Aussies outplayed by England or umpires?

[Slats4ever]

England have played better than Australia and they deserve to be 2-1 up in this series. Umpiring is the same for both teams. It is not England's fault that Warne and Ponting and Hayden appeal for anything and everything and it costs them some close decisions, simply because the umpire is aware of their habit of appealing zealously for simple not outs.

Umpires at a test level should have the skill to ignore Australia's appealing and give the right decision.

Besides what does that have to do with England getting the extreme better of the umpiring this season

 

[honestbharani]

I am not sure about the extreme better, for starters, at Edgbaston, Pieterson was not out and at that point, he was yet to score less than 50 in the whole series. I think Kasper was plumb LBW when Australia were a good 40 odd off the target at Edgbaston. Langer was plumb LBW to Vaughan on the 4th day evening and Ponting was plumb LBW about 12-15 deliveries before he got out. That might have made the difference for England. Like I said, it is very subjective and to say Australia are losing because of umpiring is just an excuse, a lame one at that.

 

[honestbharani]

Umpires at a test level should have the skill to ignore Australia's appealing and give the right decision.

Besides what does that have to do with England getting the extreme better of the umpiring this season

Well, not really. Umpires are not machines. And you reap what you sow, Australia tried to bully umpires to give decisions for them and the fact that it backfired to the extent that even their better appeals are being turned down is solely their fault. You cannot justify the players trying to put unfair pressure on the umpires by saying that the umpires should learn to take it in their stride. Excessive appealing is an offence and I am surprised Warne hasn't been called up for it, esp. because his appealing is worser than anything I saw from India in that infamous second test during the 2001 SA tour.

 

[Nuffy]

HB

I think you've been more than harsh re the Aussies appealing, have alook at Eng in the end of the 3rd test, they were embarassing.

Also why wouldn't you appeal for anything, if Dar can give Katich out, then the Aussies must think they are entitled to appeal for just about anything.

The umpiring has made this series more lop sided than it actually is.

Imagine the game if Flinftoff was given out for 8 and didn't make 102 or if Katich had of received anything resembling a decent decision.

 

[honestbharani]

I am not saying England have been angels. It is just that Warne, individually, has been well over the line. Someone like Brett Lee appeals a lot as well, but that is not EXCESSIVE appealing. You can see that by the way he appeals, he sometimes just half shouts and stuff, he never really puts undue pressure on the umpire. Of course, all bowlers do that at times, but Warne has carried it over the line. It bugs me when an umpire says no and the bowler continues appealing. Warne does this almost every time. That is what I hate. Personally, I enjoy Warne's bowling, but I generally have the mute button on during his overs...

 

[honestbharani]

HB

I think you've been more than harsh re the Aussies appealing, have alook at Eng in the end of the 3rd test, they were embarassing.

Also why wouldn't you appeal for anything, if Dar can give Katich out, then the Aussies must think they are entitled to appeal for just about anything.

The umpiring has made this series more lop sided than it actually is.

Imagine the game if Flinftoff was given out for 8 and didn't make 102 or if Katich had of received anything resembling a decent decision.

Dar has made some excellent decisions as well. Everyone is entitled to their share of shocking mistakes. If you want to talk about a really bad umpire, let's talk about Bucknor. He is the worst in the world, and for two years now.

 

[Slats4ever]

Good point Nuffy. If so many bad decisions are being given Australia would definately feel inclined to at least try when the decision is close.

Unfortunately this situation is always going to arise. It's human nature to delight in the apparent falling of a team of champions. People and cricket teams have been made to feel ordinary for the past 10years by Australian teams and fans due to our superior play and now that Australia appear to have a short term faulter they can finally lay some back into Australia.

At the end of the day however what happens happens and we can each use our own biased or unbiased opinion to form our own beliefs.

 

[Nuffy]

The perception of excess appealing is made worse by the fact that they haven't received anything like gifts of wickets the Eng have during the course of the series through dodgy decisions.

Its frustration pure and simple, all the close ones are going Englands way when they are batting and yet when Australia bats, its seems just about every umpiring mistake that can be made is being made and its costing us dearly. You say that these things have a way of evening themselves out, Australia will need to get the benefit of 20 dodgy decisions in a row to make up for the constant stream of **** decisions we have been copping.

