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It's Tough Being Me - The Kevin Pietersen Story

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
Point is, world class Test batsmen with world class records aren't common enough to be throwing them away just because they have a bad trot of form and some young bloke puts a few scores together. (Same logic applies with Cook, of course)
I agree on this 100% in principle. But once you put into context the trust stuff and the fact he's been out of the side for 18 months, it makes it a bit more of a special case. This isn't a model professional team player who's still in the side (which basically is Cook).
 

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
Even a couple of years ago there was a chase of around 250 in 40 overs that was aborted early as they couldn't score at the rate. Shows how things have changed in even a short time like that.
Yeah but it's much harder on 4th/5th day pitches than it is in limited overs stuff. I still think it'd be a huge task on your average county/test pitch. That's the point I'm making.
 

Pratters

Cricket, Lovely Cricket
But the thing is England hasn't exactly been world beaters or have been playing inspirational cricket. Chances are, they are going to get a proper beating this season in the Ashes. An experienced player could be used in such a phase. We had Ganguly in a similar situation and played an important role for us in the last phase of his test career.
 

Spark

Global Moderator
OK but in that respect he's the complete opposite of KP, who is considered a damaging influence on team environment etc. In that respect not only can he not get away with a "below par on pure runs" he probably needs to get more than your average Ian Bell/Gary Ballance would get.

I think in the end that's why he was sacked post Ashes. Not really one thing or another, but they just didn't think he was worth enough in runs to put up with the other shenanigans when Joe Root couldn't make the Sydney test side.
Yeah, Hussey is probably the better Test case for this. Had a really bad run, but was persisted with and gave a good solid few more years.
 

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
But the thing is England hasn't exactly been world beaters or have been playing inspirational cricket. Chances are, they are going to get a proper beating this season in the Ashes. An experienced player could be used in such a phase. We had Ganguly in a similar situation and played an important role for us in the last phase of his test career.
The same thing happened with KP in the side last time and he struggled. On the flip side it's not as if he's going to completely transform the side, even if he is still in the best five bats in the country.
 

OverratedSanity

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What's with the "oh, it's a road" responses anyway? Has any 300+ score ever been made on a pitch which wasn't an international-standard landing strip?
McCullum? Although the pitch did flatten out plenty tbf. Sehwag once got a 290 in barely a day on a pitch which actually had something in it. I remember people saying "Oh, this actually has some bounce and turn in it" when anyone other than Sehwag was batting, and when Viru started smacking it all over the place, everyone went "psshhh, road" :laugh:
 

Furball

Evil Scotsman
So could KP claim loss of income based on them telling him to not go to the IPL?
The ECB could just turn round and say "well at no point did we tell him explicitly not to go to the IPL. We suggested that if Kevin was playing County Cricket and scoring runs there would be a chance of a recall. While we appreciate that Kevin went ahead and did that out of a burning desire to represent England again, nothing was guaranteed and after reviewing the respective positions, we've elected not to select him in the international side this summer."

While I think the ECB, or at least individuals within, have at best acted in very bad faith towards Pietersen over this, and that he's out of pocket as a result, Pietersen is no longer an employee of the ECB. It's akin to giving up the opportunity of a promotion or a job on the promise of a different and better job that falls through at the last minute. Unless a contract has been signed then I don't see how Pietersen has any legal recourse.

inb4sledgercorrectsme
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
It amazes me you can't see what's wrong. It's okay if he isn't picked, he probably didn't deserve to be anyway. But he should be in the running as was intimated to him and not shut out because of Strauss.
No, if he'd done this last year he should be in the running but what sort of message would it send to the younger batsmen competing for a spot if someone can take a year out, stir up a load of **** in a book when out of contract and then swan back in when he feels like it.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Yeah. I would also want him to claim loss of income for putting his England career on hold for almost two years by giving a false impression about him in the media.
Can I claim loss of income for the time I've spent reading your uninformed posts on this subject then?

Or will you now sue me for defamation for this post?
 

