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Andrew Flintoff opening?

pup11

pup11

International Coach
Flintoff has been doing rather well at no.5 off late, but tbt i really don't consider Flintoff to be much of batsman, he is an awesome bowler who can bat decently when he feels like concentrating and playing a good knock rather than getting holed out in the deep.

I would rather open with Bopara and Bell and have Prior down at 7 or 8 to throw his bat around.
 
Woodster

Woodster

International Captain
The idea of Freddie opening has been mooted on a number of occasions, however, like most of the comments here, I agree at 5 he is most effective. Against a new ball he struggles, before being set, and the impetus he offers in the final 10 overs outweigh any damage he could possibly do at the top.

Ftr, I'm still a fan of having Cook at the top, still believe he has the game to play the long anchor innings, providing he is frequently able to turn the strike around.
 
Precambrian

Precambrian

Banned
Why Kevin Pietersen doesnt open? He has good technique against pace. And he can provide superb momentum to the innings.
 
chalky

chalky

International Debutant
Woodster said:
Ftr, I'm still a fan of having Cook at the top, still believe he has the game to play the long anchor innings, providing he is frequently able to turn the strike around.
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Don't think you can have Cook & Bell opening TBH certainly not in India where 300+ are going to be par scores. I do think we need a dasher at the top of the innings, otherwise our middle order is always going to be under pressure, just can't think of a suitable candidate at the moment.
 
Woodster

Woodster

International Captain
chalky said:
Don't think you can have Cook & Bell opening TBH certainly not in India where 300+ are going to be par scores. I do think we need a dasher at the top of the innings, otherwise our middle order is always going to be under pressure, just can't think of a suitable candidate at the moment.
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I agree and I wouldn't go with Cook and Bell. I am also talking long term rather than making the change immediately. Bell has to convert these starts, he is never going to go at a lightning strike rate, therefore if he is using up a number of balls to get set at the start of the innings, he must then ensure he bats the majority of the innings allowing team-mates to bat round him. Just think Cook would be more effective in this role, as a specialist opener.
 
Richard

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
I'd agree with Paul in that I think Cook is more likely in the long-term to be a good ODI opener than Bell. However, right now, I'd prefer Bell there. Not only for the reasons I've already mentioned about Cook potentially damaging his Test game (a la Strauss) by trying to turn himself into a good ODI batsman too soon, but also because right now Bell just has a bit more to offer. He's a much more natural timer of the ball than Cook is - Cook is far more crabby and punchy.

However, in the long-term I think Cook has more potential to work the ball into gaps (something Bell isn't good at at all) and that's the biggest thing I look for in a batsman who's not going to dash at the top of the innings.
 
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Richard

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Precambrian said:
Why Kevin Pietersen doesnt open? He has good technique against pace. And he can provide superb momentum to the innings.
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Although it's pretty likely that Pietersen (like other middle-order batsmen Mark Waugh, Tendulkar and Lara) could do a good job as a ODI opener, I'd be reluctant to try it. As I said in the other thread, I think he's probably best-served at three (though he's not going to bat there in the immediate future as he himself wants Shah there and thus isn't going to promote himself above Shah) because he's the sort of batsman who likes to build an innings, rather than play shots from the off. I hope we'll see him there before long and I hope it pays-off pretty quickly, as we can do with getting the few established players settled without having to worry about where best to bat them as well as who to play among the morass of mediocrity that England usually have to select from for ODI players.
 
T

tooextracool

International Coach
Ive actually been a huge advocator for this move for more than a year now. With his recent success at 5, I dont see it happening, but IMO England have currently 7 middle order players jostling between what should 3 positions. Instead we have crap players like Prior opening the batting, and players like Patel and Bopara batting out of position down the order.

Personally, I dont think Collingwood should bat anywhere above 5. Pietersen should bat wherever hes comfortable (whether that is 3 or 4) and I really dont think that Prior should be opening the batting.My batting order would be something like:

Bell
Flintoff
Pietersen
Patel
Collingwood
Shah/Bopara
Keeper - Not sure who this should be just yet.
Swann
Broad
Sidebottom
Harmison
 
J

Jakester1288

International Regular
Keep him at 5-7, I can't see him being sucessful at opening against a swinging ball, batting up to 50 overs, then bowling 10, going flat chat. I can't see it being successful, I don't think he is the kind of guy who could open the batting, in any form.
 
aussie

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
Ha, Patel @ 4 & Shah back @ 6, now way. You rate him too highly TEC.

With the majority, Master Fred is good enough between 5-7. I still have faith the Prior can come good at the top of the order, but i have to admit this ODI series could be his last full-chance. Afterwards i'd probably go for Denly to open with Bell.
 
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