Zinzan
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We'll need more than inspiration at this point, we'll need a very lucky toss win in conditions which are really in favour of the side winning the toss.
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41st Match - England v New Zealand
- Thread starter James
- Start date
Grasshopper
State Vice-Captain
Even then we'd find a way to stuff it up. We're that bad.
No, I know. But Brendon is too close to him to do it.
We did exactly that against Pakistan. That was a bat first and win 80% of the time on a wearing pitch.
CM Punk
State Vice-Captain
We had a weaker team talent wise in 2011 yet we played much better than this team...
When was the last time we had a team as bad as this in the WC?
Putting my bias aside, it would have been better if Pakistan qualified as they'd have a better chance of beating Aus. With us it feels like it's inevitable and we're going into the SFs to lose.
The team has no form or confidence.
When was the last time we had a team as bad as this in the WC?
Putting my bias aside, it would have been better if Pakistan qualified as they'd have a better chance of beating Aus. With us it feels like it's inevitable and we're going into the SFs to lose.
The team has no form or confidence.
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I'm absolutely convinced it's mindset, and it needs to be remedied. We seem to bat with such freedom and aggression in JAMODIs then clam up in the crunch. Brendon and Grant aside, who could say they played that way in the last World Cup either? Not Gup in the big games, either.
I'd love to see us lose the mentality sometimes of overly respecting the best bowler in an opposition side too. We seem to work on a 0-35 mentality against the likes of Tahir, Starc, Indian spinners etc
Grasshopper
State Vice-Captain
It really does feel inevitable. I just hope we go down fighting, and not in another lame-arse capitulation.
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
We failed to make the semis in 1996 (despite an ATG innings by Harris in the 1/4 vs Australia) and in 2003 after not going to Kenya, but this is our worst World Cup since 1987 (when we lost 2 to India, 2 to Australia, and won 2 v Zimbabwe - one luckily) to miss out in pool play. But if you look at our side from 1987 (no Hadlee) it is a pretty mediocre team albeit the nucleus of the 92 side. These guys should be much much better.
1987 World Cup Squad
Jeff Crowe (c)
Stephen Boock
John Bracewell
Ewen Chatfield
Martin Crowe
Andrew Jones
Dipak Patel
Ken Rutherford
Ian Smith (wk)
Martin Snedden
Willie Watson
John Wright
1987 World Cup Squad
Jeff Crowe (c)
Stephen Boock
John Bracewell
Ewen Chatfield
Martin Crowe
Andrew Jones
Dipak Patel
Ken Rutherford
Ian Smith (wk)
Martin Snedden
Willie Watson
John Wright
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
The squad is good enough on paper, but the performances have been shocking. We've lost three (in all likelihood soon to be four games) games in a row for the first time ever in a World Cup.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Watched last night until de Grandhomme's pathetically predictable dismissal and then turned off.
Just a dreadful batting performance. You can see the entire team believes that Kane is the only way they'll make runs, and they're locked in a state of fear about it. From Nicholls decision not to review, to Guptill's frustratingly timid batting, to Taylor's suicidal 2nd run, this was a team that looked like it had no belief in their ability to make runs. To be fair, England's new ball bowling was excellent and chasing 300 down would've been tough for anyone. But as the importance of Kane's wicket has become clearer to everyone it's started to affect even him - he's batting so cautiously that it always puts us behind the game.
The only positive was Latham, who looked wonderfully fluid during his innings. If Taylor hadn't run himself out, I reckon he and Latham could've made a game of it.
Just a dreadful batting performance. You can see the entire team believes that Kane is the only way they'll make runs, and they're locked in a state of fear about it. From Nicholls decision not to review, to Guptill's frustratingly timid batting, to Taylor's suicidal 2nd run, this was a team that looked like it had no belief in their ability to make runs. To be fair, England's new ball bowling was excellent and chasing 300 down would've been tough for anyone. But as the importance of Kane's wicket has become clearer to everyone it's started to affect even him - he's batting so cautiously that it always puts us behind the game.
The only positive was Latham, who looked wonderfully fluid during his innings. If Taylor hadn't run himself out, I reckon he and Latham could've made a game of it.
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straw man
Hall of Fame Member
Just finished watching the highlights - that was garbage. The slices of bad luck like Nicholls and Williamson's dismissals are infuriating but seem fitting given the way the side is playing. We're stuck in the doldrums, don't know whether to attack or defend, how to handle pressure or even how to execute our basic skills any more. Got stage fright and we're not even playing must-wins. Don't know whether we're trying to live up to McCullum's legacy or are hampered by it (e.g. selecting Southee and Munro because those are the players, or types of players, he used).
