Australia's ODI overhaul in the leadup to the 2019 WC

[NUFAN]

I was trying to build this type of convo in the road to world cup thread, this is better btw.

First of all, full credit to Finch. I was thinking he was a chance of missing out on World cup selection and if he and Warner switched performances this current series there prob would be talk to axe Finch.

Certainties：Finch Warner Smith Starc Hazlewood

Almost Certain：Cummins Marsh Stoinis

We need：a batsman, keeper, spinner.

Possibles：
Maxwell Head Khawaja Lynn
Carey Paine Bancroft
Lyon Zampa Agar

If the almost certain players （cummins, marsh, stoinis）lose form other possibilities：

Richardson Coulter-Nile and maybe Stanlake come into contention. I dont think other allrounders such as Henriques or Faulkner will be considered.

So with that my Aussie team and squad for the World Cup

1 A Finch
2 D Warner
3 G Maxwell
4 S Smith
5 M Marsh
6 M Stoinis
7 A Carey
8 P Cummins
9 M Starc
10 N Lyon
11 J Hazlewood

Bancroft Coulter-Nile/Richardson* Agar and Khawaja

*NCN if 100% fit, he might actually play ahead of cummins too.

 

[Red]

Here's what I'd pick for the 2019 15 man squad:

Aaron Finch
Dave Warner
Darcy Short
Steve Smith
Glenn Maxwell
Marcus Stoinis
Mitch Marsh/Ashton Agar
Alex Carey +
Pat Cummins
Mitch Starc
Josh Hazelwood

Cam Bancroft - Mitch Marsh/Ashton Agar - NCN (Jhye Richardson if he is not fit) - Chris Lynn

Carey to keep in shorter form and Paine in tests from here on.

Bancroft there for keeping cover as much as batting.

Relying on Short and Maxwell to take the spinning role between them. Think it's feasible. Agar can play if we really want an extra spinner. Torn on Lyon as I want him in the team but I think this is better balanced.

Think Richardson is a genuine exciting prospect.

Bowling from Starc, Haze, Cummins, Stoinis, Marsh/Agar, Short and Maxwell should be plenty.

 

[mr_mister]

Interesting to read Glenn Maxwell (who’s been called back to the squad as cover for the injured Finch) call out Australia’s outdated ODI batting tactics this series. Few who’ve watched this series would disagree with this assertion but it’s really shown up by the career SR of the batsmen of each side.

All of the English top 8 have Strike Rates above 85 (multiple have above 100) and only Root & Morgan are below 90. Contrast that with Australia bringing back Cameron White who has a career Strike Rate of 80 and Tim Paine who has a 1990s style Strike Rate of just under 70. Even Steve Smith’s career Strike Rate is lower than all of the English Top 8.

When they bring back White & Paine and drop Maxwell (average over 30 and SR of over 120) is it any wonder Australia’s ODI style has looked outdated this series? If they learn anything from this series, it's that Australia need to factor in SR (as opposed to averages) in batting selection much more than they have previously.

bit rough to criticise White's SR, 80 was pretty good 10 years ago when he did most of his international cricket

 

[NUFAN]

@redhill I should have included Short in the mix. He wouldnt make my squad though.

 

[S.Kennedy]

not really. we seem to be credited with it, but basically mccullum had that license and guptill, kane, taylor, elliott ensured we got to 150/2 or 3 at the 35th. then everyone had the license to go nuts.

we still have that style. guptill and munro go for it up top and kane and taylor make sure we get to the death with wickets in hand

bowling is actually where we went all in with the brave tactic. mccullum removed the danger of the death overs by spamming boult, southee and friends to ensure the oppo were dead by the 30th. if anything was left able to hold a bat, adam milne the 150kph gavin larsen and jammy left arm bounce from anderson ensured only good death hitters would have a chance of salvaging the situation.

australia won the world cup because james faulkner went bang bang bang with the ball after elliott recovered nz to 150/3 just as happy hour arrived. we had been cruising through on the power of our top and middle order all world cup and once faulkner removed it ronchi and co. weren't up to it. australia also had 150kph swinging yorkers in hand so faulkner getting the wickets first really killed nz.

but the mainstream cheap narrative is nz inventing the idea of slogging for 50 overs regardless of situation and then starc won the world cup in the first over by bowling out the only bloke who was allowed to get out slogging early.

That is what the English say. I do not really follow one-day cricket that closely so I wouldn't know but that is the saying here: they are generous in placing it at the Kiwi's door. It is probably a combination of factors really.

