Interesting take on Bradman's concentration levels.

[NotMcKenzie]

Snip

I'll have to take your word for it given I don't have access to full stats and cannot reconcile those figures with those I can find, but including 'minor' matches isn't good practice. After all, it could very well include the PM's XI match against England in 1963.

-Edit-

Incidentally, some of the invitational XI matches do actually provide the potential of that scenario everyone posits - namely facing one's own test bowling attack - actually happening (this is a good example). Therefore, they actually further complicate things.

 

[shortpitched713]

I don't think that's right. Averaged 110 in the Sheffield Shield, and I doubt the other first-class matches played in Australia at the time (vs Tassie or WA, select XI's, etc.) would have changed that much. Overall first class average of 95.14, and I suspect his lowest average was English tour matches.

The rest is irrelevant.

Tests are a part of FC average, so if he averaged greater than 95.14 in Tests, then he had to average less than 95.14 in domestic FC.

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Just a tangent and I'm in no way a basketball expert, but wasn't Wilt Chamberlain renowned for stat-padding to the extreme and then went missing in the post-season?

 

[Patience and Accuracy+Gut]

Just a tangent and I'm in no way a basketball expert, but wasn't Wilt Chamberlain renowned for stat-padding to the extreme and then went missing in the post-season?

Wilt would have put on ridiculous stats anyway any era. His post- season numbers are lot better than people say but definitely not close to his own level. Mind you his post-season numbers in total are still up in near the top.

Wilt is pretty much similar to the stories that you hear of people 1000s year ago except those are actually true. MJ, Lebron, Shaq all are basically half the physical specimen Wilt was.

 

[Coronis]

I'll have to take your word for it given I don't have access to full stats and cannot reconcile those figures with those I can find, but including 'minor' matches isn't good practice. After all, it could very well include the PM's XI match against England in 1963.

-Edit-

Incidentally, some of the invitational XI matches do actually provide the potential of that scenario everyone posits - namely facing one's own test bowling attack - actually happening (this is a good example). Therefore, they actually further complicate things.

iirc this match (alongside the 35/36 shield season - where Bradman was too sick for the tour of SA but well enough to captain SA to the Shield title) was used by Bradman as his excuse for Ward > Grimmett in the Ashes side. Whilst downplaying him as a player is stupid, as a selector and a person its easy.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Just a tangent and I'm in no way a basketball expert, but wasn't Wilt Chamberlain renowned for stat-padding to the extreme and then went missing in the post-season?

Took a big dip yeah and the numbers were immensely inflated due to the pace of play of that era. Teams just ran up and down the court jacking up shots at an insane clip which meant more potential points, more rebounds to get more assists, more blocks, more everything. Wilt's team on average had 130+ possessions a game, in the ongoing NBA season the average team has around a 100. Basketball is a fundamentally different game to cricket too where ball-hogs can put up great numbers by just but not achieve real team success.

I find the idea that Wilt was an outlier to the same extent as Bradman to be complete nonsense. There were no circumstances in Bradman's era (like pace of play for Wilt) that convincingly explain why his numbers were so freakishly good. It was a pretty flat era for batting of course, but nowhere near to the extent where an average of 100 can be explained by anything but just him being unfathomably good.

 

[peterhrt]

I'll have to take your word for it given I don't have access to full stats and cannot reconcile those figures with those I can find

Bradman's first-class record in Australia, excluding Tests and Sheffield Shield. By team represented.

South Australia (non Shield): 1460 runs @ 85.88. 6 centuries
Australian XI: 1233 @ 68.50. 6 centuries
NSW (non Shield): 1180 @ 73.75. 4 centuries
DG Bradman's XI: 505 @ 63.12. 3 centuries
WM Woodfull's XI: 349 @ 174.50. 2 centuries
VY Richardson's XI: 156 @ 78.00. 1 century
AR Morris's XI: 53 @ 53.00.
The Rest: 46 @11.50.

Total: 4982 runs @ 73.26. 22 centuries

 

[peterhrt]

including 'minor' matches isn't good practice.

Bradman was once asked how many centuries he had scored in all cricket. He replied that he stopped counting once he reached his 200th. Many thought he was joking, given that he had made "only" 117 in the first-class game.

