No. 6 for Post Packer XI

[Athlai]

Pray tell how that is relevant? The ignorance of putting Ponting as a 15-30 would take some effort to match. That would be like saying Tendulkar is 15-30 batsman. Or Viv Richards is a 20-30 batsman.

Yes, you may find SOME people who say one is better than the other, but you won't find many people saying all Dravid+Kallis+Yousef+Barrington+etc, are better than Tendulkar.

Did I put Kallis and Yousuf on that list?

And its relevant in pretty much everything you say, you fight tooth and nail for any Aussie player, and support their opposition only when they are well and truly ahead of their Australian counterpart.

 

[Ikki]

Did I put Kallis and Yousuf on that list?

And its relevant in pretty much everything you say, you fight tooth and nail for any Aussie player, and support their opposition only when they are well and truly ahead of their Australian counterpart.

Whether I support an Australian should be irrelevant. What you should care for is what I argue and the logic behind it. I am not going to say x is better than y just to appease those here who like to play to other nationalities.

Is Kallis Australian? I often argue for him being level with Sobers. Is Sehwag Australian? I remember getting into many arguments about him vs. Merchant. Is Richards Australian? I consider him my favourite batsman. So, I am not going to stoop to that level just to prove a point to you.

I also clarified on my post more if you would like to reread:

Pray tell how that is relevant? The ignorance of putting Ponting as a 15-30 would take some effort to match. That would be like saying Tendulkar is 15-30 batsman. Or Viv Richards is a 20-30 batsman.

Yes, you may find SOME people who say one is better than the other, but you won't find many people saying all Dravid+Kallis+Yousef+Barrington+etc, are better than Tendulkar.

Or like me mentioning McGrath, Lillee, Warne, Murali, Pollock, Donald, Ambrose, Marshall, Roberts, Holding, Lindwall, Spofforth, Davidson, Bannerman, Barnes, Hadlee, Wasim, Waqar.... are better than Imran simply because they are comparable.

What utter non sense.

 

[archie mac]

I voted Botham, for a period he was the best AR I have ever watched, he went on too long and never quite got it right against the best of the time the WI, one of the rare players in history that could change a game completly in a few overs.

If this team gets in trouble then Both at his peak would be the man that saves them

 

[weldone]

Many consider Dravid better than Tendulkar.

Give me example of three persons please who consider Dravid better than tendulkar...Not those who used to do so once, but those who still do...And I assume by 'many' you mean more than 3...

 

[archie mac]

Haha, Gavaskar better than Ponting? Barrington better than Ponting? Dravid better than Ponting? Grace? Why not Trumper too?

Only 1 name above has a legitimate claim to being simply better, a few more names are about equal, the rest are inferior.

If you meant to be funny, you succeeded. If you didn't, pardon the patronising, but you need to learn a tad more about the history of cricket.

Grace has a claim to be better then even Bradman in my book

 

[0RI0N]

Better than Ponting:

Bradman
Hobbs
Hutton
Tendulkar
Hammond
Sobers
Lara
Gavaskar
Barrington
Chappell (10)
Richards
Weekes
Grace
Sutcliffe
Dravid
Barrington


To be fair to you hard to keep Ponting out from now, 15-30 then.

ponting 2nd best Oz since bradman.you just cant compare your mere opinion to facts.i can see from your long list of players listed,you know deep down ponting is v good,but cannot admit it out aloud.ah denial...btw dravid > ponting.now i know you smoking agarkars socks.

 

[weldone]

Considering that the team has an absolutely superb bowling line-up (must be better than a pre-Packer XI) and a great batting line-up (must be worse than a pre-Packer XI), I feel there is a need of a batting all-rounder...But if that means dropping Imran out of the XI then I shall hesitate not only for his bowling (or batting) but also for his captaincy...

I feel the two main contenders are Kallis and Imran, and I simply can't decide at this moment...Imran is the better player overall (specially after considering the captaincy), but Kallis is more suited for the balance of the team (especially if we are playing against a pre-Packer XI)...

So, I don't really know whom to vote...

In the end, voting for Imran purely keeping the captaincy aspect in mind...

But he should bat at no. 7 after Gilchrist...

 

[Athlai]

Give me example of three persons please who consider Dravid better than tendulkar...Not those who used to do so once, but those who still do...And I assume by 'many' you mean more than 3...

Ian Bell - English cricketer
Sridhar Raman - writer

And quite a few blokes on CW. I'm not one of them, but many rate what Dravid has delivered better than Tendulkar's greater 'talent'.

If you start a Dravid vs. Tendulkar thread I'm sure you'd find more than 3 votes for Dravid.

 

[Athlai]

ponting 2nd best Oz since bradman.you just cant compare your mere opinion to facts.i can see from your long list of players listed,you know deep down ponting is v good,but cannot admit it out aloud.ah denial...btw dravid > ponting.now i know you smoking agarkars socks.

I'm not even sure what this post means.

 

[Athlai]

Whether I support an Australian should be irrelevant. What you should care for is what I argue and the logic behind it. I am not going to say x is better than y just to appease those here who like to play to other nationalities.

Is Kallis Australian? I often argue for him being level with Sobers. Is Sehwag Australian? I remember getting into many arguments about him vs. Merchant. Is Richards Australian? I consider him my favourite batsman. So, I am not going to stoop to that level just to prove a point to you.

I also clarified on my post more if you would like to reread:

Mate I'm just saying what all of CW quite firmly believes.

 

[stephen]

Well most of CW believes that Ponting is at least the forth best batsman post-Packer, at least according to the current poll.

