Viv Richards vs steve smith

[capt_Luffy]

My point is that we can recognize advantages and disadvantages of certain modern eras while still arguing for parity for the sake of comparison.

What's your point?

That helmets and bats and whatnot is reasonable to think would improve them. But while comparing across Eras, we literally see no improvement in standard of batting with their implementation into the game. So basically, this whole argument with the finishing words "Viv would eat this SL attack for lunch" (do think this innings is getting overrated by some), reeks off toxic nostalgia and is pretty pointless really.

 

[subshakerz]

This thread is about his peak anyway. People can go talk about his late career, his record against ****ing Bumrah and Joe Root's career elsewhere.

Viv averaged 70 plus on tougher wickets and against Thommo, Lillee, Imran, peak Botham and the Indian spin quartet with a crazy SR for his era.

Smith averaged 70 plus while averaging nearly 100 at home thanks to pancake wickets and attacks. Yes and also a couple of ATG series in India and Eng to be fair.

This isn't close at all. Viv with the greatest peak ever.

 

[subshakerz]

That helmets and bats and whatnot is reasonable to think would improve them. But while comparing across Eras, we literally see no improvement in standard of batting with their implementation into the game. So basically, this whole argument with the finishing words "Viv would eat this SL attack for lunch" (do think this innings is getting overrated by some), reeks off toxic nostalgia and is pretty pointless really.

'Toxic nostalgia' lol get off your soapbox

But in a roundabout way we agree. I am suggesting parity and not giving bonus point for extraneous things that we don't know how others would adjust to.

 

[capt_Luffy]

'Toxic nostalgia' lol get off your soapbox

But in a roundabout way we agree. I am suggesting parity and not giving bonus point for extraneous things that we don't know how others would adjust to.

I am not the one giving Smith a bonus for playing with a helmet since it may had restricted Viv's vision or some ****. And it absolutely ****ing is toxic nostalgia, the whole "back in my day bowlers were fast and batsmen didn't care for a helmet" ****.

 

[subshakerz]

I am not the one giving Smith a bonus for playing with a helmet since it may had restricted Viv's vision or some ****. And it absolutely ****ing is toxic nostalgia, the whole "back in my day bowlers were fast and batsmen didn't care for a helmet" ****.

What are we arguing about exactly?

 

[Kirkut]

Viv averaged 70 plus on tougher wickets and against Thommo, Lillee, Imran, peak Botham and the Indian spin quartet with a crazy SR for his era.

Now that you admit the pitches were tough and batsmen had minimum protection, in that case Bumrah, Rabada and Cummins should be rated above Marshall, Hadlee, Lillee and Imran.

In fact, Kemar Roach would have also averaged 20 if he bowled to batsmen without protection on sporty wickets.

 

[capt_Luffy]

What are we arguing about exactly?

That helmet and bat thing had no significant impact on output over eras hence aren't really interesting to brought up

 

[subshakerz]

That helmet and bat thing had no significant impact on output over eras hence aren't really interesting to brought up

For me they might have, but it's hard to say how modern players would have adjusted hence I don't bring it up.

 

[Johan]

Reckon the reinforced seam of the Kookabura balanced out the bigger bats and boundaries

 

[subshakerz]

Reckon the reinforced seam of the Kookabura balanced out the bigger bats and boundaries

When was that done?

 

[Johan]

When was that done?

2020/21

 

[subshakerz]

2020/21

Yes then.

 

[trundler]

Viv was more destructive and he didn't have the big bats and shorter boundaries plus he played most of his peak cricket before helmets were widely used. Funny this resurfaces when Smith is bashing a minnow attack. What would Viv have done to these rubbish bowlers.?

Probably get bored and sky one to mid wicket. There's a reason Smith has 15 more tons in fewer games

 

[ankitj]

This thread is about his peak anyway. People can go talk about his late career, his record against ****ing Bumrah and Joe Root's career elsewhere.

Yes.

Let's please talk about Imran here.

 

[subshakerz]

Now that you admit the pitches were tough and batsmen had minimum protection, in that case Bumrah, Rabada and Cummins should be rated above Marshall, Hadlee, Lillee and Imran.

Since 2018 pitches have been quite bowling friendly. Don't see why they get extra points. And minimum protection doesn't mean it's easier to get wickets.

 

[kyear2]

Viv was more destructive and he didn't have the big bats and shorter boundaries plus he played most of his peak cricket before helmets were widely used. Funny this resurfaces when Smith is bashing a minnow attack. What would Viv have done to these rubbish bowlers.?

He never quite did get an opportunity against anything of this quality.

Not holding against Smith either obviously.

If anyone is going to replace Viv in an AT in the middle order, it's going to be Smith. Can replace him at 3rd and also slot into 1st for the spinners as well.

These types of tours aren't the ones that's going to elevate him past the master blaster though.

 

[kyear2]

Hence Marshall and Imran can't even be compared with Bumrah and Cummins. I mean, they couldn't deal with those players without helmets, good bats and longer boundaries better, then they would stand no chance now.

Well they both played against players with helmets. Actually Marshall's entire career was played under the helmet era.

And pace, swing and control, is the same today as it was then, and no one did both better Marshall (feel free to dispute) and all the bigger bats in the world doesn't mean a thing if you can't get them off the square with any consistency.

Plus all those advantages didn't seem to help Dev and company much now did it? Couldn't have been that easy then, can it?

 

[kyear2]

Viv averaged 70 plus on tougher wickets and against Thommo, Lillee, Imran, peak Botham and the Indian spin quartet with a crazy SR for his era.

Smith averaged 70 plus while averaging nearly 100 at home thanks to pancake wickets and attacks. Yes and also a couple of ATG series in India and Eng to be fair.

This isn't close at all. Viv with the greatest peak ever.

Pretty straight forward.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Well they both played against players with helmets. Actually Marshall's entire career was played under the helmet era.

And pace, swing and control, is the same today as it was then, and no one did both better Marshall (feel free to dispute) and all the bigger bats in the world doesn't mean a thing if you can't get them off the square with any consistency.

Plus all those advantages didn't seem to help Dev and company much now did it? Couldn't have been that easy then, can it?

Your reading comprehension skills scares me

 

[kyear2]

Your reading comprehension skills scares me

Your generally ignorance and bias scares me, so I guess we're all equal