Does a ''real'' cricket fan have to hate LOI and/or consider them irrelevant?

[Jassy]

Sorry, but those are very good records, but far from gun - I was expecting 70+ averages when you said gun, especially as it is only going to be over a very small sample size.

I'd also call that ODI record pretty average. Maybe 5 years ago when he was in mid-career it would've looked better, but he's behind a stack of batsmen who I wouldn't say have very good records.

You clearly have very high standards if only a 70 plus average is ''gun''. Seems like a cop out to me, quite frankly. 50 and 55 are averages most batsmen would kill to have in places like SA and Aus . The sample size isn't particularly small; in Aus and SA combined, he averages 52.3 over 10 tests with 4 centuries and has scored almost 1000 runs.


If you think 8000 plus runs with a 38 average and 84 SR is a very average record, I really don't know who you rate. Would also like to see who these average players are that have better records than him. And I've not even mentioned his 150 plus wickets.....

 

[artvandalay]

Not sure how many people watched the T20 final today, but those who did must have seen how Jayawardene and Sangakkara broke down after the win. I've watched a fair amount of cricket and I'm sure they've never come close to reacting like that after a test win or any other win.

Does that mean T20>Tests or something? No. But what it does show is that we can no longer just ignore it by saying it is a useless mickey mouse format etc. Sure you might hold that view but if the players themselves attach so much importance to the format and such matches get bigger crowds than some recent marquee bilateral series, then you only end up looking stupid. Try telling Sangakkara and Jayawardene that T20 is just mickey mouse cricket.

I think this argument is neither here nor there personally. I've seen a lot of international stars look genuinely disappointed to lose meaningless domestic t20 and IPL, BBL matches. The adverse impact either victory or defeat on their emotional state is not something one should use in an argument to justify which format of cricket is more fulfilling and rewarding in general.

 

[G.I.Joe]

Confounding factor - Perhaps the Lankans didn't care for the T20 WC itself as much as the the USD 1.5 million bonus. #ka-ching

 

[Adders]

Sportsmen don't like losing - definitely agree there. They always give their best even in the BBLs and IPLs. What I was saying though is that no-one has ever seen Mahela and Sanga react the way they did yesterday, ever. As we're talking about two blokes who have scored about 40,000 test+ODI runs between them, you can safely say it clearly ranks very, very high on their priority list. I agree that different people have different priorities, it just grates a little when you have something like "oh that was just a mickey mouse tournament, no one cares, let's see in "real cricket'' constantly shoved down your throats and this coming from someone who prioritizes tests. I made a post on this earlier :

Whilst I'm not trying to diminish Sangakkara or Jayawardenes reaction to the win, that emotion must be put into context with their retirements from this form. When you play your last game for your country as we've seen many times before it is a very emotional event win or lose. Of course I'm not denying that emotion wasn't vastly heightened by winning a WC final though.

Both you and Jono have adopted this line of argument "see how much it means to the players, so it must be important" And it's not really working for me. Go and watch any park cricket or football grand final and you will see the same sorts of celebrations after a win.......it doesn't matter what the level, format or contest, when you get a team of players heavily invested in it, it will mean everything to them...........that alone doesn't make it important or significant in the grand scheme of things.

I think you've pretty much got it right with your list of importance of events for Aus (Eng the same of course) and India (all sub cont sides the same with the exception of India/Pak test series) so we pretty much agree here anyway. But you can see wild celebrations in your lowest ranked contest, the jam ODI's.......check out Australia's celebrations after James Faulkners heroics in the ODI game in Brisbane this summer.

 

[Jono]

Whilst I'm not trying to diminish Sangakkara or Jayawardenes reaction to the win, that emotion must be put into context with their retirements from this form. When you play your last game for your country as we've seen many times before it is a very emotional event win or lose. Of course I'm not denying that emotion wasn't vastly heightened by winning a WC final though.

Both you and Jono have adopted this line of argument "see how much it means to the players, so it must be important" And it's not really working for me. Go and watch any park cricket or football grand final and you will see the same sorts of celebrations after a win.......it doesn't matter what the level, format or contest, when you get a team of players heavily invested in it, it will mean everything to them...........that alone doesn't make it important or significant in the grand scheme of things.

I think you've pretty much got it right with your list of importance of events for Aus (Eng the same of course) and India (all sub cont sides the same with the exception of India/Pak test series) so we pretty much agree here anyway. But you can see wild celebrations in your lowest ranked contest, the jam ODI's.......check out Australia's celebrations after James Faulkners heroics in the ODI game in Brisbane this summer.

I don't agree with you Adders but you've made your argument well here. Raised some good points. Kudos.

 

[SteveNZ]

To me, the celebrations said the most about Jaya + Sangas pending retirements and parlous state of Sri Lankan cricket, and what it would mean to the fans, as opposed to any direct correlation about what format it was.

 

[Jono]

Well they won the Asia Cup the month before and the reactions were completely different.

 

[G.I.Joe]

Well they won the Asia Cup the month before and the reactions were completely different.

Asia Cup 2014 Winners Purse - $60,000
WT20 2014 SL Win Bonus - $1,500,000

 

[artvandalay]

Well they won the Asia Cup the month before and the reactions were completely different.

They celebrated harder after they won the game against us in the last over of that match in the Asia Cup than they did in the final. What do you have to say about that?

 

[fredfertang]

40+ years of masturbation experience, a valuable resource.

