Building Indian team for the 2007 world cup

[TIF]

Damn, now I have the whole AAAS after me, and a curse on me as well.

Anyway I'm beginning to think RP Singh is heavily underrated by some Indian supporters. There's all this talk about Sreesanth, Munaf Patel and VR Singh, which is fine as they are young fast bowlers with decent pace, and then there are discussions about whether Zaheer and/or AA deserve to stay in the team. Well RP Singh has done absolutely nothing wrong in his limited opportunities playing for the Indian ODI team, and I don't even understand why he was left out of the first 2 ODIs against Pakistan with AA and Zaheer ahead of him.

Right now I reckon the bext XI (with a fully fit Harbhajan) is:

1.Sehwag
2.Tendulkar
3.Dravid/Kaif
4.Dravid/Kaif
5.Yuvraj
6.Dhoni
7.Pathan
8.Harbhajan
9.RP Singh
10.AA/Zaheer/Sreesanth/Munaf Patel/VR Singh (If AA or Zaheer they bat higher than RP Singh I guess)
11.AA/Zaheer/Sreesanth/Munaf Patel/VR Singh (If AA or Zaheer they bat higher than RP Singh I guess)
Super-Sub: Suresh Raina or Ramesh Powar (However if Harbhajan isn't fit I'd probably play him in the XI. India going in without a specialist spinner just isn't India )

RP Singh is definitely under-rated. He has the ability to produce a bit of reverse-swing if the conditions support swing and also, he is a aggressive bowler and looks like picking up wickets on his own. RP Singh, is also a tearaway pace bowler and has the ability to consistently bowl in the 140s, but the reason why RP Singh doesnt bowl in the 140s is due to having more control so that he can bowl more line and length balls than wayward 140 kph+ balls. When RP Singh came on around 2003/04, he was a tearaway pacer then and alongwith Munaf Patel and S Sree Santh, was known as one of 3 big Indian pace hopes with tearaway pace.

Agarkar does not deserve to be in the team at all costs. He is highly over-rated. Look at earlier posts made by me and Arjun to know about it.

 

[TIF]

Agreed.

There has to be ONE bowler in India who can consistantly bowl 145+. In a country of 1 billion people, I am at a loss for an explanation at our frontline bowlers not topping 130 on a good day.


And don't even get me started on Pathan, he has been taking wickets the last two ODI's but his speed has been in the 120's. PATHAN, YOU ARE NOT SAURAV GANGULY. PLEASE STOP TRYING TO DUPLICATE HIS PACE.

When, when, when will people understand that tearaway pace bowling isnt everything. Its the wicket-taking ability and ability to stop the run-flow by bowling unplayable deliveries is what matters in cricket. Even if India has a bowler with a ability to bowl at 150+ kph, however he bowls at 140+ kph, then its fine. In Australia and South Africa, in conditions supporting pace bowling, the Indians do tend to increase their pace by around 5-10 kph and so a bowler bowling at around 140 kph in India, will bowl at around 145-150 kph in Australia/South Africa.

The recent example was Sree Santh, who was getting hammered for runs when trying to bowl at 140-145 kph, but when he cut down on his pace a bit to get a line and length, it became difficult to score runs off him in the recent ODIs against Pakistan.

 

[TIF]

As for the Indian XI with all players being fully-fit and available -

Sehwag
Tendulkar
Kaif - Better suited to no.3 with his style of batting than at no.5 or 6 as he is more of a Dravid type player in batting and rarely plays the big shots. He is a quick-runner between the wickets and is the type of player needed to get things moving after the initial 15-20 overs with power-plays off and the field spread.
Dravid
Yuvraj - In the form of his life and looking impossible to get out. Also, is a big-hitter and a sweet timer of the ball. On his day, he can demolish any bowling attack. Will be more useful at no.5 or 6 than at the top of the order.
Dhoni (w)
Pathan - Might be sent up at no.3 if the need occurs to get the quick runs.
A bowler with big-hitting ability
Harbhajan
RP Singh
A tearaway pace bowler

 

[silentstriker]

When, when, when will people understand that tearaway pace bowling isnt everything. Its the wicket-taking ability and ability to stop the run-flow by bowling unplayable deliveries is what matters in cricket. Even if India has a bowler with a ability to bowl at 150+ kph, however he bowls at 140+ kph, then its fine. In Australia and South Africa, in conditions supporting pace bowling, the Indians do tend to increase their pace by around 5-10 kph and so a bowler bowling at around 140 kph in India, will bowl at around 145-150 kph in Australia/South Africa.