Would be fitting if we limp out of the tournament after that performance. If we make the semi and god forbid, Williamson is banned for slow over rates, it's going to be a shellacking for the ages.
Would be fitting if we limp out of the tournament after that performance. If we make the semi and god forbid, Williamson is banned for slow over rates, it's going to be a shellacking for the ages.
Howsie
International Captain
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Basically not possible. If Pakistan score 350 batting first they'd need to bowl Bangladesh out for 38 to advance. If Bangladesh bat first it's not even possible at all.
Not that it would be a positive for the side, but in a weird way I think Williamson getting banned would probably help the rest of the batting lineup to bat with a bit more freedom.
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Flem274*
123/5
yea bit disappointed in ross after his cool head was the difference in the bangas choke attempt (until the jammy legside strangle) and the game against i-cant-remember where he and kane stood up.
both kane and ross are playing like guys who feel they have to do it all themselves. that's twice in a row that ross has tried to miracleball after kane goes.
both kane and ross are playing like guys who feel they have to do it all themselves. that's twice in a row that ross has tried to miracleball after kane goes.
Relieved that we actually made the semis. Felt for sure that we'd f***ed it after the Australia game. Now we arguably go into the knockouts with the best possible momentum, beating comfortably two of the other semi-finalists. Whatever happens next, I'm just happy that we're competing with the best now, and have a real chance to go all the way.
Saying that, India (assuming we play them) will be much more up for it this time around. Just hope that we can win two more tosses and bat first. Albeit that I don't think we are as bad a chasing side as our last few attempts have demonstrated.
Saying that, India (assuming we play them) will be much more up for it this time around. Just hope that we can win two more tosses and bat first. Albeit that I don't think we are as bad a chasing side as our last few attempts have demonstrated.
The Hutt Rec
International Vice-Captain
I think where we’re at is we’re a long way behind the top three ... as shown in results over the past two seasons, we were a Ross Taylor ATG innings away from being smashed by all three (and even with that it was a 3-2 loss).
On most days a slight step above the rest.
But we are terrible under pressure like a deciding match of a series, or Champions Trophy, which makes us less likely than the other teams we’ve beaten to the semis to spring an upset on those above us.
These things have been obvious for the last few years, but there’s been no attempt to rectify it in team selections or tactics.
In some ways I’m happy it’s turned out like this, it’s an opportunity to totally revamp the team, bring in a separate coach and even captain for ODIs, and do what England did after 2015. I hope and pray that NZC doesn’t just take this lying down, and strives to win 2023.
On most days a slight step above the rest.
But we are terrible under pressure like a deciding match of a series, or Champions Trophy, which makes us less likely than the other teams we’ve beaten to the semis to spring an upset on those above us.
These things have been obvious for the last few years, but there’s been no attempt to rectify it in team selections or tactics.
In some ways I’m happy it’s turned out like this, it’s an opportunity to totally revamp the team, bring in a separate coach and even captain for ODIs, and do what England did after 2015. I hope and pray that NZC doesn’t just take this lying down, and strives to win 2023.
Ross' dismissal was absolutely inexcusable and you cannot honestly figure out how a guy who has played 100s of international matches cannot judge a single to fine leg. He's not slow like Inzamam was, but keeps coming up with these horrendous decisions. I truly cannot even begin to know why. And we see it every second game.
Has there ever been a batsman in international cricket who wasn't overweight like Inzamam who is as crap at running between the wickets as Ross? Based on stats there's plenty, given Ross doesn't show up in the ODI figures for most run outs nor running someone else, but holy sh*t if you had mix-ups surely he'd be at the top.
Has there ever been a batsman in international cricket who wasn't overweight like Inzamam who is as crap at running between the wickets as Ross? Based on stats there's plenty, given Ross doesn't show up in the ODI figures for most run outs nor running someone else, but holy sh*t if you had mix-ups surely he'd be at the top.
Disagree with the "no attempt to rectify it in team selections or tactics" comment.
You might not like the Hesson / Stead selections or tactics over the last two or three seasons, or you might think that the check-and-adjust process has been to slow, but IMHO there have been some plans to try and compete with Aus / Eng / Ind in 300+ run ODI games. E.g. continued selection of a high-risk high-SR opener (Munro), development of Latham into a middle order innings builder against spin, using 2 hard-hitting batting all-rounders to cover 5th bowling option, selection of a leggie alongside Santner.