Can anyone name ten batsmen pre-Packer who were definitively better than Ponting? If not then I'll assume he's in the top 15 batsmen of all time.

 

[Athlai]

Well most of CW believes that Ponting is at least the forth best batsman post-Packer, at least according to the current poll.

Can anyone name ten batsmen pre-Packer who were definitively better than Ponting? If not then I'll assume he's in the top 15 batsmen of all time.

He's forth best in the post-packer middle order poll TBF. And whats to say that those who voted Sachin, Lara and Richards wouldn't choose Ponting as their next pick. And the pre-packer batting line up should probably be stronger than post-packer.

I think Punter's a gun but I would never say its guaranteed that he's top 15 all-time.

 

[stephen]

He's forth best in the post-packer middle order poll TBF. And whats to say that those who voted Sachin, Lara and Richards wouldn't choose Ponting as their next pick. And the pre-packer batting line up should probably be stronger than post-packer.

I think Punter's a gun but I would never say its guaranteed that he's top 15 all-time.

I actually want someone to come up with 15 players who were definitively better than Ponting. I am even allowing for the fact that people believe that Richards, Lara and Tendulkar are all his superiors (even though that is debatable).

So that would leave (maybe):

Bradman
Hobbs
Hutton
Suttcliffe
Sobers
Grace

and ???

Even these picks IMO are arguable, but I want someone to fill out the list, otherwise I will assume that he is that good.

 

[weldone]

Ian Bell - English cricketer
Sridhar Raman - writer

And quite a few blokes on CW. I'm not one of them, but many rate what Dravid has delivered better than Tendulkar's greater 'talent'.

If you start a Dravid vs. Tendulkar thread I'm sure you'd find more than 3 votes for Dravid.

Have they said so recently? (in the last 3 months or so) If no, then no way I am going to assume that their beliefs haven't changed. (bacause of Dravid's performance in the last two years)

In fact I know many who thought Dravid > Tendulkar earlier and have now changed their mind...And I know none who haven't...

Even if Dravid gets 3 votes that won't mean 'many' feel Dravid>Tandulkar...Even if Kapil is rated against Lillee as a bowler he may get more than 3 votes...Will that indicate many consider Kapil a better bowler than Lillee? Absurd.

 

[Athlai]

I actually want someone to come up with 15 players who were definitively better than Ponting. I am even allowing for the fact that people believe that Richards, Lara and Tendulkar are all his superiors (even though that is debatable).

So that would leave (maybe):

Bradman
Hobbs
Hutton
Suttcliffe
Sobers
Grace

and ???

Even these picks IMO are arguable, but I want someone to fill out the list, otherwise I will assume that he is that good.

You have 6 there, and you are willing to put in Richards, Lara and Tendulkar. That makes 9. Hammond would make 10. Barrington 11. Weekes 12. Walcott 13.

Out of Australians who could challenge him? Chappell, S. Waugh, Border are all close too.

Dravid too could give him a run for his money.

Edit: Totally forgot about Headley and Pollock, Sid Barnes could be up there too.

 

[Athlai]

Have they said so recently? (in the last 3 months or so) If no, then no way I am going to assume that their beliefs haven't changed. (bacause of Dravid's performance in the last two years)

In fact I know many who thought Dravid > Tendulkar earlier and have now changed their mind...And I know none who haven't...

Even if Dravid gets 3 votes that won't mean 'many' feel Dravid>Tandulkar...Even if Kapil is rated against Lillee as a bowler he may get more than 3 votes...Will that indicate many consider Kapil a better bowler than Lillee? Absurd.

Bell said it last year.

Mate I don't think Dravid is better than Tendulkar, I'm just acknowledging that I've heard people say it, how can you argue with someone that agrees with you?

 

[weldone]

Bell said it last year.

Mate I don't think Dravid is better than Tendulkar, I'm just acknowledging that I've heard people say it, how can you argue with someone that agrees with you?

No, I'm not arguing with you...I just doubt anyone can say such a thing very recently...Yes, if that remark came in the earlier part of the last year, that's still possible...

 

[Ikki]

You have 6 there, and you are willing to put in Richards, Lara and Tendulkar. That makes 9. Hammond would make 10. Barrington 11. Weekes 12. Walcott 13.

Out of Australians who could challenge him? Chappell, S. Waugh, Border are all close too.

Dravid too could give him a run for his money.

Edit: Totally forgot about Headley and Pollock, Sid Barnes could be up there too.

Better than/Challenge Hadlee:

McGrath, Lillee, Warne, Murali, Pollock, Donald, Ambrose, Marshall, Roberts, Holding, Lindwall, Spofforth, Davidson, Bannerman, Barnes, Trueman, Imran, Wasim, Waqar, Bond....

So, by your logic, Hadlee is like 20-30th.

 

[Athlai]

No, I'm not arguing with you...I just doubt anyone can say such a thing very recently...Yes, if that remark came in the earlier part of the last year, that's still possible...

I'm sure a few will still be waving the Dravid flag regardless of his recent poor performances.

 

[Evermind]

WHy are people choosing Imran? If Gilchrist bats at 7, there're still 4 positions for bowlers, including a bowling all-rounder.

You have this team so far:

1) Hayden
2) Gavaskar
3) Ponting/Richards/Chappell
4) Tendulkar
5) Lara

7) Gilchrist

9) Murali/Warne
10) Marshall
11) McGrath

Imran could easily go into slot #8. That'd be perfect - a batting all-rounder (Kallis) at 6, and a bowling all-rounder (Imran) at 8, with 2 strike bowlers and a spinner. #6 is WAY too high for Imran - that means you have only 5 specialist batsmen in your team?!