Moeen Ali and the 'Free Gaza' wrist band

[HeathDavisSpeed]

When the last time any international cricket team toured Israel though?

India A toured in 2008: Shah and Saha seal 3-0 sweep for India A | Cricket News | Israel | ESPN Cricinfo

Not sure if anyone has toured since then, but I suspect some small European teams have played there.

 

[Watson33]

Politics and sport is a very grey area. Moeen is obviously free to express his opinions, but on a sports field is not the place. During training/every day life is the place to wear the wrist bands, but if the ICC were to let this slide it could easily lead to controversial parties getting support on the field. Like what some have said, imagine if pro-UKIP or BNP wrist bands get worn on the field? ICC wouldn't have a leg to stand on if they allowed Moeen to this time.

 

[Burgey]

I don't see a problem with him doing it, tbh. If he wore a Save the Barrier Reef or a Justice for the 96 wrist band, would anyone give a ****? Its a contentious issue but at the end of the day it's a wrist band. He didn't stage a sit in on the pitch ffs.

 

[Blocky]

The reality is when one side is a celebrity cause, it's just stupid to become involved with it.

Interestingly, Stoudemire from the NBA made a statement in regards to the Palestinians being to blame for constant conflict because of radical/terror groups who act under the banner of the state. He was immediately censured.

If anyone puts anything such as "Stop bombing Israel, they'll stop bombing you" on their Twitter, they're receiving death threats.

For me, the reality is that unless you're someone like Matt Damon, research your **** and can capably debate the merits and cons of your viewpoint, you shouldn't be using your position as an athlete or a celebrity to grandstand, considering in most cases, they know next to nothing about the actual realities of the cause.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Seems to be that you know next to the realities of the palestine situation too blocky

 

[Blocky]

Seems to be that you know next to the realities of the palestine situation too blocky

Oh please.

Brief history lesson.

Israel was formed post World War 2 to give the Jewish people a homeland after both the Russian and German people forced them out of Europe. Britain made this happen as a "spoils of war" situation where under the law of the day, they had taken the land that is now known as Israel and had soverign right over it.

Israel was given this land and immediately attacked on all sides of the border, known as the Six Day War - where they had resounding successes and drove deep into Syria, Egypt and other areas then pulled out again once peace accords were made. Nations such as Syria and those that identified as Palestinian ( as Palestine was not actually a state ) continued to attack and aggravate the Israeli population post this war, so there was heavy defences put in place to protect those in Israel.

Since then, Israel has made it a matter of state policy that they will not attack first, but that they will attack without mercy if they are attacked in order to defend their lands, this has meant incursions into the Gaza Strip due to the close proximity to Israel and the amount of radical attacks that have been perpetuated across the border. Every single peace accord and cease fire agreement bar one has been violated by other factions in Palestine, Syria and in some cases Egypt.

The reality is the conflict bleeds back into bible era **** that neither side can get over. There is no Good or Bad. It is atrocious the rate of civilian deaths in the Gaza Strip but to say "Free Palestine" when it is factions wtihin Palestine, including their government Hamas who were elected despite one of their mandates being the utter dissolution and death of Israel, for ANYONE to say that's anything less than a declaration of war is beyond me.

I do wonder if some of you molly coddled citizens of Australia, NZ and England understand the idea that any particular day, a car bomb could blow up in your face, or rockets could be launched across your border, or you'll be dragged kicking and screaming away from your family as they're mutilated. The reality is Israel believe in ten eyes for an eye and do so because they've been defending their very existence as a state since 1946.

 

[Flem274*]

I'm so glad we have an agribusiness representative on the forum to educate us coddled SNAG yuppie youth of today on the way of the world. He tells it like it is because at the end of the day mate, this is how the world works.

 

[Blocky]

Which brings me to my point - you're both equipped to make snarky comments but you're not equipped to debate the actual subject matter, wouldn't surprise me if Moeen Ali or many of the other celebrity/athletes who have posted something similar are in the same boat as you.

The world isn't Black and White. Moral Grey is something you just don't seem to understand.

 

[Dan]

If you want to discuss the politics of the Israel/Gaza situation, take it to the Gaza thread in OT so I don't have to read that **** any more. So, so sick of talking about Gaza.

At the end of the day, Cricket Chat is for exactly that -- cricket chat -- not political "lessons".

From now on I'll be deleting any posts in this thread that aren't relevant to the actual cricket-related issues being discussed.

 

[Dan]

I haven't read much about this but is it possible that he bought the wrist band because he obviously supports Palestine and forgot to take it off in the match?

Theoretically possible, but as someone who wears that style of wristband (not politically charged though, unless cancer charities, cricket clubs or random slogans are now political), I can assure you that you're well aware of their existence on your wrist when you're pulling a batting glove on. They always, always get in the way.

 

[Blocky]

Theoretically possible, but as someone who wears that style of wristband (not politically charged though, unless cancer charities, cricket clubs or random slogans are now political), I can assure you that you're well aware of their existence on your wrist when you're pulling a batting glove on. They always, always get in the way.

