Warne vs Gavaskar

[capt_Luffy]

Hutton might be > Viv tbh

He is. The 50s were quite tough for batting.

 

[Johan]

He is. The 50s were quite tough for batting.

tbh at this point I'm starting to think my 3-6 is virtually equal with gaps so small that I've to work to even point out why one is quantitatively better, while it's easy for me to point out why 3-6 is superior to 7-8 (Smith and Lara.)

 

[capt_Luffy]

tbh at this point I'm starting to think my 3-6 is virtually equal with gaps so small that I've to work to even point out why one is quantitatively better, while it's easy for me to point out why 3-6 is superior to 7-8 (Smith and Lara.)

Smith and Lara> Richards

Also think Tendulkar is practically equal with Hobbs/very close. I will say 4-9 for me are very close.

 

[Coronis]

Yeah makes sense. Do you rank Hammond ahead of them?

Yes.

 

[Johan]

Smith and Lara> Richards

Also think Tendulkar is practically equal with Hobbs/very close. I will say 4-9 for me are very close.

Personally disagree, and no, you can't disagree with my disagreement or reject my rejection.

 

[DrWolverine]

Smith and Lara> Richards

What’s your reasoning for Lara > Richards?

 

[Johan]

Luffy hates Viv fans

 

[subshakerz]

Luffy hates Viv fans

Viv is solidly top tier.

 

[Johan]

Viv is solidly top tier.

Oh he is, the batting equivalent of McGrath for me combined with Warne's entertainment value.

 

[subshakerz]

Oh he is, the batting equivalent of McGrath for me combined with Warne's entertainment value.

Viv had an ATG peak and ended up with worldclass well rounded numbers while having an unbelievable SR and no peer close to his rep.

I only have him behind Bradman, Tendulkar, Hobbs*, and Sobers.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Luffy hates Viv fans

I hate Viv fans but not Viv himself. I do think he gets sometimes a bit overrated for his splendid peak, but I feel his output outside of it wasn't as exceptional as some others. Also think that people sometimes goes way overboard on bowlers he faced (which he did better than most) and ignores that he never faced the greatest challenge of his era, even in WSC. Still an absolute genius, the best player of pace at his peak and a top tier ATG, above whom I will only place Don, Hobbs and Sachin as sure shots. Also the ODI GoAT easily.

 

[capt_Luffy]

What’s your reasoning for Lara > Richards?

Viv is rated so highly more for his high ceiling and peak series than anything else. Lara had the higher ceiling and even better series.

 

[Johan]

Viv had an ATG peak and unlike Waqar and Botham ended up with worldclass well rounded numbers while having an unbelievable SR and no peer close to his rep.

I only have him behind Bradman, Tendulkar, Hobbs*, and Sobers.

I have him above Sobers personally

 

[subshakerz]

I have him above Sobers personally

It's touch and go between Sobers and him but I think Sobers as a bat had a slightly better rep.

 

[subshakerz]

Viv is rated so highly more for his high ceiling and peak series than anything else. Lara had the higher ceiling and even better series.

Lara had an outright weakness against high quality pace in his game.

Viv and the other top tiers didn't have weaknesses in their games per se.

 

[capt_Luffy]

It's touch and go between Sobers and him but I think Sobers as a bat had a slightly better rep.

I am sorry but rep is the last thing you bring in against Viv. That's applicable for every batter, but especially Sobers who for as late as 65 was seen as Kanhai's equal by many and since then many rated Graeme Pollock higher.

 

[capt_Luffy]

Lara had an outright weakness against high quality pace in his game.

Viv and the other top tiers didn't have weaknesses in their games per se.

I don't think Lara had a weakness nearly as significant as you make it. You have gone on and on about it enough with Slifer.

 

[subshakerz]

I am sorry but rep is the last thing you bring in against Viv. That's applicable for every batter, but especially Sobers who for as late as 65 was seen as Kanhai's equal by many and since then many rated Graeme Pollock higher.

I get that. Maybe I feel a sense of seniority of Sobers over Viv but it's incredibly close and I sometimes think Viv can be ahead.

 

[Johan]

I hate Viv fans but not Viv himself. I do think he gets sometimes a bit overrated for his splendid peak, but I feel his output outside of it wasn't as exceptional as some others. Also think that people sometimes goes way overboard on bowlers he faced (which he did better than most) and ignores that he never faced the greatest challenge of his era, even in WSC. Still an absolute genius, the best player of pace at his peak and a top tier ATG, above whom I will only place Don, Hobbs and Sachin as sure shots. Also the ODI GoAT easily.

I do think him not having faced Windies pacers is a bit tragic but he is definitely imo the greatest player of pace, The greatest of modern era alongside Tendulkar for me, Elite ATG in Australia and the best to visit Aus in modern era (alongside Tendu), probably the GOAT tourist of England, has an elite ATG tour of Pakistan and a decent one, did very well in India and so forth. I think his lack of output issues are a bit overstated tbh.

 

[subshakerz]

I don't think Lara had a weakness nearly as significant as you make it. You have gone on and on about it enough with Slifer.

I think it was significant. I don't recall the other top tiers getting repeatedly owned across a series by great pacers like Lara was against Donald 98, 2Ws in 97 and even McGrath 96, though McGrath didn't beat him with pace but by exploiting his technical chink. Repeatedly losing your wicket to a top pacer while in your prime is a problem.

I prefer top tiers who are more bullet proof even if they don't have Lara's highs.