggard & Harmison depending on form if a vacancy occurs and what type of vacancy
3. Others such as Kabir, Shreck & Onions if enough of the above were injured or out of sorts

Actually, that looks better than it has for a while.

It looks better because you haven't listed the names of the three in possession

 

[wpdavid]

Reckon he'd be ahead of Lewis right now TBH. Though I also wouldn't rule-out Vaughan wanting Lewis ahead of Kabir as it was hardly a secret he didn't think much of him in that only Test ...

Always thought that Kabir copped a bit more flack than he deserved for that one. He was hardly the only he send down a load of pies (in between taking 5 wickets @27), but everyone else was forgiven. And it was 5 years ago now.

Was there something beyond what we saw on TV that annoyed Vaughan?

 

[wpdavid]

It looks better because you haven't listed the names of the three in possession

It also looks better because Fred & Jones are included.

Going back to the WI series last year, we were almost struggling to name an attack though. At that stage everyone had forgotten about Sidebottom, about half of the people on my list were injured (from memory Hoggard, Fred, Jones, Tremlett & Anderson), Harmison could barely hit the cut strip, Onions wasn't in the Durham side, Kabir wasn't doing much and Broad was in the middle of his GCSE's. Some folks were seriously touting 17 year old James Harris as next in line if we had another injury.

I feel we have moved on from that particular point.

 

[Perm]

Ryan ten Doeschate turning in a match-winning performance by Essex. 173 runs for once dismissed and 4/62. WAG.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Apparently James Foster was standing up to him and took an exceptional catch.

ten Doeschate man of the match, for sure.

 

[Manee]

Van Jaarsveld has truly completed one of the greatest performances by a single player in a match. 114 in the first innings where noone else scored over 26 followed by 5/33 of top and middle order batsmen and now 115* to take Kent home.

 

[open365]

Is Lancashire don't win this game my head is going to explode