Jacques Kallis vs Ricky Ponting

[subshakerz]

Ponting was consistently better at the start. Kallis was consistently better at the end. Neither was consistently better in the middle. Both had great patches and were better and worse at times, but posting extremely similar numbers from 99-08.

Kallis was never rated ahead of Ponting as a bat in the middle despite his numbers, because Ponting was just more dominant in how he played so it wasn't just his numbers.

It's only when Pontings form dropped that Kallis name came ahead in that period.

 

[Bolo.]

Kallis was never rated ahead of Ponting as a bat in the middle despite his numbers, because Ponting was just more dominant in how he played so it wasn't just his numbers.

It's only when Pontings form dropped that Kallis name came ahead in that period.

Sure. Good start + great middle is > poor start + great middle.

But, similarly, great end + great middle is > poor end + great middle.

 

[subshakerz]

Sure. Good start + great middle is > poor start + great middle.

But, similarly, great end + great middle is > poor end + great middle.

In statistical terms yes.

But that ignores how Kallis played and how he was rated, especially in his middle. The quality of his runs over a stretch is simply not the quality of the runs Ponting had.

 

[Bolo.]

In statistical terms yes.

But that ignores how Kallis played and how he was rated, especially in his middle. The quality of his runs over a stretch is simply not the quality of the runs Ponting had.

Unless you are about to start singing Ashwin's praises, much tougher home pitches and a much better away record have more than a little impact on quality of performances.

 

[subshakerz]

Unless you are about to start singing Ashwin's praises, much tougher home pitches and a much better away record have more than a little impact on quality of performances.

First off, Kallis doesn't have a much better away record. Ponting has a problem in India, Kallis is sub par in SL and Eng. They both did well outside of that.

Kallis record at home is his biggest USP.

But he lacked the ability to dominate attacks for much of his career.

 

[centurymaker]

Kallis avgs 33 at home vs Australia.
(14 Tests)

The closest thing to facing a South African bowling attack in South Africa is facing an Australian pace attack. Kallis didn't have to face his own pace bowlers, so his real test in home conditions was against Australia. And he didn't have success.

 

[Johan]

Kallis's home record is a little padded but Punter's home record is also massively padded.

 

[subshakerz]

Kallis's home record is a little padded but Punter's home record is also massively padded.

And Kallis played minnow more.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

Maybe in 25 years, Kallis will be winning this comparison/poll

 

[sayon basak]

Maybe in 25 years, Kallis will be winning this comparison/poll

So you are saying Kallis will gain five more voters in 25 years?

 

[centurymaker]

He retired in 2013 right before Australia were due to tour. And South Africa went on to lose the series at home. I can't imagine any champion cricketer retiring right before such a big series. Aus v SA rivalry was huge around that time.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

So you are saying Kallis will gain five more voters in 25 years?

Yea

What I meant though is that we run this poll again in 25 years, Kallis might win

 

[Johan]

Jack will be remembered as Barrington.

 

[subshakerz]

He retired in 2013 right before Australia were due to tour. And South Africa went on to lose the series at home. I can't imagine any champion cricketer retiring right before such a big series. Aus v SA rivalry was huge around that time.

Yeah massive let down from Kallis. They needed him. Instead you had a piss poor McLaren being pulverized by Johnson. Smith at least retired after the Aus series.

 

[centurymaker]

So you are saying Kallis will gain five more voters in 25 years?

Newer generations will just look at raw figures without context and hail him as king, even though he wasn't.

 

[sayon basak]

Yea

What I meant though is that we run this poll again in 25 years, Kallis might win

It'll be fun to see how Younis Khan will be rated, he is very under-mentioned cricketer outside CW in general.

 

[Johan]

TBH, doesn't happen with a lot of the older guys.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

It'll be fun to see how Younis Khan will be rated, he is very under-mentioned cricketer outside CW in general.

Tbh most people outside of CW don’t care much about rating/comparing players that they haven’t seen. That’s mostly for people on online forums.

I don’t think Younis’s rating will change much here. He is rated Dravid level here.

 

[Johan]

Tbh most people outside of CW don’t care much about rating/comparing players that they haven’t seen. That’s mostly for people on online forums.

I don’t think Younis’s rating will change much here. He is rated Dravid level here.

Dravid won their thread pretty comfortably

 

[sayon basak]

TBH, doesn't happen with a lot of the older guys.

I mean, in CW it's really true that pretty numbers is not enough to rate someone high, but outside CW it might be a completely different scenario.