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New Zealand doom and gloom thread
- Thread starter Bahnz
- Start date
Howsie
International Captain
Ha, Jelopeno?
Days of Grace
International Captain
What a waste of a career. Could have been the batting allrounder for the last five years.
CaptainGrumpy
Banned
Its not odi cricket. You do not have to have 5 bowlers who each must bowl 1/5th of the allocated overs.
CaptainGrumpy
Banned
Roberts, Marshall, Holding, Ambrose, Walsh, Croft, Garner, Patterson, Bishop, Clarke, Davis have no idea what you are on about.
But seriously - you could get 10 tidy overs out of Munro/Ryder and Williamson but you should not need ten overs. The front line quicks should have no issue with 20 overs (at a minimum!) and I do not think Craig is about to lose his place in the team just yet.
Furthermore, it is not like our bowlers with two test series are anywhere near being exposed to exhaustion.
We play 37 tests to England's 58 in the next four years.
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CaptainGrumpy
Banned
I have no issue with Watling keeping and batting at 6 if Munro was to be selected at 7.
The most important thing about higher level cricket is the piece of paper with the scorecard on it. Unless someone bowls underarm.
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CaptainGrumpy
Banned
Munro could be an abject failure. But he may not be. What message does it send to first class cricketers if their outstanding form does not give them opportunities at international level.
If the issue is the way he plays - give him a chance regardless. Heck, Sehwag and Gilchrist didn't play a normal game, but it worked out alright for them.
Chanderpaul's stance - worked out, lesser extent S Smith's preparation for taking strike.
Not every cricketer will look a model of a textbook like Kumar Sangakarra, Kane Williamson or Michael Clarke.
Some just have a little more inner Viv in them.
If the issue is the way he plays - give him a chance regardless. Heck, Sehwag and Gilchrist didn't play a normal game, but it worked out alright for them.
Chanderpaul's stance - worked out, lesser extent S Smith's preparation for taking strike.
Not every cricketer will look a model of a textbook like Kumar Sangakarra, Kane Williamson or Michael Clarke.
Some just have a little more inner Viv in them.
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wellAlbidarned
International Coach
Munro is a valid pick but he's essentially competing with McCullum and Ronchi. Having three near pure icing players (although McCullum has a bit more to him) in a single test batting lineup is too brittle.
CaptainGrumpy
Banned
I don't think you could have Ronchi and Munro in the team together. The team either stays as it is (1 though 7), with Watling as a specialist bat and Ronchi keeping, or Munro bats (or Ryder, Anderson, Neesham) with Watling keeping. I think I have made my point of a preference for 6 best batsman and a keeper. For me, my preference is for Watling to keep.
But I see the merit in Ronchi and Watling both playing in the team if Watling's batting becomes even better.
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Howsie
International Captain
Peter Ingram didn't play a normal game either, how'd that work for him?
One of the problems I have with Munro, which some may see as unfair is that their is a loooooong recent history of Auckland batsman piling up runs and being absolutely usless. I have no problem whatsoever him getting a decent run in the one day team but I really can't see him making it as a test batsman with 'that' technique he has fashioned for himself.
As much as I love Manu, his future lies in coloured clothing unless his bowling became valuable enough to justify him at 7 or if he was consistent enough to bat at 6. Not at all saying he can't achieve that either. Definitely think he has NZ representation again in his future, just possibly not in Test cricket when you're already carrying either Corey, Jimmy or both who shade him with both bat and ball.
CaptainGrumpy
Banned
Is Colin Munro Peter Ingram?
He deserves a shot.
And this whole "we need an all rounder to bat 6" is symptiomatic of mental retardation in my opinion.
Corey Anderson's batting and bowling in test cricket is overrated. His batting is agricultural and his bowling is bland. He gives away more runs than he scores. That is not a quality all rounder.
If Neesham was the best middle order batsman around then his bowling would be a bonus. But I do not understand picking a weaker batsman so as to be able to bowl a weaker bowler to give the front line bowlers more of a break. You are giving up runs to give away runs. Ridiculous.
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Immenso
International Vice-Captain
He got a shot, but didn't take it and the shot was given to Anderson who took it until injured and then the shot was passed to Neesham who took it even more until he was also injured and then it was passed back to Anderson who took it again.
CaptainGrumpy
Banned
He got a debut test in South Africa after we were bowled out for what 45 in the first test. In that test he took 2-40 off 18 overs and scored as many runs as Williamson with both innings combined despite getting a golden duck. It was his debut test against a rampant South Africa in South Africa where the team was comprehensively thrashed. Come on.
If he continues to match Williamson for runs in test cricket he could be a worthwhile selection.
The best chance for NZ to win test matches is to play the 6 best batsmen, the best wicket keeper batsmen, and the four best bowlers.
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I guess the argument would be is he a better batsman than Anderson or Neesham at Test level? A lot would say no. Does he offer more or equal with the ball as those two? He doesn't. So unless they're both injured or he shows a compelling case particularly on A tours, he won't be picked.
I am without words.