7 Players who dont get the credit that they should get...

[aussie_beater]

What the Aussies don't realise is that its not the same culture everywhere.Cricket isn't a backyard game for the Aussies or the Poms no more....and in some cultures like in the sub-continent, if you stoop that low as to really bad mouth someone in the field, its very difficult for those same guys to go out for a "beer after work" kinda thing and its gonna get nasty.That's what happens and if the Aussies mean that playing tough cricket means to sledge and all that, then better be prepared for the consequences as well.'Coz more often then not, its gonna get personal and will spill out of the cricket field.That's one of the major problems with the Aussies, Springboks and the Poms as well.

 

[Top_Cat]

What the Aussies don't realise is that its not the same culture everywhere.Cricket isn't a backyard game for the Aussies or the Poms no more....and in some cultures like in the sub-continent, if you stoop that low as to really bad mouth someone in the field, its very difficult for those same guys to go out for a "beer after work" kinda thing and its gonna get nasty.That's what happens and if the Aussies mean that playing tough cricket means to sledge and all that, then better be prepared for the consequences as well.'Coz more often then not, its gonna get personal and will spill out of the cricket field.That's one of the major problems with the Aussies, Springboks and the Poms as well.

Yeah and even some of the South Africans complain now.

Believe me I understand the cultural argument and it has some merit but all teams do it now. I certainly wouldn't claim that the Aussies are tougher than others but in all seriousness, players shouldn't take what's said on the field so seriously. It's PURELY designed to hit a raw nerve so the batsman will be impulsive and play a stupid shot. The people who are smart take it for what it is; an attempt to annoy you enough to get yourself out. The even smarter people realise that if they just live with it (or better yet use it as motivation), if they are then successful, they won't get it as often because the Aussies will reason that it doesn't work.

I'm sure you've noticed that the Aussies NEVER sledge Sachin. Why? Because he'll just motivate himself to belt the Aussies to all parts. They figured that one out very early on (especially after his brilliant hundred in Perth). Brian Lara in his early career was another who you just NEVER sledged because he'd just get more motivation to hurt you on the scoreboard. Now they sledge him to death because it DOES get to him now.

One more who you should NEVER have sledge was Viv Richards. Anyone who attempted to was belted mercilessly. Only Steve Waugh tried it and was relatively successful against Viv because he did manage to get under his skin a little. None of the others ever tried it though.

There's a lovely story of when Viv was playing for Glamorgan and some local tearaway was bowling at him and beat him a few times. "It's red and it's round!!" screamed this guy, as if to tell Viv what the ball looked like. The next ball landed somewhere outside of the ground and Viv said to him, "Hey man, since you know what it looks like, why don't you go get it?"



Guys like Waqar Younis (and the Pakistan team in general) appreciate the sledging too. Notice the Aussies never sledge Inzi about his weight (the commentators do that instead)? Why? Because if they do, they'd better be prepared to chase some leather. I thought it was cool that Waqar said the Aussies play the game as it should be played; HARD. The already straospheric levels of respect I had for him reached almost unimpeachable levels.

So in short, either give it back or just try to perform well and look at the sledging for what it is. It isn't designed to be personal or villification (I've not heard of much in the way of racist taunts, Jayasuriya's comment about Glenn McGrath's sledging notwithstanding) but merely to get you out.

 

[aussie_beater]

So in short, either give it back or just try to perform well and look at the sledging for what it is. It isn't designed to be personal or villification (I've not heard of much in the way of racist taunts, Jayasuriya's comment about Glenn McGrath's sledging notwithstanding) but merely to get you out.

That's what I am saying....sledge if you want, but then don't whine about the consequences either.This "it isn't designed to be personal" theme doesn't really count....if some take it to be personal, be prepared to face the music.You can't dictate if someone takes it personally or not.That's where the Aussies chicken out and start vilifying people like Ranatunga and act like cry babies.

 

[Top_Cat]

That's what I am saying....sledge if you want, but then don't whine about the consequences either.This "it isn't designed to be personal" theme doesn't really count....if some take it to be personal, be prepared to face the music.You can't dictate if someone takes it personally or not.That's where the Aussies chicken out and start vilifying people like Ranatunga and act like cry babies.

Actually if the sledging works, I think you wouldn't be too disappointed about the consequences.

