Curtly Ambrose vs. Steve Waugh

[Jono]

Sorry 4th you're right. You have already started a thread on this though

Still, that Steve Waugh/Ambrose confrontation was certainly one of the most memorable sledging incidents that I remember.

 

[Richard]

Especially given that Ambrose rarely if ever got involved in that sort of thing normally.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Especially given that Ambrose rarely if ever got involved in that sort of thing normally.

He didn't? From the perspective of an Australian fan, he was pretty much renowned for it. Dean Jones 92/93 anyone?

 

[Richard]

Hardly "getting involved" - it was Jones who started it with that foolish request of his to take the wristbands off.
Ambrose, of course, used it to motivate himself.
But certainly the English perspective is epitomised by Michael Atherton here (penultimate paragraph).

 

[Top_Cat]

A nothing moment compared to the Waugh clip-down-the-leg of K Benjamin.

Actually it was a length-ball outside off-stump right in the zone where Waugh usually nicked them, he did and Courtney Browne dropped the sitter of sitters. Made an absolute meal of it.

He didn't? From the perspective of an Australian fan, he was pretty much renowned for it. Dean Jones 92/93 anyone?

Richard's right; Curtly generally didn't engage in verbals with the batsman. And even that Dean Jones one, Curtly said virtually nothing; Deano asked him to remove the wrist-band, Curtly had a VERY ticked-off look on his face and then bowled an immaculate length, taking 5-fer and barely breathing a word to the batsman. That was Curtly at his best; hostile but silent.

The only other time I can think of overt Curtly action was in the 1996 WACA test where Curtly bowled several deliberate front-foot no-balls in order to keep the over going, dishing up short-ball after short-ball at Warnie. Even when he took 7-fer against England when they were bowled out for 46, he was pretty much silent. Curtly losing it was a rare occurance.

 

[Jono]

That is a great article Richard. Really great read. Ta for the link.

 

[Richard]

Actually it was a length-ball outside off-stump right in the zone where Waugh usually nicked them, he did and Courtney Browne dropped the sitter of sitters. Made an absolute meal of it.

Really...? Wow, that CricInfo report was wrong.
Described it quite clearly as a glove down the leg.
I really must find some footage of that Test.

The only other time I can think of overt Curtly action was in the 1996 WACA test where Curtly bowled several deliberate front-foot no-balls in order to keep the over going, dishing up short-ball after short-ball at Warnie.

Aha... I was wondering why he bowled such an astonishingly excessive number of them in that Test.

 

[Richard]

That is a great article Richard. Really great read. Ta for the link.

Michael Atherton has written many, many fine pieces and will doubtless write many more.
Shame he's unlikely to ever attain a position where he could actually do some acting, unlike most ICC delegates.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Oh, no, not at all.
But there's absolutely no denying it was a pivotal moment, and like I say in the other thread - you know the saying about butterflies and earthquakes.
It's unlikely that had Browne taken the catch things would have carried on as they had been for the past 8 years, but it's not out of the question at all that things might have been different to how they are now.

Different, perhaps, but the result of that match has nothing to with the overall decline of West Indies cricket. Not in my mind. The roots are bad, thus the leaves are worse. Then there's the incompetent gardener.

 

[Richard]

Fact is, like I say, faith moves mountains.
I'm not in the Caribbean so I don't know whether it's the case or not. But unsuccessful teams breed lack of success, and so the vicious circle turns.
It has to start somewhere, though. For the last 8 years West Indies had staved it off.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Fact is, like I say, faith moves mountains.
I'm not in the Caribbean so I don't know whether it's the case or not. But unsuccessful teams breed lack of success, and so the vicious circle turns.
It has to start somewhere, though. For the last 8 years West Indies had staved it off.

Point, but there were definite signs of the inevitable fall. Quite the same, there are signs of an eventual Australian fall. It may not be in the very near future, but it will happen within the next 10 years, almost certainly.

Browne's dropped catch is more of an emotional turning point in terms of a person exercising hindsight. I don't think it had a severe impact at the time. It was all due to unravel and Browne's miss was just part of the script.

 

[Langeveldt]

Curtly losing it was a rare occurance.

Hmm, I think he is one of the few bowlers to have been removed from a bowling attack for bowling deliberate beamers.. I think it was at Dermot Reeve..

 

[Top_Cat]

Really...? Wow, that CricInfo report was wrong.
Described it quite clearly as a glove down the leg.
I really must find some footage of that Test.

I do have footage somewhere and I'd provide it if I wasn't breaking the law by doing so.

But yeah, unless there was another instance I don't know about. Certainly the famous one was outside off-stump, though.

Aha... I was wondering why he bowled such an astonishingly excessive number of them in that Test.

Yeah I remember it relatively well. I think the over was something like 13 balls. It was particularly mean because the pitch was nightmarish,

Hmm, I think he is one of the few bowlers to have been removed from a bowling attack for bowling deliberate beamers.. I think it was at Dermot Reeve..

I wouldn't doubt it but we're talking about frequency, not intensity. Curtly rarely lost it but when he did, someone's life was in danger, especially if they were foolish enough to have a piece of willow in their hands!

"Curtly doesn't sleep; he waits."

hehe

 

[Truekiwijoker]

You honestly believe that a dropped catch is the reason why the West Indies cricket team is rubbish right now? Or rather, you think a dropped catch accounts for the strength of the Australia team?

I wouldn't ever suggest that series loss is the cause of the current decline in the Windies.

But I remember the top team they had at the time seemed to suffer a real blow to their confidence, and they've never seemed the same since to me.

 

[Richard]

Point, but there were definite signs of the inevitable fall. Quite the same, there are signs of an eventual Australian fall. It may not be in the very near future, but it will happen within the next 10 years, almost certainly.

Well, fairly obviously. No dominance can ever last for ever.

Browne's dropped catch is more of an emotional turning point in terms of a person exercising hindsight. I don't think it had a severe impact at the time. It was all due to unravel and Browne's miss was just part of the script.

No, it was the centreline of the entire play. More than that, it was the most significant line of anything ever written by the playwright.
Like I say - it may not have kept West Indies on top of The World but I certainly think it had more significance than it has since been given credit for.