Asif, Aktar in Doping Charges

[BoyBrumby]

WRT Warne I personally think the circumstantial evidence is pretty damning. The chain of events goes something like:

-Warne dislocates shoulder before World Cup that he has already said will be his swansong in ODIs & puts his participation in real doubt
-?
-Warne makes quicker than expected recovery from dislocated shoulder & is able to take part in World Cup
-Warne ingests diuretic
-Warne pinged for said diuretic

Now the "?" may or may not have involved taking something like an anabolic steroid that is known to speed recovery, but frankly I find it rather more plausible than the whole "wanting to look slim on telly" excuse. For mine potentially the only thing that separates Warne from Asif & Ahktar is the efficacy of his masking agent, which is why I'd advocate a similar ban.

 

[social]

WRT Warne I personally think the circumstantial evidence is pretty damning. The chain of events goes something like:

-Warne dislocates shoulder before World Cup that he has already said will be his swansong in ODIs & puts his participation in real doubt
-?
-Warne makes quicker than expected recovery from dislocated shoulder & is able to take part in World Cup
-Warne ingests diuretic
-Warne pinged for said diuretic

Now the "?" may or may not have involved taking something like an anabolic steroid that is known to speed recovery, but frankly I find it rather more plausible than the whole "wanting to look slim on telly" excuse. For mine potentially the only thing that separates Warne from Asif & Ahktar is the efficacy of his masking agent, which is why I'd advocate a similar ban.

Exactly right.

 

[open365]

A diuretic can be used to aid weight loss, so it can be construed as performance enhancing. The fact that could be used as a masking agent as well means on those two counts alone it should be treated as the same magnitude of ban as someone on nandrolone. When someone is caught with an illegal substance in their system you automatically consider it as the worst case scenario with that substance because it's usually impossible to deduce whether it was just an accident or they're a long-time cheat or what.

Er..i'm pretty sure a diuretic isn't classed as a performance enhancing drug.

It's on the list because it mask other drugs he may have taken.

 

[maxpower]

What is the policy of ICC and illegal drug use ? this test seems to be done by PCB and even in Warne's case I think ACB did the test, in order to be more strict should'nt ICC be conducting these tests like other sports do ?

Also there has to be clearity on what is allowed as legal use, if using something like protein shakes can cause this, then its quite hard to control.

 

[Langeveldt]

What is the policy of ICC and illegal drug use ? this test seems to be done by PCB and even in Warne's case I think ACB did the test, in order to be more strict should'nt ICC be conducting these tests like other sports do ?

Also there has to be clearity on what is allowed as legal use, if using something like protein shakes can cause this, then its quite hard to control.

The last thing we need is handing over a complex process such as drugs testing to a bunch of non-entities such as the ICC

 

[nightprowler10]

This is very depressing for me. I am absolutely crushed. First the Oval fiasco, then the captaincy ** involving Younis followed by Shahryar Khan resigning, and now the biggest blow of all. I absolutely love Asif. If these two (hopefully just the two) are not punished and get away with a slap on the wrist, it would be an absolute disappointment. What kind of a message would the officials be sending to the kids out there who idolize these two? Anything less than a year ban for them would be a farce.

I'm sure that these two took steroids from the pressure they may have gotten from PCB about their fitness, but that is no excuse for doing such a stupid thing.

This is even worse for me since my best friend just failed a drug test last week and got terminated from work. What is wrong with this world?

 

[maxpower]

The last thing we need is handing over a complex process such as drugs testing to a bunch of non-entities such as the ICC

I am not a huge fan of ICC either, but drug testing has to be random and done a non-partial entity, there will always be doubts about inhouse testings. ICC is the only one I could think of.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Er..i'm pretty sure a diuretic isn't classed as a performance enhancing drug.

It's on the list because it mask other drugs he may have taken.

I didn't say it wasn't classed as performance enhancing, I just said it could enhance performance indirectly. Regardless it can be a masking agent so it should be considered just as bad steroids as far as punishment goes.

 

[Langeveldt]

I am not a huge fan of ICC either, but drug testing has to be random and done a non-partial entity, there will always be doubts about inhouse testings. ICC is the only one I could think of.

