Freddie to retire after the Ashes

[shivfan]

How do people not get that this isn't about what is more important but about what his body is capable of?

It's easy to read between the lines....

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/cricket/article6718967.ece?token=null&offset=12&page=2

"He was masking his true motives when he said that he intended to play on for two more World Cups up to 2015. Given that he will be 37 by then, this was barely credible. Gough quit Tests to play 50 overs cricket but even though he lasted another three years he still fell short of his aim of taking part in the 2007 World Cup. Flintoff will receive far more lucrative offers away from England duty. He will not want to be playing ODIs in Bangladesh in March when he could be playing a full IPL season in return for £1.1m. He will turn down any form of England contract in September in favour of going freelance. That way, in the next year, he stands to earn more than he has in any previous 12-month period by playing 20-over cricket for Queensland, Chennai Super Kings and Lancashire, with whom his contract ends next year. How long he then carries on may depend on how his Twenty20 form stands up. It was nothing special in his first season with Chennai."

Let's call a spade a spade....

You can't slate Gayle for saying he prefers 20/20 cricket to Test cricket, and not recognise that Flintoff is doing exactly what Gayle says he will do when he reaches the twilight of his career.

 

[GIMH]

I haven't slated Gayle as far as I can remember, but anyway. There's no doubt Flintoff will earn plenty in the next few years, fair play to him. The key point is the one jamee made - he'd have retired from cricket full-stop if the rules said so, his body is ****ed. He was clearly in agony at the end of his spell this morning, what a spell by the way. In ODIs/T20 he won't have to bowl more than 10 overs...

 

[Langeveldt]

Total balls.

He's not assuming that, just informing the selectors that these are the last 3 games they CAN select him for.

Don't understand why he needs to do that, he could retire right at the end of the series and give them ample time to get their house in order regarding finding a new all rounder.. The whole thing creates a bit of a side show around him for the remaining tests now

 

[Swervy]

Don't understand why he needs to do that, he could retire right at the end of the series and give them ample time to get their house in order regarding finding a new all rounder.. The whole thing creates a bit of a side show around him for the remaining tests now

and 99% dont care, for his fans (which you have said you arent one of them) it gives us a chance to savour his play whilst he is here, it has added to the drama of what has so far been a top class series

 

[Richard]

Don't understand why he needs to do that, he could retire right at the end of the series and give them ample time to get their house in order regarding finding a new all rounder.. The whole thing creates a bit of a side show around him for the remaining tests now

Don't get why people criticise any player for announcing their retirement before a series, or after it. For every argument in favour of waiting until the end of the series, there's one in favour of announcing before (or even during) it.

It should be left up to the player concerned IMO, some prefer to announce beforehand and some prefer to announce abruptly after they've played their last game. There are merits and demerits in both approaches, and no-one should be criticised for selecting either.

 

[Richard]

Firstly his role in the ODI side wasn't as specialist spinner at all. It was a big hitting batsman who could give handy overs of off-spin. Its just at times in IND last winter for eg, the selectors stupidly picked him as a main-spinner.

He replaced Swann for the SA series - his debut one. He was always being picked more for his spin than his batting, same as others of his kind Jamie Dalyrmple, Alex Loudon, Paul Grayson and Michael Yardy. It's a recurring fault - one of many - in England ODI selection.

As i said before, you really have to wonder what kind of bowling attacks Patel has been facing to average 50 in FC cricket. If he ever gets near to test squad, it will just further prove ENGs batting depth is **** ATM.

Just how many of those First-Class games of his have you watched to see how poor he is then?

It should be serious option looking ahead to the SA tour, since Bopora aint going to nail down the # 3 spot this summer.

Might do, might not. But even if he doesn't, I'd be surprised to see Strauss and Cook split, because people are finally discarding the nonsensical notion that they couldn't succeed together.

Haa, if this was football you wont be saying that...

But it isn't. It's cricket.

 

[Richard]

Cairns > Flintoff

And?

 

[Jamee999]

The guy should run for PM, iyam.

 

[aussie]

He replaced Swann for the SA series - his debut one. He was always being picked more for his spin than his batting, same as others of his kind Jamie Dalyrmple, Alex Loudon, Paul Grayson and Michael Yardy. It's a recurring fault - one of many - in England ODI selection.

For real you know, good point. Add Ian Blackwell to this list as well.

Just how many of those First-Class games of his have you watched to see how poor he is then?.

I don't have to see him, to know such performances show that the quality of cricket in our domestic competition is poor, even if the structure in top quality.

If you have guys like Ramprakash & Hick for years after retirement scoring big runs. With Ramps almost recalled the other day. God damn..

Then you have Kaneria & Mushtaq spinning out batsmen, but when picked for PAK look very average. Thats tells you something very serious.