OverratedSanity

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No, if he'd done this last year he should be in the running but what sort of message would it send to the younger batsmen competing for a spot if someone can take a year out, stir up a load of **** in a book when out of contract and then swan back in when he feels like it.
No one's saying he should waltz back in. But say Ballance does ****all against NZ, then is it some injustice if KP is considered for a recall? Obviously not.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
I'd be keeping an eye on him now that he's given away the gloves. I don't know if he's fallen away but he should have opened in ODI cricket a lot more than he did and if he's still doing well then he should be in contention in the pyjamas.
Indeed, was a deadset joke that Kiewsetter got so many chances over Davies.
 

sledger

Spanish_Vicente
The ECB could just turn round and say "well at no point did we tell him explicitly not to go to the IPL. We suggested that if Kevin was playing County Cricket and scoring runs there would be a chance of a recall. While we appreciate that Kevin went ahead and did that out of a burning desire to represent England again, nothing was guaranteed and after reviewing the respective positions, we've elected not to select him in the international side this summer."

While I think the ECB, or at least individuals within, have at best acted in very bad faith towards Pietersen over this, and that he's out of pocket as a result, Pietersen is no longer an employee of the ECB. It's akin to giving up the opportunity of a promotion or a job on the promise of a different and better job that falls through at the last minute. Unless a contract has been signed then I don't see how Pietersen has any legal recourse.

inb4sledgercorrectsme
Yeah, you're basically right. There are very few occasions on which you can sue for pure economic loss in English law, and "someone made a vague statement about something that may happen in the future if I possibly did something" is definitely not one of them.
 

flibbertyjibber

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No one's saying he should waltz back in. But say Ballance does ****all against NZ, then is it some injustice if KP is considered for a recall? Obviously not.
Given the start he has had a 2 game barren run for Ballance means nothing and he wouldn't be under any pressure at all.
 

Spark

Global Moderator
McCullum? Although the pitch did flatten out plenty tbf. Sehwag once got a 290 in barely a day on a pitch which actually had something in it. I remember people saying "Oh, this actually has some bounce and turn in it" when anyone other than Sehwag was batting, and when Viru started smacking it all over the place, everyone went "psshhh, road" :laugh:
Yeah I'll give you Sehwag, he's ridiculous in that sort of way. Him, KP, probably Clarke the only other bats of this generation I'd say are capable of similar/equivalent.
 

OverratedSanity

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Given the start he has had a 2 game barren run for Ballance means nothing and he wouldn't be under any pressure at all.
Let's assume Ballance gets found out in an embarassing manner and cant get it off the square... hell, why Ballance? Say Moeen/Stokes do ****all, are you saying you wouldn't consider KP. I'm not even saying he should be selected, and neither is KP. But if he's scoring runs and the batting lineup isn't perfect, he should be in the frame for selection. That's all even KP was saying.
 
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harsh.ag

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
No, if he'd done this last year he should be in the running but what sort of message would it send to the younger batsmen competing for a spot if someone can take a year out, stir up a load of **** in a book when out of contract and then swan back in when he feels like it.
Again, I am with you on that. But that is not the issue, marc. Don't pick him for sound reasons, great, but that is not what Strauss did. He ruled him out of selection, while admitting he is a fantastic player, giving "trust issues" as the reason. And he won't be picked even if he goes on a Bradmanesque rampage.

So, what does a young batsman feel about this sort of abuse of power by the Director of English cricket?
 

NasserFan207

International Vice-Captain
No, if he'd done this last year he should be in the running but what sort of message would it send to the younger batsmen competing for a spot if someone can take a year out, stir up a load of **** in a book when out of contract and then swan back in when he feels like it.
That they aren't good enough to play for England, and need to improve drastically. Sounds like an accurate and much needed message to me.
 

Cabinet96

Hall of Fame Member
Let's assume Ballance gets found out in an embarassing manner and cant get it off the square... hell, why Ballance? Say Moeen/Stokes do ****all, are you saying you wouldn't consider KP. I'm not even saying he should be selected, and neither is KP. But if he's scoring runs and the batting lineup isn't perfect, he should be in the frame for selection. That's all even KP was saying.
The latter two aren't pure batsman though. To replace them with KP would mean a new team balance and bowling structure is needed. You might think it's worth it, but it's not a simple straight swap.
 

OverratedSanity

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The latter two aren't pure batsman though. To replace them with KP would mean a new team balance and bowling structure is needed. You might think it's worth it, but it's not a simple straight swap.
Who said it is? Say you needed an extra batsman, and instead of Stokes and Moeen, you go in with Woakes and KP. Is that so completely out of the realms of possibility that you won't even consider keeping KP in the scheme of things?
 

honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
This is KP himself in the column he wrote. ffs, for all the times, GIMH has called him an idiot and a buffoon, this is exactly what we were saying the ECB should have done. He makes more sense in this one sentence than ECB have ever done in the last year.


GIMH is actually Andrew Strauss... :p
 

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