Don't WADA have the ability to conduct random tests? Not sure what they stand for, but I think they are an impartial and global anti drugs agency

 

[social]

Don't WADA have the ability to conduct random tests? Not sure what they stand for, but I think they are an impartial and global anti drugs agency

World Anti Doping Authority/Association

Generally accepted as leading authority on drugs in sport but not all sports operate under their jurisdiction or in accordance with their policies

 

[archie mac]

In the interests of fairness, IF (and it's a big "if" at this stage) they are guilty, then it should be the same suspension as Warne.

I must say I don't agree, Warne at worst was taking a masking agent, and at best a diet pill. There is no doubt here (depending on the B sample) that they were on the real gear

Surely missing the Champions Trophy AND the World Cup And being subject to public humiliation is more than punishment enough.

Surely though there must be a strong deterent to stop other players taking the risk. 2 years seems fair enough.

What I can't believe is that Pakistan players have not been the subject of Drug Tests in the past.

No wonder they call the ICC a toothless Tiger. They should been in charge of the testing and of the banning of players, so we have a level playing field.

 

[maxpower]

WHY A CRICKETER MIGHT TAKE IT, HOW IT COULD BE TAKEN ACCIDENTALLY,POSSIBLE LOOPHOLES

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/cricket/6055410.stm

btw does anyone know how often other countries do their testing, seeing as PCB did it for the first time ?

 

[archie mac]

WHY A CRICKETER MIGHT TAKE IT, HOW IT COULD BE TAKEN ACCIDENTALLY,POSSIBLE LOOPHOLES

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/cricket/6055410.stm

In Australia ignorance of the rules is no excuse, except if your mum is involved

 

[Pratters]

Don't WADA have the ability to conduct random tests?

Erm The current PCB tests results did come from WADA labs, Malaysia.

 

[Pratters]

The last thing we need is handing over a complex process such as drugs testing to a bunch of non-entities such as the ICC

Both the PCB and ICC are already signatories to WADA Code. Also, going by that, the players would have to be.. or to put it better.. should be banned for two years.

 

[Pratters]

ICC will conduct random tests in the Trophy as well. 24 players will be tested in six random matches (2 from each team). The matters would have gone from the PCB's hands to the ICC's hands if the players were caught in those tests..

 

[silentstriker]

I do not believe the BCCI does any sort of testing by itself.

 

[Pratters]

I do not believe the BCCI does any sort of testing by itself.

You are right. Right now, only five test teams have in house structures for dope tests - NZL, ENG, PAK, RSA and PAk and AUS.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Social: In the interests of fairness, IF (and it's a big "if" at this stage) they are guilty, then it should be the same suspension as Warne.

I must say I don't agree, Warne at worst was taking a masking agent, and at best a diet pill. There is no doubt here (depending on the B sample) that they were on the real gear

You can't treat a masking agent and a steroid differently. Intent or long-term usage cannot be proven in people taking illegal drugs, for all we know the steroid was a one off for Asif and Warne had been taking a masked steroid or whatever for months and had done it before and so Warne was far worse. If we give weaker punishment for masking agents then cheats are obviously going to take masking agents so they'd get a weaker ban if they got caught. It is unfair to presume that Asif deliberately took a steroid to aid his return from injury and then not presume Warne took a steroid or whatever that was masked, both should be presumed as they would be in most other sports bodies covering doping offenses. Obviously if Asif proved someone maliciously spiked his drink or whatever then it would be different, but in all likelihood it'll be unproven whether Asif took the steroid deliberately, same with practically everyone ever caught.

 

[social]

You can't treat a masking agent and a steroid differently. Intent or long-term usage cannot be proven in people taking illegal drugs, for all we know the steroid was a one off for Asif and Warne had been taking a masked steroid or whatever for months and had done it before and so Warne was far worse. If we give weaker punishment for masking agents then cheats are obviously going to take masking agents so they'd get a weaker ban if they got caught. It is unfair to presume that Asif deliberately took a steroid to aid his return from injury and then not presume Warne took a steroid or whatever that was masked, both should be presumed as they would be in most other sports bodies covering doping offenses. Obviously if Asif proved someone maliciously spiked his drink or whatever then it would be different, but in all likelihood it'll be unproven whether Asif took the steroid deliberately, same with practically everyone ever caught.

Totally agree - Warne's case set a precedent for drug taking in cricket and IMO it would be unduly harsh not to apply a similar penalty to others in the same boat