And if anyone has been acting like cry-babies, it's guys like Ranatunga, Mahanama, Lara, the South African guy (can't quite remember his name) and others.

Mind you, whilst I personally have NEVER sledged (too busy just getting the guys I bowled to out! ), I think some of the measures taken against some Aussie players has been ridiculous. I mean, do you remember when Glenn McGrath was fined for 'spitting in the direction of' a West Indian player a couple of years ago? The reply being shown around the world sure looked that way but then other replays showed them to be many metres apart! That was just administration gone bezerk. They've toned it down quite a bit but I'd hate to see any more legislation introduced to counter something so stupid.

I reckon it should all be down to the guy who's actually out there to see and hear any incidents; the umpire. The match referee stepping in on sledging incidents is just stupid. They're not out there to hear exactly what's said or done (especially the stuff that's not caught on microphones) so to let them decide a player's fate like that is idiocy. I mean, if the umpires word actually meant something, we could have avoided the amazing situation where Sehwag was accused of excessive appealing. I notice the umpires didn't put in an official complaint about him yet he was banned for a match because the match referee decided he'd shown just a little bit too much emotion when a decision didn't go India's way. Stupid. That's when it shoud be up to the umpire. The umpire is out there and if he wasn't offended by excessive appealing (if the appealing was even excessive), then why should the match referee effectivey decide that the umpire SHOULD have been offended and suspend the offending players??

 

[scorpio]

T_C : Guess you dont get it. In the subcontinent if you bad mouth some one you both are enemies.Period.
Its the culture. You can call some one a motherf....r in oz,eng and any western country and it will be just another swear word. But in the sub continent you make a enemy out of some one. ( Not in all cases )

So mahanama wrote a book abt sledging. He also says Mcgrath called jayasuriya a black monkey. While there is no proof i am sure that sledging does take racial over tones as history has proved time and again.

You keep telling mahanama is a whiner. Fine. WHat abt shane warne who has done bigger misdemeanours from sledging,name callin on TV,obscene phone calls and part time weather forecaster ( stupid ACB nipped his career in the bud..hehe ). WHy does shane has to go aroud writing that ranatunga is a disgrace to cricket ?
what abt the esteemed Darell Hair - a pathetic loser.
what abt Ross Emerson ?

You got any justification for that ?

As for the sehwag episode i am of the firm opinion tht it had strong racial undertones.( i never use the word racism that easily but that incident was outrageous)

 

[Kimbo]

i have often mentioned that time when ranatunga claimed a catch he blatently dropped. he was in slips and fumbled it while lying over the ball, then picked it up off the ground and claimed it. luckily it went to the third umpire!

 

[scorpio]

i have often mentioned that time when ranatunga claimed a catch he blatently dropped. he was in slips and fumbled it while lying over the ball, then picked it up off the ground and claimed it. luckily it went to the third umpire!

so ?

 

[aussie_beater]

And if anyone has been acting like cry-babies, it's guys like Ranatunga, Mahanama, Lara, the South African guy (can't quite remember his name) and others.

Ranatunga and those other folks are not cry babies....they just kicked it up a knotch and the Aussies withered.That's what it is.They can't take their own medicine when it becomes slightly more bitter.That's why you have Shane Warne writing all that stuff about Ranatinga in his memoirs or something. And that's how its gonna be more often with people taking it a little more personaly then you initially thought, atleast for the sub-continental guys and you have to face the heat.So, I would say that the Aussies should own up to their actions and be responsible for the consequences.

I agree with you about the umpire thing and surely the umpire should have the prerogative of reporting incidents and then the match referee should come into the picture, if at all.

 

[aussie_beater]

i have often mentioned that time when ranatunga claimed a catch he blatently dropped. he was in slips and fumbled it while lying over the ball, then picked it up off the ground and claimed it. luckily it went to the third umpire!

What about Slater in Mumbai against Dravid ?

 

[yorker]

"for example : when it comes to pakistan it is alwys imran while javed is mostly forgotten".
Atleast in Pakistan he's still regarded as one of the best ever, ppl have great respect for him, which is not the case with Waseem Akram!

 

[Very Faa-Kin Farkney]

wtf?

you're saying NZ has a batting lineup that rivals Zimbabwe after Astle is taken out?

what about Richardson, Cairns & McMillan?
Fleming is capable of being a better batsman.