Don't take my word for it, any number of the english commentators have been saying it also, I recall Nasser Hussein saying at one point that after a English player had survived a plumb LBW, it was, in his words " the worst decision in the history of test cricket".

 

[honestbharani]

Good point Nuffy. If so many bad decisions are being given Australia would definately feel inclined to at least try when the decision is close.

Unfortunately this situation is always going to arise. It's human nature to delight in the apparent falling of a team of champions. People and cricket teams have been made to feel ordinary for the past 10years by Australian teams and fans due to our superior play and now that Australia appear to have a short term faulter they can finally lay some back into Australia.

At the end of the day however what happens happens and we can each use our own biased or unbiased opinion to form our own beliefs.

I am sure that happened with the Windies as well. But I can't say that the Aussie players (some of them only, mind you) have been endearing themselves to the fans world over with their statements. Hayden talks as though he is better than Bradman.

 

[Nuffy]

I'm sure that Dar has made some good decisions, and Bucknors form, and Bowden before that are an embarassment to world cricket.

My concern is that when Eng are batting then benefit of the doubt applies, when however Australia are batting then its "anything goes" time.

We aren't getting any close decisions when we bowl and yet we have to sit back and accept decisions like the Katich one.

Show me an example of a English batsman getting any rough decisions which have really affected Englands chances through the series........there isn't one. We had 5 in the last game alone.

I accept that umpires can and will make mistakes, the issue that I have is that every mistake they make is disadvantaging Australia, in huge ways in some instances.

 

[Slats4ever]

and unfortunately nuffy's opinions and views are causing him to be branded "a sore loser" by some members on here. Really quite sad.

 

[Nuffy]

Perhaps you can enlighten us with some examples of Haydens comments that so inflame you, I haven't heard him say a single thing in this series.

Bradman wouldn't have averaged 99.94 if he was umpired by Bucknor, Bowden or Dar, they'f find a way to give him out.

 

[sqwerty]

say whatever you want but at no point in these last 3 test matches have australia been in a better position.

I'd say about 30 seconds before the second test ended England would have disagreed with you.

 

[Nuffy]

Slats, I don't really care, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, thats all that matters.

I will be very interested to see that if Australia can rally (and its a ask) and win the 5th test on the back of some beneficial decisions, how many of these happy england fans will be saying "oh its only cricket and these things even themselves out"

I'd suggest that they will be screaming for the rooftops about it, its great when you team is getting all the luck running your way, lets see how happy they will be if it costs them the Ashes, like it looks like it has for us.

 

[wahindiawah]

Bradman wouldn't have averaged 99.94 if he was umpired by Bucknor, Bowden or Dar, they'f find a way to give him out.

I saw the oneday Finals between Pakistan and Australia, the umpires happen to have been Australians and their decisions were shocking.Ofcourse one would say that Australia would still have won the series as they were the better team, sure, but a better team doesn't need 13 players!!!
I guess in order to stop Australian from whining, their team should be allowed to play with 13 players once again.I suggest 2 umpies should be imported from Australia for the next match in oval, i'm sure if Australian umpires are part of the match then even Hayden would be able to average more than 99.94 in the ashes series.!

 

[Slats4ever]

that doesn't make much sense...

 

[GladiatrsInBlue]

I accept that umpires can and will make mistakes, the issue that I have is that every mistake they make is disadvantaging Australia, in huge ways in some instances.

Ever thought about the decisions over the years that have been ADVANTAGING Australian team over the years????

 

[Deja moo]

and unfortunately nuffy's opinions and views are causing him to be branded "a sore loser" by some members on here. Really quite sad.

Its no different to when the Indian members on board were branded sore losers for pointing out how they'd received the short end of the stick when it came to bad decisions during the 2003-04 series in Australia. ( and mind you, I'm only taking the reports of bad umpiring on face value here. I havent been following the Ashes closely ).

 

[GladiatrsInBlue]

and unfortunately nuffy's opinions and views are causing him to be branded "a sore loser" by some members on here. Really quite sad.

No matter how much he huffs or puffs, one thing is certain, he's a perfect role model for sore losers!!

 

[archie mac]

I think it previous Ashes series, Australia have had the better of the 50/50 calls, so it is just evening out. England have been clearly the better side, although winning the toss this Test was a big advantage.