Agree - cricket is one of those sports that anything small like that (i.e the Power Balance craze a few years ago) immediately stand out when you pull a pair of gloves on.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Oh please.

Brief history lesson.

Israel was formed post World War 2 to give the Jewish people a homeland after both the Russian and German people forced them out of Europe. Britain made this happen as a "spoils of war" situation where under the law of the day, they had taken the land that is now known as Israel and had soverign right over it.

Israel was given this land and immediately attacked on all sides of the border, known as the Six Day War - where they had resounding successes and drove deep into Syria, Egypt and other areas then pulled out again once peace accords were made. Nations such as Syria and those that identified as Palestinian ( as Palestine was not actually a state ) continued to attack and aggravate the Israeli population post this war, so there was heavy defences put in place to protect those in Israel.

Since then, Israel has made it a matter of state policy that they will not attack first, but that they will attack without mercy if they are attacked in order to defend their lands, this has meant incursions into the Gaza Strip due to the close proximity to Israel and the amount of radical attacks that have been perpetuated across the border. Every single peace accord and cease fire agreement bar one has been violated by other factions in Palestine, Syria and in some cases Egypt.

The reality is the conflict bleeds back into bible era **** that neither side can get over. There is no Good or Bad. It is atrocious the rate of civilian deaths in the Gaza Strip but to say "Free Palestine" when it is factions wtihin Palestine, including their government Hamas who were elected despite one of their mandates being the utter dissolution and death of Israel, for ANYONE to say that's anything less than a declaration of war is beyond me.

I do wonder if some of you molly coddled citizens of Australia, NZ and England understand the idea that any particular day, a car bomb could blow up in your face, or rockets could be launched across your border, or you'll be dragged kicking and screaming away from your family as they're mutilated. The reality is Israel believe in ten eyes for an eye and do so because they've been defending their very existence as a state since 1946.

Going to take this to the gaza thread, but i have one point, that should be mentioned here, the one i was getting at originally ironically. You accused Ali of being ignorant of matters in gaza, with absolutely no basis whatsoever, except that his belief disagrees with your own. You label him a dumb celebrity with no knowledge of his actual interest in the occupation when for all we know, if we stuck you two in a debate chamber he could kick your ass, because what you have read mandates it to be so. Now ftr i've read a lot on Palestine. Just finished John Pilger's Freedom Next Time, a substantial amount of which was devoted to Palestine, which contradicts nearly everything you posted above. Seeing this guys record in Cambodia and East Timor, i would be inclined to listen to what he says. Now i feel i've overstayed my welcome here (sorry Dan), if you are inclined to reply Blocky please come see me in the Gaza thread.

 

[Hurricane]

Politics and sport is a very grey area. Moeen is obviously free to express his opinions, but on a sports field is not the place. During training/every day life is the place to wear the wrist bands, but if the ICC were to let this slide it could easily lead to controversial parties getting support on the field. Like what some have said, imagine if pro-UKIP or BNP wrist bands get worn on the field? ICC wouldn't have a leg to stand on if they allowed Moeen to this time.

This is essentially the crux of it. In order to prevent radical agendas being pushed, all agendas have to be banned.

 

[uvelocity]

can i get away with a wristband with free shane watson #shanewatsonthoughts

 

[Dan]

This is essentially the crux of it. In order to prevent radical agendas being pushed, all agendas have to be banned.

Yeah, I agree with this tbh. We can't be making normative judgements over what political cause/movement is acceptable; either we allow them all and let the public attack players who support terrible causes, or we keep sport politics-free across the board and ban them all.

I much prefer the latter.

 

[NZTailender]

 

[silentstriker]

Came in here just to post this image.

 

[Prince EWS]

Yeah, I agree with this tbh. We can't be making normative judgements over what political cause/movement is acceptable; either we allow them all and let the public attack players who support terrible causes, or we keep sport politics-free across the board and ban them all.

I much prefer the latter.

I much prefer the former myself, but then that's me. I do agree overall.

At the end of the day I don't really have a problem with the ECB telling him it's not on, but I don't think the ICC really should've been involved. Either way I'm not all that fussed as long as it's consistent.

 

[andmark]

One option which is in my mind which I can't really agree with, but does seem to be an option was if the ICC set a semi- political constitution in which it set out vague values it agreed with ("no discrimination on grounds of race, religion ***uality gender etc", "freedom for all people, whatever their nationality, to play cricket"). That could at least make it obvious that the ICC would be against countries like apartheid SA. But then the obvious problem arises that such a constitution could then be interpreted in various ways and might not go against petty things like wearing party merchandise before an election.

 

[TNT]

Why did he do it, to bring attention to the issue or himself. I don't think the issue needed someone wearing a wristband to bring the issue to the public anymore than it already was. Every paper, TV news channel, internet site, social media site and water cooler conversation was dominated by the Gaza issue so I cant see how this stunt did anything for the Palestinians. Moeen on the other hand did get a lot of free publicitiy.