He is sadly long deceased now, but I used to have an uncle who was the archetypal Yorkshireman. He wasn't in any way unfriendly, but seldom said a word to me, or indeed anyone else - I learnt later that you got a sentence or two if you bought him a pint, but even then it was very little

So I was quite surprised when, on the occasion of my first wedding, he sidled up to me, stone cold sober, and said "son, a word of advice" - his words were "whatever you do lad, never forget how to ****" - time has proved him so right

Which is why, whatever banter I throw out at those from the wrong side of the Pennines occasionally, I never accuse them of "knowing nowt", 'cos despite appearances to the contrary they're wise bastards

 

[Jono]

They celebrated harder after they won the game against us in the last over of that match in the Asia Cup than they did in the final. What do you have to say about that?

Cool interrogation language, but you just said a statement that I disagree with.

 

[YorksLanka]

Asia Cup 2014 Winners Purse - $60,000
WT20 2014 SL Win Bonus - $1,500,000

trouble is our players have an ice cubes chance in hell of getting that money..people dont realise that our players dont play the country becuase of the money-if they did there wouldnt be anyone playing as they dont get paid their salaries consistently and what they do get from tournaments is hijacked by the board before it gets to them in its entirity.Our players represent our country due to an immense sense of pride(yes they get paid well compared to the average man) but i genuinely think that its not money that motivates as the driver for our lads. Getting back to the thread, i personally think its sill to discount ILO cricket over tests and i prefer the shorter form of the game..i find that only the ashes or SA v Aus interests me enough to watch tests and that's simply becuase i dont have enough time in my life to devote five full days to it..

 

[Maximas]

1.5 million is actually only 17% of what the board will earn as a result of Sri Lanka winning the tournament I think, I'm sure the board will offer it up but the players demanded 20% or something a bit higher before the tournament iirc. The reason players are so keen to get a good salary is because their careers as cricketers end before they turn 40, so obviously they want to set themselves up for life having given their best working years to cricket while trying to raise families and such, Jayasuria will hopefully stick up for the players again.

Sanga, MJ and the rest of the guys knew there was a great burden on them to finally win another world title, from themselves, the fans, everyone - that is why they were so happy to finally deliver, I remember the first test win in SA sparked similar celebrations from the players and I expect an ODI win would do the same, what it means to the players isn't always the same as the fans.

 

[Jono]

open top bus parade for the Lankans when they arrive home.

Sri Lanka Cricket News: Sri Lanka set for heroes' welcome | ESPN Cricinfo

 

[Adders]

I don't agree with you Adders but you've made your argument well here. Raised some good points. Kudos.

Thank you Jono I know you still haven't forgiven me for not listing you in the "Quality Victorian Posters" post I made a while back so it must have taken a bit for you to say that. I actually do think you are a quality poster but it doesn't seem "cool" to pay you any compliments around here..........and at the heart of it I'm just a shallow **** who just wants to fit in

Seriously though, despite not agreeing with me I think what it boils down to is that you want to see me pay more respect to T20 than I'm prepared to give because when it comes down to it I reckon you me and Jassy all agree roughly on how International cricket contests rank for importance. Something along the lines of what Jassy posted earlier.....

From an Aus/Eng POV:
1)Ashes
2)WC
3)Test series vs major sides
4)Champions trophy/World T20
5)jam ODIs

From an Indian/Sub Cont POV:

1)WC
2)Away test series vs major sides
3)India vs Pakistan any format
4)Test series vs major sides
5)Champions trophy/World t20
6)Asia Cup
7) jam ODIs.

I probably just think there is a bit more daylight between 3 and 4 in the first list and 4 and 5 in the second than you do.

 

[Prince EWS]

I actually do think you are a quality poster but it doesn't seem "cool" to pay you any compliments around here

Off topic obviously but I've come to the conclusion lately that this is really lame. Jono is straight up the best poster on the site (which coming from a right-wing New South Welshman really says something) and while ironically calling him a **** at every turn was funny for five minutes, it seems a shame to me that he's so unappreciated now.

 

[Dan]

Off topic obviously but I've come to the conclusion lately that this is really lame. Jono is straight up the best poster on the site (which coming from a right-wing New South Welshman really says something) and while ironically calling him a **** at every turn was funny for five minutes, it seems a shame to me that he's so unappreciated now.

Nah, he's appreciated. I give him **** but reckon he's an absolutely gun bloke and a fantastic poster. Pretty sure his presence in Wellington has converted me to the Church of Kohli too, tbh.

He won BOTM last year and is a short-priced favourite to go back-to-back. I think the forum appreciates him, even if they do give him ****.

 

[Adders]

Hey I don't make the cliques I'm just trying to join one of them

Nah look, I second everything both of you say and reckon Jono is a gun poster too....if i thought for a second that there was anything serious in the **** he cops I wouldn't go near it.

Perhaps Pews is right and it is getting old now?

 

[Daemon]

Off topic obviously but I've come to the conclusion lately that this is really lame. Jono is straight up the best poster on the site (which coming from a right-wing New South Welshman really says something) and while ironically calling him a **** at every turn was funny for five minutes, it seems a shame to me that he's so unappreciated now.

He won the last botm and is clearly on his way to finish in the top few this time as well. Everyone who has met him irl has only good things to say about him. Calling him a **** is great because it makes the rest of plebs feel like we're at his level and it keeps him in check, instead of our relationship with someone like *** where we constantly have to blow smoke up his arse and make him feel happy and superior so he doesn't leave the forum.

 

[Hurricane]

Hey I don't make the cliques I'm just trying to join one of them

Nah look, I second everything both of you say and reckon Jono is a gun poster too....if i thought for a second that there was anything serious in the **** he cops I wouldn't go near it.

Perhaps Pews is right and it is getting old now?

It was very funny 3 years ago when it was benchmark cracking the jokes and everyone else laughing at Jono's comebacks. If others joined in on making the jokes then I would say yes it would have been over done.

tl;dr version - leave it to the professionals folks.