The Australian Broadcasting Commission did some digging, and found that Bradman had played almost exactly the same number of innings in minor cricket (331) as in first-class matches (338). These included 51 in Canada and USA in 1932, in which he scored 3782 runs at average of 102.21 with 18 hundreds. He was photographed shaking hands with baseball star Babe Ruth.

The ABC confirmed the total of 211 centuries in all cricket. Hobbs had been credited with 244 and Grace 222. The only other regular first-class cricketer known to have reached the 200 century mark is Graeme Hick, though Gooch probably did so and Hammond and Boycott may have done. Only five club cricketers are confirmed to have registered the landmark, led by Sri Lankan Joe Misso with 310 hundreds.

 

[Ali TT]

Wilt would have put on ridiculous stats anyway any era. His post- season numbers are lot better than people say but definitely not close to his own level. Mind you his post-season numbers in total are still up in near the top.

Wilt is pretty much similar to the stories that you hear of people 1000s year ago except those are actually true. MJ, Lebron, Shaq all are basically half the physical specimen Wilt was.

Yeah cause MJ, LeBron and Shaq never went to a gym

 

[Coronis]

Yeah cause MJ, LeBron and Shaq never went to a gym

lol

But yeah Wilt I think overall, despite some of the guys in recent times Wilt is still the most physically gifted player to play in the NBA.

 

[ataraxia]

too much attention gets paid to bradman's average and not enough to the conversion rate. the average is just the end result of the conversion rate. a lot of people would average close to 99.94 if they never got out once they made a start. so why is bradman the only person ever to do anything like that. and if you look at smith above, he was doing something close enough with his conversion rate there

I always think of this as crazy. Imagine what his record might be if he could sort out his issues getting started! A massive freak of nature.

 

[Patience and Accuracy+Gut]

lol

But yeah Wilt I think overall, despite some of the guys in recent times Wilt is still the most physically gifted player to play in the NBA.

Bradman and Wilt are basically the prime example that freaks may arrive anytime. I don’t see either getting match for centuries tbh. The physical specimen that Wilt was may never ever get matched.

Bradman on particular averaged twice the Stan McCabe. Anyone saying Ponsford, McCabe etc. weren’t at least as good as Warner, labuschagne etc. has no right to comment about cricket.

 

[Coronis]

Bradman and Wilt are basically the prime example that freaks may arrive anytime. I don’t see either getting match for centuries tbh. The physical specimen that Wilt was may never ever get matched.

Bradman on particular averaged twice the Stan McCabe. Anyone saying Ponsford, McCabe etc. weren’t at least as good as Warner, labuschagne etc. has no right to comment about cricket.

I like that they’re completely different types of “freaks” too. Like Bradman was not a physical freak at all. Even had poor eyesight.

 

[sayon basak]

The ABC confirmed the total of 211 centuries in all cricket. Hobbs had been credited with 244 and Grace 222. The only other regular first-class cricketer known to have reached the 200 century mark is Graeme Hick, though Gooch probably did so and Hammond and Boycott may have done. Only five club cricketers are confirmed to have registered the landmark, led by Sri Lankan Joe Misso with 310 hundreds.

Could you provide some numbers for Stanley Colman, John Stuck, Len Newman and Tray Grinter? They might also have close to 200 centuries in all of cricket.

 

[sayon basak]

Tests are a part of FC average, so if he averaged greater than 95.14 in Tests, then he had to average less than 95.14 in domestic FC.

93.65

 

[Daemon]

afaik there is no credible evidence to suggest bradman existed

 

[sayon basak]

afaik there is no credible evidence to suggest bradman existed

The whole universe might just be a simulation, so you could doubt your own existence as well imo.

 

[Qlder]

Can't believe 7 people think Bradman would average in the 50's lol

 

[sayon basak]

Can't believe 7 people said bradman would average in the 50's lol

There are valid reasons for that. They haven't found enough evidence of a dead man averaging more than 50.
@Athlai

 

[Coronis]

afaik there is no credible evidence to suggest bradman existed

iirc he was a myth created to help get Australia through the Great Depression. Then they brought the story back for a year or two to cheer up folks after the war.