Is Flintoff Overrated?

[marc71178]

Id have to agree there , If Mark Butcher brought him a beer for every catch he's put down off his bowling then I think he'd go some way towards equalling Boonie's record (58 cans on one international flight)

Glad he didn't after all the work Freddie's done on his fitness (with the resultant improvement in his performances)

 

[luckyeddie]

Glad he didn't after all the work Freddie's done on his fitness (with the resultant improvement in his performances)

Not today, though. That was a lame dismissal, all too often he just gifts his wicket.

Mmmmmmm, 58 cans of beer.

 

[Neil Pickup]

dude i dont see how u can criticise hoggard like this....so before this test match u would have been asking for flintoff to get the axe since he too hadnt taken a 5er? hoggards role in the side is to get 1-2 wickets with the new ball and then since he isnt very effect once the ball doesnt move about his job is to contain. and so far this series i dont think he hasnt done that. his performance with the new ball yesterday was hell of a lot better than harmison or jones and he was the only one actually pitching the ball up unlike harmo.
affirmative on trescothick though...ive been saying it for sooo long now but ive always been greeted with crap like "oh how can u drop a 40+average guy" or did u watch that 214 at the oval" or "have u seen how his 1 performance per year".
i will never understand what 3 spinners are doing in the ODI side!!??are the selectors blind to the fact that giles is getting hammered in the tests???just imagine how hes gonna be hammered in the ODIs.

Congratulations on totally missing the sarcasm.

 

[Craig]

Not today, though. That was a lame dismissal, all too often he just gifts his wicket.

Which is why he may be good or very good, but I doubt world class if he keeps throwing it away.

 

[Craig]

Id have to agree there , If Mark Butcher brought him a beer for every catch he's put down off his bowling then I think he'd go some way towards equalling Boonie's record (58 cans on one international flight)

I dont know about that amount of dropped catches.

It also shows how poor Vaughan's captaincy is if he doesnt move Butcher if he can field there.

 

[luckyeddie]

I dont know about that amount of dropped catches.

It also shows how poor Vaughan's captaincy is if he doesnt move Butcher if he can field there.

This has always puzzled me too. Butcher is one of those players who can take the odd blinder but then spills the regulation chance - and the same can be said for Thorpe.

Captains don't tend to field in the slips any more - the 'fashion' is to be at mid-off (mid-on to left-handers) so the skipper can 'encourage' the bowler.

For me, Trescothick is by far the most solid slipper in the side (but you shouldn't just get picked on that) followed by Flintoff in the last year.

 

[Craig]

Fleming fields at 1st slip regularly, and I guess Mark Taylor did that as well (dont remember much of Taylor's playing days).

I guess maybe he lacks confidence or doesnt do enough practice or a combination of both.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Flintoff's performance today underlines what I've always said about Hoggard, which is that he's absolutely useless and should be dropped immediately, as is obvious from the fact that he's the only so-called pace bowler in this side who hasn't got a five-fer in the series.

Trescothick is approximately the wrost bastman in wrold cricket and shouldn't just be dropped - he should be taken out and shot.

As for Giles, well, he just not very good, is he?

Success on the Hoggard front

As for Trescothick, I don't think the guy warrants a place in the Somerset side anymore - twenty runs at five is utterly useless and to be quite honest I would fancy my chances against him.

 

[luckyeddie]

Success on the Hoggard front

As for Trescothick, I don't think the guy warrants a place in the Somerset side anymore - twenty runs at five is utterly useless and to be quite honest I would fancy my chances against him.

Undefeated double hundred for Trescothick in the fourth test in 5....4....3....

 

[Tom Halsey]

As for Trescothick, I don't think the guy warrants a place in the Somerset side anymore - twenty runs at five is utterly useless and to be quite honest I would fancy my chances against him.

It always amazes me how people say he is bad because of one bad series. On that basis, Lara should also be dropped, replaced with Wavell Hinds.

 

[Rich2001]

This has always puzzled me too. Butcher is one of those players who can take the odd blinder but then spills the regulation chance - and the same can be said for Thorpe.

Captains don't tend to field in the slips any more - the 'fashion' is to be at mid-off (mid-on to left-handers) so the skipper can 'encourage' the bowler.

For me, Trescothick is by far the most solid slipper in the side (but you shouldn't just get picked on that) followed by Flintoff in the last year.

I would certianly put Vaughan into that group too, always takes the blinders, but drops the simple ones.

 

[Tom Halsey]

Congratulations on totally missing the sarcasm.

ROFLMAO.



That tickled me.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Success on the Hoggard front

As for Trescothick, I don't think the guy warrants a place in the Somerset side anymore - twenty runs at five is utterly useless and to be quite honest I would fancy my chances against him.

Right, Tresco's sorted.

Ashley, listen up. You couldn't deceive an Under 9 with the pitiful excuse for flight in your "spin" bowling, which incidentally wouldn't turn on the dustbowl of the 1930s. Not only that, but it's too slow and I'd back Marc to cart you back over your own head for consecutive sixes. Go play for Spain.

And Halsey, you appeared to miss the sarcasm too... :P

 

[Umair316]

I don't think Flintoff is overrated!
Since the retirement of Botham, England never had the kind of allrounder like him.
You had bits and pieces allrounders like Craig White, Holliokes but never someone who can single handedly take the match away from the opposition with the bat and ball.
Flintoff is a very good find for England, and will serve them well in years to come.

 

[tooextracool]

It always amazes me how people say he is bad because of one bad series. On that basis, Lara should also be dropped, replaced with Wavell Hinds.

u see the problem was that we thought he was having a bad series in australia,sri lanka and in the first 4 tests against SA. but it appears as though that was when he was actually in form.

 

[Craig]

I don't think Flintoff is overrated!
Since the retirement of Botham, England never had the kind of allrounder like him.
You had bits and pieces allrounders like Craig White, Holliokes but never someone who can single handedly take the match away from the opposition with the bat and ball.
Flintoff is a very good find for England, and will serve them well in years to come.

White IMO was/is a little better then bits-and-pieces player.

If he could remain fit he could swing the ball both ways, resverse swing, get cut which is handy.

 

[marc71178]

His batting and hos bowling were both not as good as those around - he had spells of ability with both, but for me he was definitely nowhere near as good a bowler as DGC, and his batting wasn't that much better if at all.

 

[Prince EWS]

White IMO was/is a little better then bits-and-pieces player.

If he could remain fit he could swing the ball both ways, resverse swing, get cut which is handy.

Im glad you said it. Someone had to.

He could easily make the team on his bowling alone when he was fully fit (which only happened occassionally :rolleyes: )

 

[Prince EWS]

His batting and hos bowling were both not as good as those around - he had spells of ability with both, but for me he was definitely nowhere near as good a bowler as DGC, and his batting wasn't that much better if at all.

I think he was treated unfairly as a bowler. He continually got dropped after being played while unfit, and was always given the old ball. He was clearly your best bowler in Australia last time around, and made some handy contributions with the bat.

However, he shouldnt have been batted at number seven....

 

[tooextracool]

His batting and hos bowling were both not as good as those around - he had spells of ability with both, but for me he was definitely nowhere near as good a bowler as DGC, and his batting wasn't that much better if at all.

at his peak he was the quickest bowler in the side and as craig said he could do absolutely everything with the ball. and he wasnt a very bad batter particularly in the sub continent....his performances against pak,SL and india are often undermined. believe me his performances were far better than flintoff's have been so far