The recent example was Sree Santh, who was getting hammered for runs when trying to bowl at 140-145 kph, but when he cut down on his pace a bit to get a line and length, it became difficult to score runs off him in the recent ODIs against Pakistan.

Out and out pace can never be dismissed.

The problem India has is that we have rubbish being bowled at 130 kph. If we have a choice between rubbish at 150 and rubbish at 130, I'll take the speed.

 

[viktor]

Honestly, you don't expect him to suddenly turn into someone world-class after five years of luckily average performances, do you? You can replace him with some young reserve and you won't miss much.

don't mind me ...please carry on..this is getting funnier and funnier!!!!

 

[krishneelz]

This is my team out of the blue

1. Ganguly - The man had the best time in his life when he was opening and even if we lose him its no real big loss like losing a tendulkar. He only really struggles against australia in one dayers. The only place india would lose out would be in his feilding and running between wickets and thats where the next batsman is important

2. Sehwag - Good between wickets so ganguly needs to just listen to him. With this combination we could have the next jayasuria and kalu combination which done it for the lankans. Really should play his natural game and go after the bowling

3. Tendulkar - not his best position at 3 as history suggests but if we lose ganguly or sehwag he is the ideal man to come in and continue the good work towards a good total as he has a good strike rate i think its around 86

4. Dravid - If we get a horrible start he can come in and consolidate. But sehwag tendulkar and ganguly should survive the first 20 overs including the powerplay with a good run rate. If we get off to a good start then its not too bad as dravid can hit a few too.

5. Yuvraj - So we have lost three wickets and if we are doing good he is the perfect man to come in but if we are in trouble he still is the perfect man to come in as he has won matches for us. A real matchwinner at times can lift the run rate.

6. Dhoni - can break lose with yuvraj and destroy attacks. If we are in trouble bring in kaif as a supersub for one of our bowlers and relegate dhoni to number 7

7. Pathan - can hit hard and over the top but selectors shouldnt go over the top and stick him in at 3 because we have enough fire power in the top order

8. open for anyone who puts in good performences v pak and england

9. Kumble - option between 20 - 40

10. Harbajan - good economy good option in overs 20 - 40

11. RP Singh - looks good so far

 

[kvemuri]

I cant understand this meaning of the "AAAS" we have here. Agarkar, is not good enough to be a fast-bowler as he is weakly built. Agarkar, would have been better off if he had tried to become a batsman early on in his career. Agarkar, as a bowler is very inconsistent.

Agarkar as a player is useless, he is ineffective and his inconsistency is not from match to match its from over to over, in fact worse yet its from ball to ball. A man considered to be "once in every 16 matches performer" by a retired Ranatunga, i can only imagine how much fear or terror he must have created in a Ranatunga led team. IMO AA has gotten more chances then maybe Ravi Shastri in Indian cricket and its beyond time he is let go and replaced by someone younger.

 

[Arjun]

Now Dinesh Mongia is trying to return to the Indian side as an all-rounder. Please NO!!! There are more effective options at hand, especially Munaf Patel and Pravin Kumar, and also Ramesh Powar and Yusuf Pathan, all of whom are practising all-rounders, unlike one Punjab batsman who's taken to bowling regularly at a later stage in his career just to return to the national side.

 

[adharcric]

Now Dinesh Mongia is trying to return to the Indian side as an all-rounder. Please NO!!! There are more effective options at hand, especially Munaf Patel and Pravin Kumar, and also Ramesh Powar and Yusuf Pathan, all of whom are practising all-rounders, unlike one Punjab batsman who's taken to bowling regularly at a later stage in his career just to return to the national side.

