Garry Sobers-A master of black magic?

[Richard]

I know, and frankly I see such a judgement as being based on style rather than substance. You're not alone at all in such a judgement, of course.

 

[Fusion]

Absolutely no chance was Vivian Richards a better batsman than Sobers AFAIC. Nor Lara.

Only West Indian who has a compelling case for being better is George Headley. Everton Weekes maybe, but only maybe.

Imran was better bowler than all of them.Hadlee & Marshall follow him closely while others are marginally behind.

Opinions and preferences, they are wonderful things to share. Let's leave room for a little disagreement shall we?

 

[Richard]

I inserted the "as far as I'm concerned" didn't I?

 

[BhupinderSingh]

Only West Indian who has a compelling case for being better is George Headley. Everton Weekes maybe, but only maybe.

Headley was a better batsman than Sobers but Weekes was not.

 

[Ikki]

Leaving Imran out of top 10 bowlers would be just like leaving Hobbs,V.Richards,Lara etc out of top 10 batsmen.V.Richards,Hobbs,Hutton,Lara were all better batsmen than Sobers so Sobers might be one of the greatest batsmen ever but he's not a clear number 2.

Ahh, but would leaving Imran out of top 10 bowlers be like leaving Sobers out of top 10 batsmen? I think you know the answer yourself. But just in case your bias gets the best of you , it would be rather scandalous to leave Sobers out of the top 10 whilst for Imran you can actually make plausible arguments to leave him out.

 

[BhupinderSingh]

Ahh, but would leaving Imran out of top 10 bowlers be like leaving Sobers out of top 10 batsmen? I think you know the answer yourself. But just in case your bias gets the best of you , it would be rather scandalous to leave Sobers out of the top 10 whilst for Imran you can actually make plausible arguments to leave him out.

Everyone is biased to some extent & leaving Imran would be as scandelous as leaving Sobers.I don't consider him that great because of just bias but I actually believe he was as good a bowler as Sobers was batsman.And I don't think its much wrong in saying that.We do differ in opinions but it doesn't mean you start attacking my credibility here.

 

[Ikki]

Everyone is biased to some extent & leaving Imran would be as scandelous as leaving Sobers.I don't consider him that great because of just bias but I actually believe he was as good a bowler as Sobers was batsman.And I don't think its much wrong in saying that.We do differ in opinions but it doesn't mean you start attacking my credibility here.

I am not attacking you're credibility, you are a self-proclaimed Imran fan - aren't you?

So, it's just natural we'll disagree. If anything, I am more of an Imran fan than a Sobers fan but it's really not near as scandalous to leave Imran out for his bowling as it is for Sobers and his batting.

 

[Richard]

I think it is TBH.

If someone told me they'd picked a top-10 of Test-match bowlers from 1900 onwards and Imran wasn't in there I'd want to know why really.

 

[The Sean]

I think it is TBH.

If someone told me they'd picked a top-10 of Test-match bowlers from 1900 onwards and Imran wasn't in there I'd want to know why really.

I'd say it was because they thought there were at least 10 better Test bowlers than Imran.

 

[BhupinderSingh]

I am not attacking you're credibility, you are a self-proclaimed Imran fan - aren't you?

Being fan of someone doesn't mean you are biased.

 

[Ikki]

I think it is TBH.

If someone told me they'd picked a top-10 of Test-match bowlers from 1900 onwards and Imran wasn't in there I'd want to know why really.

Spofforth, Barnes, Lillee, Marshall, Hadlee, Warne, McGrath, Murali, Akram and Donald

The above is a list I exemplified earlier that could have all names before Imran quite plausibly. Spofforth is the only bowler pre-1900.

 

[Ikki]

Being fan of someone doesn't mean you are biased.

That's kinda actually what it means.

 

[silentstriker]

I'd disagree with all the spinners and Akram and Donald. The others have a legitimate shot at being better.

 

[Ikki]

I'd disagree with all the spinners and Akram and Donald. The others have a legitimate shot at being better.

not surprised by that comment TBH with the spinners, but Akram and Donald have very solid cases. To leave Imran out and put them is just not as scandalous as say putting Lara, Tendulkar or even a Ponting in and leaving out a Sobers - and the former 3 are actually up there for a place in the top 10.

 

[Richard]

Spofforth, Barnes, Lillee, Marshall, Hadlee, Warne, McGrath, Murali, Akram and Donald

The above is a list I exemplified earlier that could have all names before Imran quite plausibly. Spofforth is the only bowler pre-1900.

Should have said seam-bowlers of course as well as post-1900 - and I'd argue that both Wasim Akram and Dennis Lillee have compelling cases to be ranked lower.

 

[shortpitched713]

My 5 greatest cricketers ever:

1.Don Bradman
2.Imran Khan
3.Viv Richards
4.Garry Sobers
5.Jack Hobbs

I think we need to ban you from making these kind of lists. They get tedious very, very fast.

 

[Sanz]

All I'm saying is that Sobers might have started his career as a bowler but wouldn't have been to maintain his place because of his crap bowling if he had not improved his batting.If batsmen like Haroon Rashid & Rameez Raja could make the side then I don't see any reason how Imran wouldn't have.Imran played as a specialist batsman in the side in early 1980s when he had been advised by the doctors not to bowl because of some injury(I think it was a true or three year period).

What you are saying is pure assumption on your part. The fact is that sobers did make it to the team as a bowler and bowled more overs for his team than Imran did for Pakistan. Imran did NOT make it to the team as batsman, No one would have picked him as a batsman in his debut tests(in 71 or 76 whichever you prefer). Sobers made to the team mainly as a bowler.

Also it is a fallacy that Imran was picked as batsman for 3 years, Care to point out how many series in the 80s did Imran play solely as a batsman ? Imran may have become a better batsman than Rashid or Rameez later in his career, but in the beginning he was not.

 

[Richard]

I think we need to ban you from making these kind of lists. They get tedious very, very fast.

Agree with that TBH. Wouldn't ban him from doing so, though - just have a friendly "let's see it a bit less often hey?" word. Much easier.

 

[Richard]

Imran did NOT make it to the team as batsman, No one would have picked him as a batsman in his debut tests(in 71 or 76 whichever you prefer). Sobers made to the team mainly as a bowler.

Imran would have played for Pakistan purely as a batsman from 1980 onwards.

 

[Sanz]

I think Unattainableguy has made a fairly valid point there.

How is it a fair point ? If Afridi came into the team as a bowler how come he was opening in his 2nd ODI and scoring the fastest century in ODI. Please get your facts right before making ridiculous claims.