Might do, might not. But even if he doesn't, I'd be surprised to see Strauss and Cook split, because people are finally discarding the nonsensical notion that they couldn't succeed together.

That no doubt that was a concern. But the option should just be kept on the table as the #3 spot remains a problem.

But it isn't. It's cricket.

Yea but i'm just showing how the mentality in these two sports is so different.

 

[Richard]

I don't have to see him, to know such performances show that the quality of cricket in our domestic competition is poor, even if the structure in top quality.

If you have guys like Ramprakash & Hick for years after retirement scoring big runs. With Ramps almost recalled the other day. God damn..

Then you have Kaneria & Mushtaq spinning out batsmen, but when picked for PAK look very average. Thats tells you something very serious.

The fact that the quality of county cricket is less than it might ideally be is one thing; that every player who succeeds there isn't good enough for international cricket is quite another, and 100% not true.

Someone who succeeds there has merited a chance, if others who succeed there have blown theirs.

 

[Athlai]

And?

Just thought the UK should know that.

 

[Richard]

You might be surprised to hear that the people of the UK who have a balanced World view actually do know it. At the end of the day, though, both have to go down as huge disappointments, for all they achieved.

 

[aussie]

The fact that the quality of county cricket is less than it might ideally be is one thing; that every player who succeeds there isn't good enough for international cricket is quite another, and 100% not true.

Someone who succeeds there has merited a chance, if others who succeed there have blown theirs.

I'm not saying that no player does well in CC currently should be considered for the national side, of course the recent selections of Swann & Sidebottom proves overtime an average player could become test quality. Although i would say players who do well in Divison two, i certainly wont pick them very often if at all.

But i'm saying given that poor quality of cricket, selectors need not be robotic in their selections, always equating County runs/wickets = test quality (Divison 1). But look beyond the box sometimes & pick a player on raw talent or a special performance sometimes although it may be risky.

Unfortunately with England ATM, when we look at the problems in the batting line-up & bowling now that Flintoff retiring in tests. Beyond the box is just as bad as the average county players who will never be test quality or have been in out of the test side i.e Bell, Harmo.

Who is the next super talented England batsman??. Where is the next special fast-bowling talent?. Where is the next Flintoff (well like Botham before him, we might not see another one for 20+ years)

 

[Richard]

Whenever the next super-talented England batsman (or bowler for that matter) turns-up, you can bet a fair bit that he'll dominate the sheer dross that is the County Championship. However much it may be true that someone who can perform at county level is no guarantee for international success, if someone can't even perform terribly well at the apparently-so-poor county level there's precious little chance of them doing anything much at top level.

It's one thing being robotic - it's quite another ignoring fundamental basics. Near enough every player selected for England should first have dominated or at least mastered county cricket.

 

[aussie]

Whenever the next super-talented England batsman (or bowler for that matter) turns-up, you can bet a fair bit that he'll dominate the sheer dross that is the County Championship. However much it may be true that someone who can perform at county level is no guarantee for international success, if someone can't even perform terribly well at the apparently-so-poor county level there's precious little chance of them doing anything much at top level.

It's one thing being robotic - it's quite another ignoring fundamental basics. Near enough every player selected for England should first have dominated or at least mastered county cricket.

All true. But right the county system aint showing anything positive ATM for the test side except for Rashid. So right now, the poor standard of county cricket is being exposed given KP is out & Flintoff is retiring from test. Very average replacements are available.

 

[superkingdave]

All true. But right the county system aint showing anything positive ATM for the test side except for Rashid. So right now, the poor standard of county cricket is being exposed given KP is out & Flintoff is retiring from test. Very average replacements are available.

Do you watch any county cricket Aussie? Have you even seen Rashid play? Stop talking absolute *****

 

[aussie]

Do you watch any county cricket Aussie? Have you even seen Rashid play? Stop talking absolute *****

Ha, clearly i said Rashid is the ONLY positive player ENG have ATM for future tests endeavours, i will not ridiculing him.

 

[Richard]

Think dav might've been saying more that you were kinda overstating Rashid's wonderfulness, given that to date he's really not done all that much of any great note.

 

[superkingdave]

And that he's declared that there isn't anyone else in county cricket that has a chance of being a good test player in the future

 

[aussie]

Think dav might've been saying more that you were kinda overstating Rashid's wonderfulness, given that to date he's really not done all that much of any great note.

Well i wasn't overstating Rashid. Just stating ATM he is looking like he has the raw talent to become a good test spinner ATS. No way was i saying he is "top quality/great leg-spinner" that England have been longing for since Tich Freeman.

And that he's declared that there isn't anyone else in county cricket that has a chance of being a good test player in the future.

Ha, damn yo. You are way off today dave. I suggest you read what me & Richard have been discussing MORE CAREFULLY.