Are Kolpak players hurting English cricket?

[Smudge]

OK, I was looking at another Chris Taylor. Lol. Apologise.

Oh dear.

 

[Burgey]

Where's Kolpak? Is it a small Pacific Island nation producing a lot of cricketing talent all of a sudden, or is it a derisory term for Polish players?

 

[Lillian Thomson]

Where's Kolpak? Is it a small Pacific Island nation producing a lot of cricketing talent all of a sudden, or is it a derisory term for Polish players?

This is the man to blame.......and he's ugly.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Where's Kolpak? Is it a small Pacific Island nation producing a lot of cricketing talent all of a sudden, or is it a derisory term for Polish players?

Slovakian handball player IIRC. It was his test case that established the precedent of nationals of countries with trade agreements with the EU having the same employment/residence rights as EU citizens.

But you probably knew that & were taking the piss.

 

[Langeveldt]

Hey Hingston, learn how to resize, k?

I know how to resize, I just did that to annoy the likes of you...

 

[dontcloseyoureyes]

I know how to resize, I just did that to annoy the likes of you...

c00l bro.

 

[FBU]

Kolpaks 2008 -

Derbys - Smith, Langeveldt
Dur - Benkenstein, Pollock
Essex - Flower
Glam - NONE
Gloucs - Ireland
Hants - Lamb
Kent - McLaren, van Jaarsveld, Justin Kemp
Leics - Ackerman, Henderson, Kruger, du Preez, du Toit, Lawson
Lancs - Du Plessis
Middx - De Wet
N'hants - Klusener, Wessels, Boje, van der Wath, Hall
Notts - NONE
Som - Willoughby, Thomas, de Bruyn
Surrey - Collins
Sussex - Goodwin
Warks - NONE
Worcs - NONE
Yorks - Kruis, Rudolph

18 in 2007 and 30 in 2008. There could be more that I am not aware of.

 

[Richard]

All I know is that Chris Taylor is an absolute gun for me in ICC 2002 so should therefore be in the English Test side.

Again, different Chris Taylor.

Kinda tricky situation really, with there being two Chris Taylors and two Matthew James Woods in action for counties in recent years.

 

[Anna]

But quite a few of these Kolpak players don't seem to be of a particularly high standard.. I know Somerset have got a guy called Kieswetter in the side who I don't think would particularly raise the bar, and he's keeping any locals from behind the stumps whilst he's here.. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't get in a franchise side back home tbh

Kieswetter is NOT a Kolpak - he has a British passport, as his mum is British.

Not sure, I know Kolpaks are cheaper, and he's taken the place of Carl Gazzard, who, while no awesome shakes as a player, was definitely no worse.. Young players are leaving because they know they are in with less of a chance to develop when you can just shove a few Kolpaks in..

He's a cracking batsmen, capable of more than Gazzard, IMO, although Gazz has had a pretty good pre-season.

Kolpaks 2008 -

Derbys - Smith, Langeveldt
Dur - Benkenstein, Pollock
Essex - Flower
Glam - NONE
Gloucs - Ireland
Hants - Lamb
Kent - McLaren, van Jaarsveld, Justin Kemp
Leics - Ackerman, Henderson, Kruger, du Preez, du Toit, Lawson
Lancs - Du Plessis
Middx - De Wet
N'hants - Klusener, Wessels, Boje, van der Wath, Hall
Notts - NONE
Som - Willoughby, Thomas, de Bruyn
Surrey - Collins
Sussex - Goodwin
Warks - NONE
Worcs - NONE
Yorks - Kruis, Rudolph

18 in 2007 and 30 in 2008. There could be more that I am not aware of.

Wessels isn't a Kolpak, either.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Wessels isn't a Kolpak, either.

I thought he was. What passport does he trade under? Assumed he was a saffie Kolpak, given his dad's South African & he was born in Australia.

I'm not sure if Ballance at Yorkshire is a Kolpak or a EU passport holder either, but he did play for Zimbabwe U-19s.

 

[Anna]

I think he has a British passport..

 

[andruid]

Take Tim Southee from NZ as an example. A 19 year-old with a lot of promise and even more so Sharma from India. If they were English, would they have even got a look in, in a English county team? Somehow I doubt it.

I do not thin Southee and Sharma are fair examples of the sort of young crickete who would end up missing out on a County XI for the sake of a Kolpak because quites simply 19 years olds as talented as Southee of Sharma are too good to possibly leave out of any team.

