Australian test selection 2020/21

[Dan]

Yeah batting shootouts are dumb; it's 'pick The Man In Form' taken to the most absurd extension.

 

[mr_mister]

It's now almost 9 years since:

It was November 2011 when 18-year-old Patterson rewrote history as the youngest batter to score a Shield century. His 157 on debut contributed to NSW's six-wicket win over Western Australia in Sydney.

Patterson, Pucovski, Maddinson, Australia seem to be wasting a generation of batting talent

And not only has he never again topped that score in FC he's only got 8 tons total in 71 games

Patterson and Maxwell have super similar shield stats. But Patterson being overlooked is some injustice while Maxi never getting a home test is just eh

 

[Spikey]

the main problem with Bancroft's recall is that they had, fundamentally, made a decision that Bancroft was better than Harris. I don't have a problem with that, I'm not a full time selector who has a range of numbers and game tapes to help make decisions. (of course, I highly doubt any of the selectors take advantage of the resources they have available)

But then 2 games later they decided Harris is a better bet.

 

[BoyBrumby]

the main problem with Bancroft's recall is that they had, fundamentally, made a decision that Bancroft was better than Harris. I don't have a problem with that, I'm not a full time selector who has a range of numbers and game tapes to help make decisions. (of course, I highly doubt any of the selectors take advantage of the resources they have available)

But then 2 games later they decided Harris is a better bet.

Yeah, I didn't object to it from my high horse; if he was clearly better than the alternatives (as Smith and Warner obviously are), then happy days.

What makes it look slightly funky is that, from the outside looking in, he didn't appear to be.

If there are two blokes of broadly similar abilities (assumed for the sake of argument and brevity) it looks a bit of a "**** you all" call to go with the one who has the extra baggage of a ball-tampering ban.

And, having made that call, it does rather look as if some remedial training to assist in distinguishing one's arse from one's elbow might be in order when he gets the flick after two tests.

 

[Shady Slim]

the main problem with Bancroft's recall is that they had, fundamentally, made a decision that Bancroft was better than Harris. I don't have a problem with that, I'm not a full time selector who has a range of numbers and game tapes to help make decisions. (of course, I highly doubt any of the selectors take advantage of the resources they have available)

But then 2 games later they decided Harris is a better bet.

well harris shouldn't have been on that tour at all, it should have been burns, or, like, i dunno a sentient plank of wood with googly eyes

you're right that the way they handled the bancroft situation was a kansas city shuffle but it should never have been bancroft or harris to begin with

 

[mr_mister]

Yeah, I didn't object to it from my high horse; if he was clearly better than the alternatives (as Smith and Warner obviously are), then happy days.

What makes it look slightly funky is that, from the outside looking in, he didn't appear to be.

If there are two blokes of broadly similar abilities (assumed for the sake of argument and brevity) it looks a bit of a "**** you all" call to go with the one who has the extra baggage of a ball-tampering ban.

And, having made that call, it does rather look as if some remedial training to assist in distinguishing one's arse from one's elbow might be in order when he gets the flick after two tests.

it felt like they were trying to fashion a redemption story for all 3 ball tamperers by picking Bancroft again after barely doing that much in his first run in the team

2 of those stories failed miserably but then Smith's probably even exceeded the expectations of a 'fairytale' comeback.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Makeshift openers are underrated. Yes it's a specialist position but picking good middle-order players to open in Tests is a better bet than picking crap openers IMO. Watson and Katich are good examples of this. I said at the time that KPat could have been given a crack as opener, and yes it would have been a bit of a risk but worth a shot.

 

[Shady Slim]

Makeshift openers are underrated. Yes it's a specialist position but picking good middle-order players to open in Tests is a better bet than picking crap openers IMO. Watson and Katich are good examples of this. I said at the time that KPat could have been given a crack as opener, and yes it would have been a bit of a risk but worth a shot.

i suppose there's a good and a bad to this though and the bad is entirely perpetuated by dumb selectors.

say you do this with KPat and he does unfortunately fail, the selectors, being clowns, will regard that as a black mark when the middle order spot eventually opens. if they didn't do this - which they shouldn't, because results as a test opener have little to no bearing on how a middle order bat by trade would do in the middle order - then i would agree we should advocate for this more often.

 

[mr_mister]

Yeah it hurt Finch a lot that method of selection

 

[GoodAreasShane]

Honestly it can work in some cases, but it really depends on how well the specific batsman can adapt to the different requirements of opening up, both technically and tempramentally. Wouldn't say makeshift openers are underrated per se, but there are certainly times it should be considered

But as shady said, all too often that can lead to a player having their cards marked which is dumb

 

[Shady Slim]

pretty good of TJB to give a shoutout to watto by the way, i know that here he's generally rated more correctly than by the general public but he had such such a top run as an opener - a run that gets all-too-regularly overlooked by the haha look at lbw review man meme

 

[trundler]

Funny how Hussey had to be squeezed into the middle order instead.

 

[Prince EWS]

Funny how Hussey had to be squeezed into the middle order instead.

He'd moved into the middle order domestically already tbf.

 

[harsh.ag]

+1 on makeshift openers. Usually the best batsmen play in the middle order. No need to punish them for it.

 

[morgieb]

He'd moved into the middle order domestically already tbf.

Only in one day cricket I thought?

 

[Red]

Huss was a really versatile batsman. Could open, could bat at 6. And anywhere in between.

Never gets mentioned with the greats, but Huss was as good as plenty of ATGs imo.

 

[Midwinter]

Yeah it hurt Finch a lot that method of selection

Was there any logic in using Finch as a red ball opener ?

Does anyone now think he will get a go as a middle order batsman after being sent in as an opener ?

(About as logical as picking Xavier Doherty as a test match spinneer after his success in reducing runrates in ODIs.)

 

[morgieb]

Was there any logic in using Finch as a red ball opener ?

Does anyone now think he will get a go as a middle order batsman after being sent in as an opener ?

(About as logical as picking Xavier Doherty as a test match spinneer after his success in reducing runrates in ODIs.)

I think in fairness I could see the logic for the UAE as pace isn't as important there. Never should've kept him rather than Khawaja as an opener for the series after, though.

I actually think he would've been OK if picked as a 5/6 in Tests. The boat has sailed though.

 

[Burgey]

pretty good of TJB to give a shoutout to watto by the way, i know that here he's generally rated more correctly than by the general public but he had such such a top run as an opener - a run that gets all-too-regularly overlooked by the haha look at lbw review man meme

For sure. If he'd converted a number of his 70-90 odd scores into tons, he would be hailed as big a success in making the move as the likes of Kat and even Langer.

 

[TheJediBrah]

He'd moved into the middle order domestically already tbf.

I don't think this is accurate. Always opened for WA in the Shield, made his Test debut as opener and then was moved into the middle-order when Langer came back to partner Hayden.

As Morgieb said though, he was regularly batting in the middle order in 50 over cricket for WA.

For sure. If he'd converted a number of his 70-90 odd scores into tons, he would be hailed as big a success in making the move as the likes of Kat and even Langer.

Watto must have had a serious psychological block with making Test hundreds. Even when he finally made one he was dropped on 99 and the fielder fumbled it for a single.