Ganguly used this cheap trick too, except he succeeded (sort of). Poor Mongia.

 

[adharcric]

Speaking of Pravin Kumar, I'm really looking forward to him playing in a bigger series like the Challenger Series so more information can come out regarding his bowling speed. He's been both dangerous and economical so far.

 

[Arjun]

Speaking of Pravin Kumar, I'm really looking forward to him playing in a bigger series like the Challenger Series so more information can come out regarding his bowling speed. He's been both dangerous and economical so far.

His bowling speed shouldn't matter much, if we're only looking at ODI's. He's not very economical, going for 3 an over in first-class matches, but he's been taking a bagful of wickets. If he's got adequate variations in his bowling, he'll be just right. Even if the pace is missing, if he's as aggressive as a Shoaib Akhtar or Brett Lee or especially Andre Nel, he'll fit in nicely. He seems a freakish, risk-taking batsman, but hopefully he'll last longer than Irfan Pathan while batting. His appetite for the big hits has been effective in the Ranji trophy, and has raised his strike rate over 80. He's got a better batting and bowling record than one Munaf Patel, who's supposedly the fastest bowler in India. Even if the Indian team only has an aggressive, 'battering-ram' seam bowler at decent pace, that will add some variety and power to the attack and complement Irfan's swing and RP Singh's lateral movement well. If he looks a genuine strike bowler, a Test berth shouldn't be far.

 

[honestbharani]

You can remove the curse by a week of singing the great one's praises...

Actually, Marc, Jono should be GLAD to be able to do that. That is not even a punishment. It is like being paid to watch cricket.

 

[TIF]

Seeing the amount of some players playing in the u-19 world cup being aged 19 years and a few days and with Pravin Kumar, falling in this category, I believe Pravin Kumar, was eligible for u-19 World cup selection this year and should have played over there. If Pravin Kumar had played there, some more information about his bowling speed could have arrived. But then, he became a contender for selection only after the Ranji trophy semi-finals and improving a case for himself after the final and the u-19 world cup squad was announced well before the Ranji trophy finals started.

 

[marc71178]

Now Dinesh Mongia is trying to return to the Indian side as an all-rounder. Please NO!!! There are more effective options at hand, especially Munaf Patel and Pravin Kumar, and also Ramesh Powar and Yusuf Pathan, all of whom are practising all-rounders, unlike one Punjab batsman who's taken to bowling regularly at a later stage in his career just to return to the national side.

Some of those are bowlers who are lower order hitters - how is that any different to what you've just said about Mongia?

 

[adharcric]

Some of those are bowlers who are lower order hitters - how is that any different to what you've just said about Mongia?

He's trying to say that those guys are naturals who have always batted AND bowled, but that Mongia is just doing it lately to force his way back into the squad. How else should he do it though? Can't really blame the guy for adding to his game (or showing that he can) to get back in the team.

 

[Jungle Jumbo]

Now Dinesh Mongia is trying to return to the Indian side as an all-rounder. Please NO!!! There are more effective options at hand, especially Munaf Patel and Pravin Kumar, and also Ramesh Powar and Yusuf Pathan, all of whom are practising all-rounders, unlike one Punjab batsman who's taken to bowling regularly at a later stage in his career just to return to the national side.

I personally rate Mongia as a containing spinner in ODIs. He has aone of the best economy rates in Twenty20, bowls with clever flight and changes of pace. I wouldn't say he is bowling SLA to get back into the national side - he bowled enough up at Lancashire. Should India have real injury/form problems before the World Cup, then he'd be my spare experienced batsman - plus he's a 'value-added' player .

Anyway, how can you compare him to Powar/Pathan/Kumar/Munaf - Mongia is batsman who bowls, not a bowler who bats. Just because these big-hitters are smashing domestic attacks, they could well be found out by decent international bowlers. Play them for their bowling, not their batting, otherwise you'll end up with a team of bit-part players.