 

[Spikey]

His batting is no longer at the level required for him to fill the all rounder role. Stoinis has more than adequately replaced him.

which is weird because his role in the team was as a bowling all-rounder expected to bowl upwards of 7 overs, but his bowling wasn't really good enough (average of 31) and his batting was keeping him into the team going into the 2015 WC where he performed far above his career performances with the ball, and now his bowling has resumed to his pre WC levels and his batting performances have been what you should expect from the 7/8 in ODI cricket, which is to say "not much", and now he finds himself out of the team, replaced by a clear batting all-rounder. I'm not sad about it, I wanted him dropped back then, but it's a bit weird.

 

[quincywagstaff]

One takeaway from this series is how Australia handle their main pace trio of Starc/Hazlewood/Cummins as I reckon they're effectively 3 new-ball bowlers competing for two spots.

I don't think Cummins really works as a first-change ODI bowler; he's had a poor record for 12 months in that role as he doesn't seem to have the tricks required to be effective there. But as a new ball bowler in Adelaide he looked completely different as it brought the best out of him as instead of just banging it in short he used the new ball to great effectiveness.

Can't really see them moving Starc away from new-ball duties (although his effectiveness has declined a fair bit post-WC 15) and while Hazlewood could work as a first-change bowler, his record as a new-ball ODI bowler is pretty impressive and a Starc/Cummins opening attack is a high-risk one.

 

[vic_orthdox]

There's no way that Australia will not play the three quicks in England at the WC if fit. Carey at 8 is a bit low in one of the suggested teams earlier. I think that's why Agar might be in their thoughts ahead of Lyon - having him/Cummins/Starc at 8-10 allows more freedom for the top order.

 

[burr]

I wonder if Smith's focus on changing the tempo of his test batting to avoid the collapses has effected his short-form batting. Or maybe he's just out of form. Interesting to see how he performs in the IPL - whatever team has him they're probably regretting it.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Australia just need (a) Warner and Smith to score some runs, (b) Starc to be more economical - he'll always take wickets, and (c) to find a decent spinner

 

[Gob]

I wonder if Smith's focus on changing the tempo of his test batting to avoid the collapses has effected his short-form batting. Or maybe he's just out of form. Interesting to see how he performs in the IPL - whatever team has him they're probably regretting it.

He is using his ODI run quota for tests.

 

[Gob]

On more serious note similar thing happened to Mick Clarke circa 2010. Wonderful in tests but couldn't hit the ball out of the square in ODERS

 

[stephen]

I wonder how much of Starc's form is related to him playing under Smith instead of Clarke.

We only really started losing after Clarke's retirement.

 

[TheJediBrah]

All this talk of an "overhaul" and the biggest issue this series for Aus has been Smith & Warner not making runs. 2 of the guys whose position is probably not in any doubt regardless of any overhaul.

Ironic really.

 

[Furball]

All this talk of an "overhaul" and the biggest issue this series for Aus has been Smith & Warner not making runs. 2 of the guys whose position is probably not in any doubt regardless of any overhaul.

Ironic really.

The rest of your batting line up is ****ing crap.

 

[stephen]

The rest of your batting line up is ****ing crap.

Not really. Stoinis, Marsh, Finch have all been very good.

 

[stephen]

One takeaway from this series is how Australia handle their main pace trio of Starc/Hazlewood/Cummins as I reckon they're effectively 3 new-ball bowlers competing for two spots.

I don't think Cummins really works as a first-change ODI bowler; he's had a poor record for 12 months in that role as he doesn't seem to have the tricks required to be effective there. But as a new ball bowler in Adelaide he looked completely different as it brought the best out of him as instead of just banging it in short he used the new ball to great effectiveness.

Can't really see them moving Starc away from new-ball duties (although his effectiveness has declined a fair bit post-WC 15) and while Hazlewood could work as a first-change bowler, his record as a new-ball ODI bowler is pretty impressive and a Starc/Cummins opening attack is a high-risk one.

Maybe we should go with 2/3 over spells for Starc and give Cummins a nice long 7 over spell after Starc's initial burst. With Hazlewood at the other end bowling a 6 over spell we can get through the first 20 or so overs with these three before bringing on the part timers/spinners.

 

[TheJediBrah]

The rest of your batting line up is ****ing crap.

your posting has been ****ing crap lately

you even actually follow what happens in the cricket?

 

[Red]

Is the general modus operandi in ODIs now to just have batsmen who can blast the ball all the way thru?

Or is there still room for someone to anchor the innings?

If it's the first we'd be better off saving Smith for tests only, if it's the second Smith's poor form in the series let us down.

 

[Burgey]

I think you still someone to fill the latter role in the event of a collapse, but that player needs to go a run a ball when the going is good. Agree tpc’s form was very poor this series. Warner too.