English ATG Team- Open Voting

[kyear2]

Will wait for Monk to make the final announcement, but for now the team looks to be.
Hobbs
Hutton
Hammond
Barrington
Compton
Botham
Knott
Larwood
Laker
Trueman
Barnes

If I can be honest, this team just looks weaker than the Aussie's and what the projected S.A and W.I. squads. Only one true ATG quickie and three true top tier ATG batsmen. Would still contend with the Pakistani squad for a place in the semi's.

 

[Eds]

Larwood surely an ATG, and the spin attack is excellent.

 

[kyear2]

We will agree to disagree on the Larwood issue and the only reason he even made it is because myself and others changed their votes for the sake of the team balance.

Both spinners are excellent, but both also especially excelled on wet or otherwise helpfull (matting) pitches. Verity I belive was better than both, especially considering the level of batsmen he faced.

 

[watson]

Will wait for Monk to make the final announcement, but for now the team looks to be.
Hobbs
Hutton
Hammond
Barrington
Compton
Botham
Knott
Larwood
Laker
Trueman
Barnes

If I can be honest, this team just looks weaker than the Aussie's and what the projected S.A and W.I. squads. Only one true ATG quickie and three true top tier ATG batsmen. Would still contend with the Pakistani squad for a place in the semi's.

By-and-large that's a very nice team.

 

[watson]

We will agree to disagree on the Larwood issue and the only reason he even made it is because myself and others changed their votes for the sake of the team balance.

Both spinners are excellent, but both also especially excelled on wet or otherwise helpfull (matting) pitches. Verity I belive was better than both, especially considering the level of batsmen he faced.

Larwood and Verity used to alternate between 8 and 9 because they were both good tail-end batsman. Therefore, Verity would have provided a little bit more batting depth. But overall Laker and Verity are neck-a-neck and both solid choices IMO.

Actually, I'd be interested to hear why PEWS has a certain amount of antipathy toward Verity.

 

[kyear2]

Was actually surprised when Underwood was choosen by cricinfo for the spinners spot over both.

 

[LongHopCassidy]

Larwood, IMO, has two tints of rose to every observer's spectacles. His signature series was Bodyline, which was a) romanticised to the point of analytical inaccuracy and b) distorted his stats with the advantage that leg-theory gave him. Without that series, his Test average blows up and his FC average cited to reaffirm his class is still emulated by the Rhodeses and Woolleys of his time.

Great bowler, who will be an eternal fixture of cricketing history. But in the hard reality of a simmed match, I'd rather have Statham or Snow at my back.

 

[kyear2]

Think that we can call this now, hope Monk doesn't mind.

C.W. England All Time XI

Sir Jack Hobbs
Sir Len Hutton *
Sir Walter Hammond
Denis Compton
Ken Barrington
Sir Ian Botham
Allan Knott +
Harold Larwood
Jim Laker
Fred Trueman
Syd Barnes

Hedley Verity

 

[Red]

Think that we can call this now, hope Monk doesn't mind.

C.W. England All Time XI

Sir Jack Hobbs
Sir Len Hutton *
Sir Walter Hammond
Denis Compton
Ken Barrington
Sir Ian Botham
Allan Knott +
Harold Larwood
Jim Laker
Fred Trueman
Syd Barnes

Hedley Verity

Fine with me mate. I'm in my yearly 3 week spell of space-cadet-ness

 

[kyear2]

Which team is next Monk?

 

[Red]

West Indies I reckon. Which should please you!

 

[Prince EWS]

Picking the West Indies team will be pretty complicated IMO. We should leave the openers till last I reckon.

 

[Red]

Picking the West Indies team will be pretty complicated IMO. We should leave the openers till last I reckon.

After the English one, I thought about possible changes. Will def do the bowlers as a unit of 4, then 4 middle order batsmen, 2 openers and a keeper. Why do you think openers last?

 

[Prince EWS]

After the English one, I thought about possible changes. Will def do the bowlers as a unit of 4, then 4 middle order batsmen, 2 openers and a keeper. Why do you think openers last?

Well keeper last would be fine too, but we should definitely pick the West Indian openers after we pick the middle order, because their middle order options are so much better than their opening options that people might want to shoehorn players. We won't know which players we should be considering shoehorning until the actual middle order is picked.

 

[kyear2]

The West Indies 11 is the easiest to choose to me, only two spots really up for consideration. Is the fourth bowler another fast bowler (Garner/ Roberts) or a spinner (Gibbs) and who partners Greenidge (Hunte/ Haynes/ Worrell). The middle order of Headley, Richards, Lara and Sobers is a lock and the best for any nation and the first three bowlers, Marshall, Ambrose and Holding are equally assured of their spots. Walcott is equally a lock for me and with this team his keeping load would be much less than when he kept for endless hours for Ramadin and Valentine.
Should be fun.

 

[The Sean]

Will wait for Monk to make the final announcement, but for now the team looks to be.
Hobbs
Hutton
Hammond
Barrington
Compton
Botham
Knott
Larwood
Laker
Trueman
Barnes

If I can be honest, this team just looks weaker than the Aussie's and what the projected S.A and W.I. squads. Only one true ATG quickie and three true top tier ATG batsmen. Would still contend with the Pakistani squad for a place in the semi's.

There's at least four top tier ATG batsmen there, potentially five depending on how highly one rates Barrington. I've never classified Barnes as a "spinner", more a medium-fast bowler who could spin the ball as well.

Looking at that England team and my projected line-ups for the other countries I think it's far more than just a "contender" for a semi-final spot:

- The opening combination is absolutely in a class of its own
- The 3-4-5 ranks at least equal with India's (Dravid-Tendulkar-Hazare/Vishy/Laxman) and behind only Australia and WI
- Botham as a matchwinner stands comparison with anyone
- Knotty belongs in the discussion of the best 'keepers of all time, and a more than handy bat
- Only Australia and Sri Lanka will field a better spinner

In fact the only element of the England side that I wouldn't place in the top two or three is the pace/medium-pace attack of Trueman-Larwood-Barnes-Botham, which I would rank fourth or fifth behind WI, Australia and Pakistan, and probably level with South Africa. And even then I think the gap is a ditch rather than a chasm.

Overall I'd back the England team to definitely make the semi-finals where they would probably - only probably, mind - lose to Australia or the West Indies, but then win the bronze medal play-off against whichever of South Africa or Pakistan got that far as well.

 

[Red]

I rate Barrington higher than most others. Very highly in fact. He has a reputation as a stone-waller, very slow bat, but in reality, he could bat as quick as most. Was very difficult to dismiss, and on top of all that he was a cracking team man.

In this team, with the likes of Compton and Botham, he is the perfect man to bat all day.

Could envisage him and Hammond having a massive partnership as well.

This is a serious batting line up. Best openers. Hammond and Barrington. Compton and Botham. Knott a very good batsman. Larwood capable.

500+ is a definite possibility if they bat first. And you don't lose many games from that position.