Has Joe Root been under bowled this series?

[Whistler]

He is the most economical bowler out of both teams and is averaging 27.00 with the ball. He has probably been the best spinner bar Lyon.

 

[slowfinger]

Whenever I've watched him bowl he hasn't blown me away to be honest. His numbers might look pretty but he doesn't bowl many threatening deliveries. Whereas Moeen for right or wrong will almost guarantee a chance or two a spell, somehow.

 

[Whistler]

Whenever I've watched him bowl he hasn't blown me away to be honest. His numbers might look pretty but he doesn't bowl many threatening deliveries. Whereas Moeen for right or wrong will almost guarantee a chance or two a spell, somehow.

Ali dishes up so many loose deliveries. In English conditions, unless you have an outright wicket-taking spinner, you just want them to hold up an end. If we want wicket taking options, then Ahmed should be playing.

 

[slowfinger]

Ali dishes up so many loose deliveries. In English conditions, unless you have an outright wicket-taking spinner, you just want them to hold up an end. If we want wicket taking options, then Ahmed should be playing.

that makes little sense considering

1. rehan ahmed is 18 - throwing him into the Ashes I don't think will be good for him or England right now
2. Woakes/Broad/Anderson all economical bowlers anyway
3. Moeen can hit a 50 even though we have seen little evidence of recent note.

I think offspinners get treated quite harshly compared to legspinners in how important they are to the team. Since Swann, Moeen has been the only bowler to show signs of being a threatening spinning option. If Mo bowled legspin then we would say he is invaluable to the team and there is no way we should even consider dropping him.

 

[loterry1994]

I think his alright to just hold up an end and be a bit economical while letting some your fast bowlers rest up a bit. Cause like you said Mooen can be expensive sometimes. In terms of being a wicket taking threat, I don’t think he has ever been a threat and players and teams aren’t really worried about him getting their wicket in any format

 

[Whistler]

that makes little sense considering

1. rehan ahmed is 18 - throwing him into the Ashes I don't think will be good for him or England right now
2. Woakes/Broad/Anderson all economical bowlers anyway
3. Moeen can hit a 50 even though we have seen little evidence of recent note.

I think offspinners get treated quite harshly compared to legspinners in how important they are to the team. Since Swann, Moeen has been the only bowler to show signs of being a threatening spinning option. If Mo bowled legspin then we would say he is invaluable to the team and there is no way we should even consider dropping him.

Jack Leach has a much better strike rate and economy in England than Ali. Again though, Leach is just there to hold an end up without being overly threatening. Do you want an economical spinner or a wicket-taking one?

 

[slowfinger]

I mean for example just look at the exemplary attitude the Aussies have had towards Lyon to be fair. He's on exhalted status - and I think that if he was English quite frankly he wouldn't have made it out of the County Circuits. We have loads of Lyon's in the County Championship.

 

[slowfinger]

Jack Leach has a much better strike rate and economy in England than Ali. Again though, Leach is just there to hold an end up without being overly threatening. Do you want an economical spinner or a wicket-taking one?

It's an attitude thing. I mean this is coming from an offspinner himself (me). Leach forced Moeen into retirement let's be honest so when he's fit he will be straight in. And as I said before, you need a wicket taking option at all times in Test match cricket - at least is the Baz-ish way of thinking I'm pretty sure.

 

[loterry1994]

Jack Leach has a much better strike rate and economy in England than Ali. Again though, Leach is just there to hold an end up without being overly threatening. Do you want an economical spinner or a wicket-taking one?

Leech is a good spinner and still takes enough wickets for me when given the opportunity. His not going to get used as much especially in England because the conditions are already so favourable to the fast bowlers to take the wickets.

 

[Whistler]

I mean for example just look at the exemplary attitude the Aussies have had towards Lyon to be fair. He's on exhalted status - and I think that if he was English quite frankly he wouldn't have made it out of the County Circuits. We have loads of Lyon's in the County Championship.

We’ve tried quite a few like Lyon and they have gone for runs at the international level.

 

[slowfinger]

We’ve tried quite a few like Lyon and they have gone for runs at the international level.

but again I think the attitude is a big part of the problem. the English attitude towards spinners is quite frankly stupid. Spinners are always looked at as a necessary annoyance to the team despite their importance which is highlighted time and time again.

We should be looking to treat offspinners how Harmer is treated as Essex - even Cook yesterday made a comment about how he has won Essex matches constantly for years. Cook also treated Moeen very well during his - shock - best bowling days in England

 

[Ali TT]

I mean for example just look at the exemplary attitude the Aussies have had towards Lyon to be fair. He's on exhalted status - and I think that if he was English quite frankly he wouldn't have made it out of the County Circuits. We have loads of Lyon's in the County Championship.

Who are these loads of Lyon's in the CC? We have an absolute dearth of English spinners right now.

I wonder what the future of spin bowling will be in the Bazball era? There aren't many good spinners in test cricket right now and the best are getting on a bit. I think England's willingness to smash any mediocre spinner to all parts is an element of Bazball that will be picked up by other sides. The only defense against it would be to prepare the types of wicket India have in recent years. Anything flat and the spinner is going out of the park.

 

[Nas207]

Who are these loads of Lyon's in the CC? We have an absolute dearth of English spinners right now.

I wonder what the future of spin bowling will be in the Bazball era? There aren't many good spinners in test cricket right now and the best are getting on a bit. I think England's willingness to smash any mediocre spinner to all parts is an element of Bazball that will be picked up by other sides. The only defense against it would be to prepare the types of wicket India have in recent years. Anything flat and the spinner is going out of the park.

Could also help those spinners. Look how many cheap wickets england gave Lyon this series. Felt like 5 or 6 stumpings

 

[Ali TT]

Could also help those spinners. Look how many cheap wickets england gave Lyon this series. Felt like 5 or 6 stumpings

Lyon a level above anyone else bar the Ashwin and Jadeja though.

 

[Nas207]

Lyon a level above anyone else bar the Ashwin and Jadeja though.

Lyon is class, he still benefited from some English donations this series

 

[slowfinger]

Lyon is class, he still benefited from some English donations this series

but that's just how Lyon gets his wickets though, he's earned them

he's actually really hard to hit out of the attack because he doesn't bowl flat, he gets bounce and if the wicket helps a bit then he can extract decent turn. he loves a left hander as well because of his action.

whereas for example Root is a lot easier to play because he doesn't get much dip, bowls pretty darty quick offies so he doesn't give himself much of a chance

 

[Nas207]

but that's just how Lyon gets his wickets though, he's earned them

he's actually really hard to hit out of the attack because he doesn't bowl flat, he gets bounce and if the wicket helps a bit then he can extract decent turn. he loves a left hander as well because of his action.

whereas for example Root is a lot easier to play because he doesn't get much dip, bowls pretty darty quick offies so he doesn't give himself much of a chance

Again, no denying Lyon's class. But i dont think i've ever seen so many stumpings in a series.

 

[slowfinger]

Again, no denying Lyon's class. But i dont think i've ever seen so many stumpings in a series.

i think it's England getting a bit carried away with the whole bazball stuff to be honest

 

[loterry1994]

Again, no denying Lyon's class. But i dont think i've ever seen so many stumpings in a series.

you hadn’t seen that many series where people are running out the crease as much as well

 

[slowfinger]

i actually think simon harmer is better than nathan lyon though