 

[FBU]

Kieswetter is NOT a Kolpak - he has a British passport, as his mum is British.



He's a cracking batsmen, capable of more than Gazzard, IMO, although Gazz has had a pretty good pre-season.



Wessels isn't a Kolpak, either.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2008/04/14/nosplit/uccountydivtwo114.xml

Kolpak Quota: Nicky Boje, Lance Klusener and Riki Wessels – "Too many but we will be working on it over the next couple of years,” according to chief executive Mark Tagg.

 

[Prince EWS]

I would disagree with that. My personal opinion is that the domestic structure in every country is there to benefit the national team and what ever it takes to help improve the national team should be done.

Perhaps there's a difference, but I recall in New Zealand, the national selectors asking the domestic sides to bat players in certain positions as they wanted to see how they went. Do the English selectors not have anything to do with the counties in that aspect?



I think it harms England and the countries where they're coming from, but I fail to see how it's good for England for a good up and coming bowler to be kept out of the side because Pedro Collins is playing for example as a Kolpak.

Take Tim Southee from NZ as an example. A 19 year-old with a lot of promise and even more so Sharma from India. If they were English, would they have even got a look in, in a English county team? Somehow I doubt it.

Old post I know, but anyway..

The point is, England have more First Class sides than their cricket-playing population really justifies. To keep the standard up, I think they need these Kolpaks. With so many county teams, the standard of First Class cricket in England would be shocking without Kolpaks and overseas players, AFAIC. Someone like Southee might not get a game straight away, but what would be more beneficial to him in the long run - being fast-tracked into a low-quality competition before he was really ready, or developing on the fringes of a squad, gaining knowledge from experienced players and then getting a crack in a higher quality competition once he'd improved as a cricketer?

 

[Top_Cat]

Again, different Chris Taylor.

Kinda tricky situation really, with there being two Chris Taylors and two Matthew James Woods in action for counties in recent years.

Nope. I know there are two of them in the game and the older one is very good too but the younger one is awesome for Yorkshire. Great flat-top too.

 

[FBU]

As far as I can make out these are the British Passport Holders

Breese, Claydon, Thorp, Wiseman, Chambers, Hodnett, Spearman, Kieswetter, AMahmood, Dexter, GJones, Joseph, Allenby, Horton, Law, Aga, Berg, Malan, ACrook, SCrook, Banks, Dernbach, Jordan, Hussain, Mushtaq, Walters, Ambrose, Botha, Carter, Groenewald, Trott, Mason, Brophy, Rankin, Porterfield.

EU Passport Holders
Klokker, di Venuto, ten Doeschate, Marshall, Ervine, Pothas, AKhan, Morgan, Joyce, O'Brien, Kerverzee

Don't know about Ballance.

 

[Indipper]

Old post I know, but anyway..

The point is, England have more First Class sides than their cricket-playing population really justifies. To keep the standard up, I think they need these Kolpaks. With so many county teams, the standard of First Class cricket in England would be shocking without Kolpaks and overseas players, AFAIC. Someone like Southee might not get a game straight away, but what would be more beneficial to him in the long run - being fast-tracked into a low-quality competition before he was really ready, or developing on the fringes of a squad, gaining knowledge from experienced players and then getting a crack in a higher quality competition once he'd improved as a cricketer?

Or maybe England should have fewer FC teams.

 

[Richard]

Nope. I know there are two of them in the game and the older one is very good too but the younger one is awesome for Yorkshire. Great flat-top too.

So our (Yorkshire's) Chris Taylor was in ICC 2002? Bloody hell, that program looks deeper than I gave it credit for!

 

[Craig]

Gotta love the way cricinfo cheerfully lists him as "Right-arm fast-medium" despite him never bowling a ball in anger in any top flight cricket.

Maybe he is the Malcolm Marshall of bowling in the nets

(Hey in my defence he could be a severely under-rated as a bowler, Glenn McGrath was once 6th and 7th change bowler in Country NSW because his captain thought he was rubbish)

 

[Anna]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2008/04/14/nosplit/uccountydivtwo114.xml

Kolpak Quota: Nicky Boje, Lance Klusener and Riki Wessels – "Too many but we will be working on it over the next couple of years,” according to chief executive Mark Tagg.

Do you believe everything you read in newspapers? I'm pretty certain he has a British passport, as he's lived here most of his life.