Agree although McMillan throws his wicket away far too often

 

[Very Faa-Kin Farkney]

Changed. My Pleasure 8D

Klusener - Agreed
Jones - Mostly before my time. Only remember the last couple of years. But he was good...
Srikkanth - Who?!
Miandad - Before my time. Again.
Ranatunga - Doesn't get credit because he ain't a nice guy
A.Flower - Agreed
Astle - I think you may be overrating him here a little.

You are a disgrace not knowing who Miandad is. Srikkanth was amazing when India had him opening with Shastri in the mid 80s

 

[Kimbo]

i have often mentioned that time when ranatunga claimed a catch he blatently dropped. he was in slips and fumbled it while lying over the ball, then picked it up off the ground and claimed it. luckily it went to the third umpire!

so ?

so??? i found it extremely unsportsmanlike. i would never claim a catch that i knew i had dropped(especially as blatently as that, he actually picked the ball up off the ground). all i am saying is that i dont think he is the honourable player you are trying to make him out to be.
and i dont think it makes it any better when you talk about other guys (such as matthew hayden) doing the same thing. i dont care- whoever does it, its wrong.

 

[Kimbo]

just for the record, i do admire ranatunga for his batting.

 

[aussie_beater]

One Indian player who doesn't get any credit for all he did and is surely very underrated was Mohinder(Jimmy) Amarnath.To my mind he was the finest batsman to play fast bowling that India has ever produced...even better then Sunil Gavaskar in my opinion.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Changed. My Pleasure 8D

Klusener - Agreed
Jones - Mostly before my time. Only remember the last couple of years. But he was good...
Srikkanth - Who?!
Miandad - Before my time. Again.
Ranatunga - Doesn't get credit because he ain't a nice guy
A.Flower - Agreed
Astle - I think you may be overrating him here a little.

You are a disgrace not knowing who Miandad is. Srikkanth was amazing when India had him opening with Shastri in the mid 80s

1) I know who Miandad is!! I have just never seen him play so can't comment on whether he's under/over-rated.
2) The South African was Graeme Smith
3) T_C's point is that Mahanama/Lara/Smith/Ranatunga are cry-babies because they give it out on the field, and then whinge when they get it back. It's part of cricket, live with it.

 

[scorpio]

Very Faa-Kin Farkney : Why is it a disgrace that he choose not comment abt something he wasnt really knowledgable ?
I think tht was wise actually.

sunil hava:
I didnt know that u are such a honest person. :rolleyes:.
and i wouldnt know that until u actually tell us ...thts why the " so? "

Do u read the whole thread or just jump in the middle ? heh

The topic is PLAYERS WHO DONT GET THE CREDIT THEY SHOULD GET.

I didnt praise ranatunga for his honesty or well shaped body.

I praised him for the way he stood up to the bullies, the way he used his limited firepower, his clever ness as a batsman and skipper and the way he built up his young team.

But i can tell u this ranatunga is very upset that you are not impressed with his honesty..hope fully he wont kill himself

 

[scorpio]

Neil:
Good point abt miandad.

Regarding the CRY BABY discussion me and lucky had with T_C - i thought we settled it..lol

Yeah ranatunga and co were cry babies..but they just followed the foot steps of bigger cry babies like waugh,warne,Mcgrath and ofcourse David lloyd.

Guess your argument goes both ways..heh

 

[Kimbo]

Very Faa-Kin Farkney : Why is it a disgrace that he choose not comment abt something he wasnt really knowledgable ?
I think tht was wise actually.

sunil hava:
I didnt know that u are such a honest person. :rolleyes:.
and i wouldnt know that until u actually tell us ...thts why the " so? "

Do u read the whole thread or just jump in the middle ? heh

The topic is PLAYERS WHO DONT GET THE CREDIT THEY SHOULD GET.

I didnt praise ranatunga for his honesty or well shaped body.

I praised him for the way he stood up to the bullies, the way he used his limited firepower, his clever ness as a batsman and skipper and the way he built up his young team.

But i can tell u this ranatunga is very upset that you are not impressed with his honesty..hope fully he wont kill himself

i know thats what the topic was about, but i thought you were saying he was an honourable captain and i was simply disputing that. anyway- that would probably be a reason he hasnt got a lot of credit... maybe :undecided:

 

[scorpio]

okay....though i dont agree with u..