Imran Khan vs Curtley Ambrose

[subshakerz]

Of course not. Include it all you want, same way I include the records of all players through all phases of their careers. For example, I'd very much love to ignore Marshall's debut series in 1978 in India I believe when he was part of a 2nd WI team but I can't. I'd love to ignore his series in NZ in 1987 I believe when he was injured but I can't. He showed up on the park, therefore it gets included.

You have to justify why you discount something. It has be extenuating circumstances not just because he did bad.

For example, I discount Warne in WI in 99 because he was clearly not recovered from shoulder injury.

Similar to teen performances or in Imran's case, playing primarily as a bat, in which case I don't count that as his bowling numbers.

 

[Johan]

Based on what?

injuries after injuries, general health, barely playing professional cricket etc etc

 

[subshakerz]

Him not bowling a ball, affects his wpm not his average.

Yes and Kyear to me criticized Imran's WPM in Australia several times.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Competed at home certainly with Qadir.


They aren't random caveats though. For example, in 84 in Aus he was playing as a pure bat, didn't bowl a ball. Does it make sense to include those tests? Etc.

But you cant include wsc and discount 84 and 90 series. If you wish to inculde non test matches then its fair to inculde tests he played in those series

 

[subshakerz]

injuries after injuries, general health, barely playing professional cricket etc etc

Its more of a reflection of his unprofessionalism though.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Yes and Kyear to me criticized Imran's WPM in Australia several times.

Agree his wpm is effected but his average remains same

 

[subshakerz]

But you cant include wsc and discount 84 and 90 series. If you wish to inculde non test matches then its fair to inculde tests he played in those series

84 and 90 he wasn't even a bowler at that point. To me if we are including bowling numbers they should reflect the actual bowler himself.

 

[Sliferxxxx]

Yes and Kyear to me criticized Imran's WPM in Australia several times.

I'm not kyear2. Test bowling for me in terms of importance it goes average then strike rate, econ, then wpm. Wpm is very much a function of bowling competition, team strength etc.

 

[govinda indian fan]

84 and 90 he wasn't even a bowler at that point. To me if we are including bowling numbers they should reflect the actual bowler himself.

Ok but imo wsc numbers should not be included in test stats. They can be added in fc

 

[subshakerz]

I'm not kyear2. Test bowling for me in terms of importance it goes average then strike rate, econ, then wpm. Wpm is very much a function of bowling competition, team strength etc.

Yeah I contextualise WPM with SR but it's still important to know penetration.

 

[Johan]

Its more of a reflection of his unprofessionalism though.

I think his surgeries and injuries contributed more personally, plus He shouldn't have been picked after 86 ashes

 

[govinda indian fan]

84 and 90 he wasn't even a bowler at that point. To me if we are including bowling numbers they should reflect the actual bowler himself.

In 84 injury prevented him but its wrong to say he wasnt a bowler by then. He was lead bowler till 88 wi series

 

[subshakerz]

Ok but imo wsc numbers should not be included in test stats. They can be added in fc

Yeah I disagree because they were the highest standard of cricket in the 70s.

So if someone asks me how Viv or Imran did in Aus I am inclined to incorporate them.

 

[Sliferxxxx]

Yeah I contextualise WPM with SR but it's still important to know penetration.

. Sorry I'm so immature....

 

[subshakerz]

I think his surgeries and injuries contributed more personally, plus He shouldn't have been picked after 86 ashes

I have heard folks use 87 as a cut off. But it's a tricky call.

 

[subshakerz]

. Sorry I'm so immature....

Lol I thought CW was past this sort of stuff

 

[subshakerz]

In 84 injury prevented him but its wrong to say he wasnt a bowler by then. He was lead bowler till 88 wi series

84 was in his shin injury phase between 83 to 85

He was picked just as batsmen and didn't bowl a single delivery. So why include that in his bowling record?

Scored well against Lillee and also topscored in the 83 WC for Pakistan.

 

[govinda indian fan]

Would have been great if Ambrose played 94 series would have been young sachin transfroming into atg vs peak ambrose. What shame he missed also it is unbelievable that best player of spin ever lara played just 3 tests in india. Pity we couldn't see much of him playing here

 

[govinda indian fan]

84 was in his shin injury phase between 83 to 85

He was picked just as batsmen and didn't bowl a single delivery. So why include that in his bowling record?

Scored well against Lillee and also topscored in the 83 WC for Pakistan.

Ok it shows imran is just behind sobers as greatest all rounder

 

[DrWolverine]

What shame he missed also it is unbelievable that best player of spin ever lara played just 3 tests in india.

Lara averaged 34 against India in 14 Tests in WI.
The best player of spin ever would most likely have averaged less if he played more against Ind in Ind.