Craig Cumming - an explanation?

[Kent]

Has anyone seen John Bracewell attempt to justify this selection yet? (a link would be good if it's on the net).

Rather than reward any of the several promising young players who've already made runs this season, it seems he's after batsmen who play the ball late. As in "anything over 140 is a blur" late....

 

[Adamc]

Cricinfo had this to say: "the New Zealand selectors, headed by John Bracewell, picked Hamish Marshall, who was among the better performers on New Zealand's dismal tour to Pakistan, and Craig Cumming, who also did reasonably well there." I found this rather bizarre considering Cumming scored 58 runs in 5 matches. The most worrying thing for NZ is that they've just been beaten by a team renowned for unusual selection policies...

 

[Bazza]

Adam, Lara's not top any more.

 

[Adamc]

Adam, Lara's not top any more.

Mm right you are, just saw the new ratings. Ponting definitely deserves top spot on his current form, exceptional effort for him to be no. 1, especially considering that no.'s 2,3 and 4 (Lara Hayden Dravid) all had a great 2003 as well.

 

[Richard]

In the period 1993-2002, there had been four batsmen at the summit of the ratings:
SR Tendulkar, BC Lara, SR Waugh, and Inzamam-Ul-Haq (for less than 1 month).
Since October 2002, these (I think) have topped the rankings:
ML Hayden, R Dravid, BC Lara, SR Tendulkar, RT Ponting, MP Vaughan. There may even have been more.
I don't have the slightest clue how these rankings are supposed to work and I don't, frankly, care, because they have never seemed very consistent to me, but surely this is going too far?

 

[anzac]

In the period 1993-2002, there had been four batsmen at the summit of the ratings:
SR Tendulkar, BC Lara, SR Waugh, and Inzamam-Ul-Haq (for less than 1 month).
Since October 2002, these (I think) have topped the rankings:
ML Hayden, R Dravid, BC Lara, SR Tendulkar, RT Ponting, MP Vaughan. There may even have been more.
I don't have the slightest clue how these rankings are supposed to work and I don't, frankly, care, because they have never seemed very consistent to me, but surely this is going too far?

sort of like the old ATP rankings (when not dominated by Sampras or the Williams sisters etc) - do they rate them monthly & are they meant to represent current ratings since the last one, or season to date?????

 

[anzac]

Cumming's selection is predictable really when you think about it (although it may not last beyond the 2nd ODI)...even tho' Jones scored more runs at a higher average & RR and his domestic limited overs form also reflects a higher average!!!!!!

the reality is that domestic limited overs has not started yet so they do not have any current form to pick anyone else other than those already tried & Jones is considered a 'slower' player than Cummings in limited overs cricket.

with Vincent out they are really stretched so far as options go as they seem to be looking at a specialist opener rather than 'pinch hitter'.

as I've said b4 IMO they missed an opportunity in the last series to experiment with other options such as McCullum, which could have opened further opportunities re the middle order for another newbie to come in who is not a specialist opener........

 

[Kent]

The problem I have is that picking Cumming smacks of a cautious new coach going for a band-aid move, and not even much of a band-aid.

I look at it this way:

1) Does the batsman have a consistent record at domestic level?
2) Has he scored runs of late in any form of the game?
3) Could he be an investment for the future?
4) Has he looked comfortable at international level in the past?

With Cumming it's no, no, no and no. Had they gone for someone like Papps or McCullum, there would've been 2-3 ticks. Even a Nevin, a Richardson or a Ryder wouldn't translate to 4 unsightly crosses.

Cumming might score a 60-odd or something in one of these matches, but that doesn't mean I'll suddenly eat humble pie and say it was a good selection after all. A good innings or two doesn't make a new star, any more than say a round in the 60's makes a pro golfer.

 

[anzac]

Oh I agree with you on that one - I was just giving my opinion as to why they selected him, but as I said I don't think it will go much beyond the 2nd ODI unless he has a blinder......

Hell I even used points 2 - 4 as the basis as to why I would have selected Marshall rather than Cairns for the 1st Test squad - made me very unpopular with some......

 

[anzac]

I'm going to stick my neck out again here.......

what was Papps' glove work like? because I'm bemused by McCullum moving to Canterbury & taking over the 'keepers job. Not only that but McCullum is also opening the batting with Papps - talk about going head to head!

if Papps was as good as the rest in domestic comp I'd suggest he may be an outside alternative re the opening spot at the expense of Hart & McCullum. He's aged mid 20s & his averages in First Class & Limited Overs is no worse than the likes of Jones & Cumming.

I know it would be a rough call to do so but IMO the opening spot is a BIG priority. Even if his glove work wasn't measurably better than either of the incumbants' I'd still go with him if he worked as an opener.

I also see than Nevin scored 80 today in a Limited Overs match v Pakistan (minus Ahktar & Sami).

 

[Kent]

From the small amounts I've seen, Papps is a decent keeper. I'll go with ANYONE if they work as a one-day opener though, whether they prefer gloves or a deck chair!

Hopefully we'll all look back on this time as the awkward "pre-Ryder" years. He'll then be a pioneer for polynesian batting, sparking a Windies-like revolution in the NZ game. "Cumming? Who was Cumming? Jesse was coming." - says a husky-voiced narrator.

No pressure or anything...

Quite a smart strategy of McCullum to move to Canterbury as it's turned out, keeping Papps at bay. To think I read in a sports gossip column that the move was driven by his liking for the casino!