 

[Arjun]

I personally rate Mongia as a containing spinner in ODIs. He has aone of the best economy rates in Twenty20, bowls with clever flight and changes of pace. I wouldn't say he is bowling SLA to get back into the national side - he bowled enough up at Lancashire. Should India have real injury/form problems before the World Cup, then he'd be my spare experienced batsman - plus he's a 'value-added' player .

Anyway, how can you compare him to Powar/Pathan/Kumar/Munaf - Mongia is batsman who bowls, not a bowler who bats. Just because these big-hitters are smashing domestic attacks, they could well be found out by decent international bowlers. Play them for their bowling, not their batting, otherwise you'll end up with a team of bit-part players.

Mongia would be lucky to 'contain' ay batting side for less than six an over, and even more lucky to pick up a wicket. He's a Sachin Tendulkar type of bowler, and in this Indian side, there's one too many, and none are of much use. The Indian team needs stock bowlers, not bits-and-pieces pie chuckers who can bat a bit. We don't know how Munaf, Powar, Yusuf and Kumar will perform at the top level, but we know they have something none of the seven or eight specialist batsmen have– the big shots. They're worth the risk taken to play them in the side. Besides, Mongia is a slow scorer who hasn't done much of note at the top level, and given his style of batting, he's a misfit in ODI's.

 

[Jono]

How on Earth do none of the seven or eight specialist batsmen in the Indian team not have big shots? The only player that struggles to slap it around late in the innings is Kaif, even Dravid has greatly improved at that aspect of his game and there are plenty of innings in the past 2 years to prove that. Dhoni, Yuvraj, Sehwag, Tendulkar all have the big shots.

Look I'm not denying that a Patel or Powar or whomever wouldn't be a useful addition to the Indian team, but stop acting like the current line-up has a similar situation to Sri Lanka in that we have no hitting ability. There is plenty, bundles of it.

 

[TIF]

Mongia would be lucky to 'contain' ay batting side for less than six an over, and even more lucky to pick up a wicket. He's a Sachin Tendulkar type of bowler, and in this Indian side, there's one too many, and none are of much use. The Indian team needs stock bowlers, not bits-and-pieces pie chuckers who can bat a bit. We don't know how Munaf, Powar, Yusuf and Kumar will perform at the top level, but we know they have something none of the seven or eight specialist batsmen have– the big shots. They're worth the risk taken to play them in the side. Besides, Mongia is a slow scorer who hasn't done much of note at the top level, and given his style of batting, he's a misfit in ODI's.

Arjun, have you forgotten about players like Sehwag, Dhoni and Yuvraj. Agreed that tendulkar doesnt go after the big-shots now, but then Sehwag is a free-flowing batsman and can hit the 6s if required. Yuvraj, also is a player who likes to score his runs in big-shots and is a sweet timer of the ball as well and everyone knows about Dhonis big-hitting ability.

 

[Jungle Jumbo]

Mongia would be lucky to 'contain' ay batting side for less than six an over, and even more lucky to pick up a wicket. He's a Sachin Tendulkar type of bowler, and in this Indian side, there's one too many, and none are of much use. The Indian team needs stock bowlers, not bits-and-pieces pie chuckers who can bat a bit. We don't know how Munaf, Powar, Yusuf and Kumar will perform at the top level, but we know they have something none of the seven or eight specialist batsmen have– the big shots. They're worth the risk taken to play them in the side. Besides, Mongia is a slow scorer who hasn't done much of note at the top level, and given his style of batting, he's a misfit in ODI's.

I wouldn't be too critical of Mongia's bowling... face the stats:

class mat balls runs wkts bbi bbm ave econ sr 4 5 10
ODIs 51 400 370 8 3/31 3/31 46.25 5.54 50.00 0 0 0
First-class 107 2794 1194 37 4/34 32.27 2.56 75.51 0 0
List A 166 2822 2154 81 4/12 4/12 26.59 4.57 34.83 4 0 0
Twenty20 14 252 233 18 3/19 3/19 12.94 5.54 14.00 0 0 0