Has anyone had a worse downfall than Virat in Test cricket?

[Athlai]

A couple of better NZ candidates than Skippy:

Geoff Howarth: first 23 tests averaged 40 with 6 hundreds, last 24 tests averaged 24 with 0 hundreds

Craig McMillan: first 39 tests averaged 44 with 5 hundreds, last 16 tests averaged 24 with 1 hundred.

Neither of those are better candidates

Sinclair: first 13 tests averaged 51.21 with 3 hundreds, last 20 tests averaged 20 with 0 hundreds.

 

[Bahnz]

Sinclair's early career involves too small a sample size for it really to be considered that great a downfall imo, especially when you consider he only passed 50 on one other occasion outside those 3 hundreds, and the third hundred was made on a deck so lifeless that Waqar switched to bowling offies in the second innings.

 

[Athlai]

13 Tests is almost as many as Shane Bond's entire career

 

[BoyBrumby]

Well there's this chap...

 

[Bahnz]

13 Tests is almost as many as Shane Bond's entire career

Probably exactly as many tests once you remove the stat padding performances against club standard Zimbang sides that contributed to the erroneous point of view that Bond was a better bowler than Ewen Chatfield.

 

[Athlai]

Bond was a better bowler than Ewen Chatfield.

Agreed

 

[Gob]

Ponting's was pretty rancid. Doesn't look as bad as virat because he hit his decline in a much more batting friendly era, but if you compare adjusted averages for their respective declines (think punter is after 07?) there fairly close. Botham's also a good shout. Came in as a guy who could bat top 6 and open the bowling and ended as a pre 2024 mitch santner level cricketer.

Edit: Greenidge and viv had pretty notable declines didn't they? May have been haynes and not greenidge.

Ponting was pretty good till 09 Ashes

 

[SteveNZ]

Sinclair's early career involves too small a sample size for it really to be considered that great a downfall imo, especially when you consider he only passed 50 on one other occasion outside those 3 hundreds, and the third hundred was made on a deck so lifeless that Waqar switched to bowling offies in the second innings.

Nah I agree, or at least it's very different than the Virat situation. I wouldn't push back on the argument that he only really played one Test innings of real substance - the 150 in SA. The reason I say Skippy is I saw all three Tests v England in 2008, and he was broken as a cricketer by then. Anyone watching was thinking how did it get to here, where a guy billed as the talent of his generation looked like he was playing with a carrot stick.

 

[AndrewB]

I've mentioned Jack Gregory's career in the forum before:
First year in Test cricket (13 Tests): batting average 48, bowling 57@24, 30 catches
Rest of Test career (11 Tests): batting average 24, bowling 28@44, 7 catches

 

[Coronis]

I've mentioned Jack Gregory's career in the forum before:
First year in Test cricket (13 Tests): batting average 48, bowling 57@24, 30 catches
Rest of Test career (11 Tests): batting average 24, bowling 28@44, 7 catches

I do always remember him being rated highly and I feel I may tend to gloss over him a bit.

One anecdote iirc from a cricket book in my youth was regarding Bradman’s first test - Gregory took 3/141 in the first innings, bowling a mammoth 41 overs dislocated his knee I think? And was in the dressing room with tears saying he was done.

As a slip he was compared to Hammond and he still holds the record for most catches in a series with 15. Held the record for fastest test ton for 64 years and still has the record for fastest in terms of minutes iirc.



Don’t remember if he was voted in the recent allrounders poll but he probably should have been.

 

[capt_Luffy]

I do always remember him being rated highly and I feel I may tend to gloss over him a bit.

One anecdote iirc from a cricket book in my youth was regarding Bradman’s first test - Gregory took 3/141 in the first innings, bowling a mammoth 41 overs dislocated his knee I think? And was in the dressing room with tears saying he was done.

As a slip he was compared to Hammond and he still holds the record for most catches in a series with 15. Held the record for fastest test ton for 64 years and still has the record for fastest in terms of minutes iirc.



Don’t remember if he was voted in the recent allrounders poll but he probably should have been.

He was.

 

[Ali TT]

Neither of those are better candidates

Sinclair: first 13 tests averaged 51.21 with 3 hundreds, last 20 tests averaged 20 with 0 hundreds.

I think this is shifting into examples of pretty mediocre players who had bright but short starts to their career before regressing to the mean.

Whereas Virat Kohli...

 

[Randomfan]

Virat’s downfall is legendary
First 81 Tests : Avg of 55.1 & 26 centuries
Next 41 Tests : Avg of 32 & 4 centuries

Waqar:

His First 25 tests against non-minnows : Avg 20.7 , 11 5-fers
His last 43 tests against non-minnows : Avg 31.6 , 1 5-fer

One 5-fers in 2.2 tests ---------> one 5-fer in 43 tests [ Avg chaging from 20.7 to 31.6 ]

 

[Pavel]

Harry Brook averaged 61 after 23 Tests but finished with a 39 average, those series against India and Australia in '25 really set him back.

 

[ataraxia]

Harry Brook averaged 61 after 23 Tests but finished with a 39 average, those series against India and Australia in '25 really set him back.

Wish I'd said so at the time but I must say I never rated him personally.

 

[Alex0paul]

Rob Quiney

 

[andruid]

Harry Brook averaged 61 after 23 Tests but finished with a 39 average, those series against India and Australia in '25 really set him back.

It was pretty tragic given how, in his early days, he could smack seam and smack spin.

 

[Fanboy375]

Wasn't Botham really really average for like the second half of his career after looking like potentially the greatest all-rounder in history for the first half?

Before age 25 his bowling average was 20.Only Waqar before age 25 can rival him in bowling

 

[ankitj]

Waqar:

His First 25 tests against non-minnows : Avg 20.7 , 11 5-fers
His last 43 tests against non-minnows : Avg 31.6 , 1 5-fer

One 5-fers in 2.2 tests ---------> one 5-fer in 43 tests [ Avg chaging from 20.7 to 31.6 ]

Bowling average of 31.6 is equivalent to 1200/31.6 = 38 batting average (© @h_hurricane). Much better than Kohli in last 5 years.

 

[Fanboy375]

20.7 is goat tier bowling average and 31.6 is average bowling average.But in batting, average of 55 is goat tier and average 32 is below average