 

[anzac]

From the small amounts I've seen, Papps is a decent keeper. I'll go with ANYONE if they work as a one-day opener though, whether they prefer gloves or a deck chair!

Hopefully we'll all look back on this time as the awkward "pre-Ryder" years. He'll then be a pioneer for polynesian batting, sparking a Windies-like revolution in the NZ game. "Cumming? Who was Cumming? Jesse was coming." - says a husky-voiced narrator.

No pressure or anything...

Quite a smart strategy of McCullum to move to Canterbury as it's turned out, keeping Papps at bay. To think I read in a sports gossip column that the move was driven by his liking for the casino!

if he's a decent glove man then I'm deadly serious that the selectors should consider him as 'keeper & opener for both the Test & ODI sides, or at least do an Alec Stewart & consider him for opener to start with.......what kind of a batsman is he - defensive / moderate / attacking?

his corresponding averages for F/C & Limited Overs are on a par or better than those for Vincent, Jones & Cumming as openers, and Hart & McCullum as 'keepers, yet in most cases he has played less matches than the others. His stats re 50s & 100s & conversion rates is as good as the others as well......

It may be too soon for this ODI series but there is no coverage for Hart v RSA if Vincent & Sinclair do not get picked unless they pick McCullum for the squad - IMO Papps presents better options at this point, esp as the leading run scorer with Fulton.

I thought Andre Adams was starting the NZ / WIndies revolution (as he has a head start re his parentage)........

McCullum has made a very shrewd move for a 22 yr old - esp to take on the opening role as well where he had been matching Papps until the last innings ..... mind you it can also back fire on him ......

8D

 

[anzac]

just thought of another reason/s to give Papps a go.....

if successful as an opener / 'keeper in both forms of the game, he then replaces 5 players in Vincent, Jones & Hart in the Test team / squad, and Cumming, Vincent & McCullum in the ODI team / squad.....

this then gives the selectors a further 4 players / options they can look at & basically another batting position becomes vacant to further strengthen the lineups / introduce new blood etc.....

8D

 

[Kent]

I think one fringe Black Cap is all we can really ask of NZ's West Indian community. Polynesians, Indians and white folk (aside from the 300,000 or so in Canterbury) all get a 'could do better' rating.

I like your idea about Papps halting the merry-go-round in both tests and ODIs, but until they give him a go under pressure it's very hard to judge whether his glovework is up to international standard. Still, they gave Vincent a turn, and not exactly in some Bank Alfala Cup either!

As for Papps' batting style, I think I described him as an 'Academy prude' in my summary on here a few weeks back. Very organised, set-hinge backlift, shuffles across his stumps as the bowler hits the crease. Not stylish, but not strokeless either. In contrast, Jesse Ryder has very fast hands and I think looks a great natural talent. I wouldn't expect him to score too heavily at domestic level though unless he gets on good tracks. We don't treat the '6 over point' types too well in NZ sadly.

 

[Adamc]

For whatever ability Cumming may or may not have, it doesn't help his cause when he runs himself out for 1.

 

[Kent]

Rack up another ton for Papps.
http://www.nzcricket.co.nz/fullscorecard.aspx?match=002

Lucky there are some 'A' fixtures this summer, because I get the feeling he'll only need to stay awake to score plenty more f/c runs against the likes of Hitchcock and Barnes.

Other games:

CD v. Otago - http://www.nzcricket.co.nz/fullscorecard.aspx?match=006

ND v. Well. - http://www.nzcricket.co.nz/fullscorecard.aspx?match=003

 

[Tim]

It was fairly predictable that Bracewell was going to pick either Cumming or Jones as an opener...otherwise taking them to Pakistan was a big waste of time.

Jones showed that although he got score runs, he batted far too slowly so therefore the other option was Cumming & although he scored few runs, he did play a few shots that may have had Bracewell thinking that he could become good.

Jesse Ryder hasn't been playing for C.D for their last 2 matches so he was out of the running, but if Cumming can't get going in these 5 ODI's v Pakistan then Ryder could come into the calculations PROVIDING he scores some runs for C.D in the State Shield.

The State Shield hasn't begun yet so we haven't been able to gauge who could open for NZ but I don't think there is anyone anyway...Papps, McIntosh & Fulton have great FC records but their OD records leave alot to be desired..I presume Cumming got the nod ahead of all of them because he's got quite a number of years behind him.

And Cumming didn't run himself out!, Fleming admitted after the game that he made the mistake..it was a a touch & go run that was Flemings call & he really didn't do Craig any favours today for his future in ODI cricket.

 

[marc71178]

And Cumming didn't run himself out!, Fleming admitted after the game that he made the mistake..it was a a touch & go run that was Flemings call & he really didn't do Craig any favours today for his future in ODI cricket.

It would be harsh for them to discount on one knock though.

 

[Tim]

well I obviously agree with that..but I'd say Craig won't have too many chances to impress the selectors before he's shown the door..so really his captain didn't help his cause too much.

 

[Kent]

Flem may have actually done Cumming's fortunes a favour at least in one sense, seeing once again Eden Park presented itself as a terrible cricket ground with a pitch to match! Seeing it made most of the quality batsman look pretty awful all day, what could it have done to Cumming's game and confidence?

I don't want to be a misery guts because I did enjoy the game more than "Lawry's Lament" on SS2, but it was fitting that NZ's favourite pig dog won the game with plenty of lofted smears and ugly missed pulls. Still a pugnacious effort from Styris, & excellent Dean Jones-like moxie from McCullum.

Btw Tim - when are the NZ 'A' games, do you know?