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2nd Test at Adelaide - 16 to 20 Dec

Woodster

Woodster

International Captain
SteveNZ said:
To me, that's a cop out. We made the finals of all three formats in a row carrying a core of players across all three formats. Australia never had a problem carrying the world's best tag across formats in the 2000s.

I don't claim to know anything about the ECB and the way it conducts itself, so someone else is going to have to answer that. But their best batsman is able to perform in ODIs and Tests. I'd suggest it has a lot to do with technique - because guys like Burns, the guys on the fringe like Lawrence, Crawley, Sibley, Pope to spin etc, these guys have utterly junk techniques - especially outside off stump They obviously score county runs then can't survive a decent spell of Test cricket. They don't leave well. It's hard to watch
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Your last point there is spot on and indicative of an era that has had a one-day focus drilled down their neck. Even Joe Root doesn’t leave the ball well but gets away with it as he has a wonderfully gifted ability, the others however don’t get away with it. Watch how Labuschagne and Smith bat and they’re still leaving balls when they’re in their 90’s.

We have two types of players generally, the really proactive ones that like to feel bat on ball even when it’s on fifth stump and then those that barely play a shot and dig a hole for themselves but do have patience. Our batting unit looks like a side that is completely conflicted with how they should be batting or how they want to bat.
 
A

Anil

Hall of Fame Member
trundler said:
All you need to know is that Dan Vettoti is a lock in the NZ all time XI.
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yeah i mean fast bowling is great to watch and i love the fact that we now have world class, impactful pacers but dumping on spinners when we have had so many exceptional exponents of the craft throughout cricket's history is just dumb....
 
Spark

Spark

Global Moderator
trundler said:
Root going ton-less for ages almost perfectly coincided with increased ODI world cup in the lead up to the WC IIRC. Even when he did score a ton around that time frame, it was a rapid fire knock. He just lost the ability to bat time and kept falling over to the off side.
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He'll always be a chance of nicking off randomly in Aus simply because of how integral that push square into the offside for a single is to his game everywhere else. Means he's never quite the nailed-on banker that other great batsmen who don't play that shot as much, bowlers who get extra bounce and bowl in the channel will always have a good shot against him in Aus conditions.

A bit weird when you think about it that of the "fab 4", the English guy is the one who doesn't like leaving the ball (well, and Kohli), but it's definitely worked for him this year tbf
 
TheJediBrah

TheJediBrah

Request Your Custom Title Now!
GotSpin said:
Soeaking of which, I don’t mind this new Warner. Really seems to be applying himself rather than popping up a catch from a short arm full shot. Obviously riding his luck a touch but has been putting the effort in
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I think it's a result of him not being anywhere near as good (or just really out of form). In years past he could play his shots scoring a run a ball and still average 60+ at home, I think he's aware that he's not in that place so has to fight harder to find similar success
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Woodster said:
Your last point there is spot on and indicative of an era that has had a one-day focus drilled down their neck. Even Joe Root doesn’t leave the ball well but gets away with it as he has a wonderfully gifted ability, the others however don’t get away with it. Watch how Labuschagne and Smith bat and they’re still leaving balls when they’re in their 90’s.

We have two types of players generally, the really proactive ones that like to feel bat on ball even when it’s on fifth stump and then those that barely play a shot and dig a hole for themselves but do have patience. Our batting unit looks like a side that is completely conflicted with how they should be batting or how they want to bat.
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This is a really good point. Root (x2) and Malan both dismissed slashing/fiddling in the channel with a score behind them in the last two Tests. Malan was seriously loose to Lyon in particular past 50. It's a numbers game - probably why Root has 8 50s and no tons in Australia. Why Malan averages 29 with his talent. It was obvious in Brisbane you had to know where your off stump was, but England were oblivious to the need to leave more on height and line. I think they've tried more in Adelaide but they're not skilled nor trained in doing so.
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Spark said:
He'll always be a chance of nicking off randomly in Aus simply because of how integral that push square into the offside for a single is to his game everywhere else. Means he's never quite the nailed-on banker that other great batsmen who don't play that shot as much, bowlers who get extra bounce and bowl in the channel will always have a good shot against him in Aus conditions.

A bit weird when you think about it that of the "fab 4", the English guy is the one who doesn't like leaving the ball (well, and Kohli), but it's definitely worked for him this year tbf
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To be fair, Williamson does this too. Works very well on our slower, lower decks but he was caught out big style in Australia two years ago and the plan of attack to him with a bit of bounce in the deck is always 4th/5th stump and rising. Kane is not a bad leaver of the ball but definitely more susceptible than Smith, Labuschagne who leave very well.
 
Spark

Spark

Global Moderator
SteveNZ said:
To be fair, Williamson does this too. Works very well on our slower, lower decks but he was caught out big style in Australia two years ago and the plan of attack to him with a bit of bounce in the deck is always 4th/5th stump and rising. Kane is not a bad leaver of the ball but definitely more susceptible than Smith, Labuschagne who leave very well.
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Williamson has had big tours where he's been near-impossible to get out when set, though, unlike Root. Last tour his problem was more that he was totally cooked mentally by Warner and Labuschagne batting for a million years and never got into an innings. Anyone can get out early, it's that Root still looks vulnerable to that particular kind of dismissal against a particular kind of bowler even when set and batting well which is a bit unique.
 
stephen

stephen

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Starfighter said:
I must have confused you with someone else (GAS maybe?)
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Fair enough. I take a very sceptical view towards enforcing the follow on. Even if your bowlers are going to be coming in at an ideal time, generally trying to bat into the same time the next day is going to be better for your wicket taking chances.
 
Bahnz

Bahnz

Hall of Fame Member
Yeah, follow-on is only really worth doing if you're either

a) running out of time due to bad weather; or
b) want to swing your dick about how good you are (a la England in the 4th test of the 2005 Ashes).
 
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